F-35 Cancelled, then what ?

[LowObservable]

Sssh - It's all classified. In order to cover the deployment to Korea of a JSF equipped with the dilithium-crystal-powered CommieMarmelizerTM, they faked an emergency landing in Lubbock three weeks ago.

How do we know? Because it is clearly impossible that such a mature, highly developed Gen5, C5ISR, integrated warfighting enabler would be unable to get its fat rear end out of a civilian airport under its own power for three weeks...

Faulty F-35 Stuck in Lubbock Since March 11

[JSFfan]

Hey, at least it had a warning light to land








The crew of a Su-30 fighter that crashed earlier on Tuesday in Russia’s Far East reported an engine fire before the crash, a spokesman for the Main Military Investigative Directorate said.

The Su-30MK2 fighter jet crashed 130 km northeast of Komsomolsk-na-Amure during a post-construction test flight. Both pilots ejected safely, although one of them was hurt on landing.

“While executing acceleration to a maximum speed, the first pilot reported a fire in the right engine,” the spokesman said. “The flight controller immediately ordered the crew to eject.”

[TBM-Legend]

First Aust fighter aircraft in production
BY:MAX BLENKIN, AAP DEFENCE CORRESPONDENT From: AAP April 03, 2013 3:52PM

[Cancelled eh? Still seem to be building 'em!}

AUSTRALIA'S first two F-35 Joint Strike Fighter (JSF) aircraft are progressing down the US production line and approaching the stage where they will be recognisably aircraft rather than a collection of components.

David Scott, Lockheed Martin's director of F-35 international customer engagement, said the two, designated AU-1 and AU-2, were on schedule for delivery in the US in 2014.

He said the wings were under construction at the Lockheed Martin plant in Forth Worth, Texas.

Forth Worth is also constructing the forward fuselage, while the centre and aft fuselages are under construction at separate Northrop Grumman and BAE plants.

"Those two airplanes will come together through the mate-and-delivery process and be delivered to the Commonwealth in the middle of next year," he said.

[Mach Two]

JSFf, what was the relevance of the bit about the Su-30 here? Did I miss something?

[Darren_P]

JSFf, what was the relevance of the bit about the Su-30 here? Did I miss something?

Perhaps the Su-30 heard about its invisible supercruising potential adversary with a 6:1 kill ratio and topped itself on first flight.

[Courtney Mil]

That must be it, Darren!

I did find something interesting from a while back in LM's photo archive. A photo of the F-35 in which it doesn't look ugly!!! Actually a very cool photo.

[Mach Two]

Right, Darren_P. Unfortunately, it died in vain then, given that it can't supercuise, is only stealthy in the right waveband and the 6:1 kill ratio was in a simulation scenario constructed using the stage 2 (updated) design performance figures, nothing to do with the real aircraft. It also had the F-35s playing as Blue Air, so they had all the support assets (AWACS and so forth) and were close enough to base not to have to worry about fuel. It was all a bit lop-sided, if I'm honest.

Nice picture there!

[eaglemmoomin]

Ah that'll be because it's one of ours. The plane looks much better from some angles than others.

[LowObservable]

True. For instance, Su-35 pilots like this view...

[Rulebreaker]

Notice for possible sale to Korea of 60 f15s. 2.4b dollars

http://www.dsca.mil/pressreleases/36...orea_13-11.pdf

Notice for possible sale of 60 f35s. 10.8b dollars

http://www.dsca.mil/pressreleases/36...orea_13-10.pdf

I'm having some difficulty understanding the price difference here I assume they cover roughly the same sort thing. F35 better be bloody gd at that price

[Courtney Mil]

The F-15 package looks like a very good deal. Proven technology and a complete, supportable package. Actually quite a good deal for both partners, including some interoperability with certain of their close neighbours.

The F-35 package doesn't, as you say, Rulebreaker, look anywhere near as inviting. Looking at the list of included equipment, I wonder why they don't specifcally mention a radar. I'm not sure that this over-priced, under-performing techno-marvel is really what ROK actually need, given their location, likely adversaries and likely future ops.

[WhiteOvies]

Depends a bit on what's left of the North Koreans IADS if the current escalation continues!

Japan is planning on buying F-35, maybe that will be enough to convince the Koreans....

ZM136 (BK-2) did indeed look good at the acceptance ceremony for ZM135 (BK-1)! LM certainly know how to stage a PR event!

[Courtney Mil]

Originally Posted by WhiteOlives

Depends a bit on what's left of the North Koreans IADS if the current escalation continues!

Depends how the "stealth" works against their ground-based radars - not in the optimized band. And remember it was downgraded from 'very low observable' to just 'low observable' years ago.

Originally Posted by WhiteOlives

Japan is planning on buying F-35

Except they threatened to cancel their buy altogether if the price went up. More likely that Japan NOT buying F-35 will influence ROK in the same direction.

I can see how the fully up-to-spec (original spec, not the one we have now after coutless downgrades) would have been an appropriate platform for a lot of scenarios (including our own), but I'm yet to be convinced that it's what ROK needs.

[peter we]

I'm having some difficulty understanding the price difference here I assume they cover roughly the same sort thing.

Its a gift, the price should be over $100million each. I assume they will deliver next week, complete with aircrew and a new paint job.

Look how much the Saudis had to pay

BBC News - US sells $30bn in F-15 jets to Saudi Arabia

[PhilipG]

Notice for possible sale to Korea of 60 f15s. 2.4b dollars

http://www.dsca.mil/pressreleases/36...orea_13-11.pdf

Notice for possible sale of 60 f35s. 10.8b dollars

http://www.dsca.mil/pressreleases/36...orea_13-10.pdf

I'm having some difficulty understanding the price difference here I assume they cover roughly the same sort thing. F35 better be bloody gd at that price

I think that the major difference in the prices is taht the F15 airframe etc is not included in the $2.4Bn, it is notice of sale of high end technology to put on the F15s that are being bought under a different contract.

[BUCC09]

Shredding Services for F-35 Program Office (JPO)

•JPO 4th floor 4 consoles
•JPO 5th floor 5 consoles
•JPO 6th floor 4 consoles
•JPO 10th floor 2 consoles
•JPO 11th floor 1 console
•JPO 14th floor 4 consoles
•Century 1 8th floor 5 consoles
•Polk (NC2) 4th floor 3 consoles
•Polk (NC2) 5th floor 3 consoles

Thirty one shredding machines in F-35 Program Offices from the fourth floor, up to the fourteenth floor. That is a lot of consoles.
Given the current state of the Joint Strike Fighter Program, it seems international partners engaged with this project will need
all the consolation they can get.

[Courtney Mil]

Absolutely right, PG, as the notice of potential sale clearly says. But F-15 airframes aren't very expensive and it fits well with their F-15Ks and their F-X programme. The inventory included in that proposed sale includes a lot of good kit.

[Courtney Mil]

Just seen the shredder post. 31 does make it look like they have a lot of secrets to keep. But then you would hope so with such a programme. As you imply (or do I infer?), I wonder how many secrets are for keeping from the enemy and how many from the potential customers.

[Rulebreaker]

PhilpG

Thanks. I would however agree with Courtney Mil the airframe can't be that expensive as the fms covers most of the rest of what you need for it. F35 was supposed to be as cheap as an f16 at one point wasn't it?

[Courtney Mil]

This is really off the top of my head now, but the Japanese F-15s were built in Japan, by the Japanese, under license. The license cost the same as the price of an F-15, I THINK, $1,000,000 each.