F-35 Cancelled, then what ?
The knives are out for the next session in Congress. The following is from the National Review - about as close as the neocons have to a house magazine.
F-35 -- Donald Trump Should Cancel the Failed F-35 Fighter Jet Program | National Review
F-35 -- Donald Trump Should Cancel the Failed F-35 Fighter Jet Program | National Review
Actually some pretty good points in there, especially about flawed requirements, the true costs & "IOC" we have been slogging about in this thread. I do believe the "hurry up and buy more of these things" is a pretty big ploy to get firmly past the "too big to fail threshold". But if anyone can rock the corporate world, it seems President elect Trump has and will. Must be some long nights in some corporate board rooms....
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: USA
Posts: 601
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The knives are out for the next session in Congress. The following is from the National Review - about as close as the neocons have to a house magazine.
F-35 -- Donald Trump Should Cancel the Failed F-35 Fighter Jet Program | National Review
F-35 -- Donald Trump Should Cancel the Failed F-35 Fighter Jet Program | National Review
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
In case you didn't notice, National Review made a concerted effort to prevent Trump from being elected President.
I don't think so.
For further reading, see The Pentagon Paradox which was an attempt to excoriate the F-18 program. The Hornet survived and has done well enough. I read that book a couple of years after it came out. An interesting read, in particular its critique of the acquisition process.
That process hasn't gotten much better over the years, as entwined as it is in politics and spreading out federal funds to many districts. F-35, IIRC, has production among contractors and subs in over 100 districts. I am pretty sure that this was a deliberate decision at least on the Congressional side. A little something for everyone, more or less - everyone gets a share. (Milo Minderbender, Catch-22).
For further reading, see The Pentagon Paradox which was an attempt to excoriate the F-18 program. The Hornet survived and has done well enough. I read that book a couple of years after it came out. An interesting read, in particular its critique of the acquisition process.
That process hasn't gotten much better over the years, as entwined as it is in politics and spreading out federal funds to many districts. F-35, IIRC, has production among contractors and subs in over 100 districts. I am pretty sure that this was a deliberate decision at least on the Congressional side. A little something for everyone, more or less - everyone gets a share. (Milo Minderbender, Catch-22).
Last edited by Lonewolf_50; 10th Jan 2017 at 16:50.
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Middle America
Age: 84
Posts: 1,167
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Original Quote by Lonewolf _50: I don't think so.
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Australia OZ
Age: 75
Posts: 2,577
Likes: 0
Received 52 Likes
on
45 Posts
Lord LuvAduck spews 62 pages about the F-35 - Gilmore needs an ANTIdote - but hey:
http://www.dote.osd.mil/pub/reports/...2016f35jsf.pdf (0.9Mb)
Do I need to quote anything? Youse knows it all already so no cutee/pastie.
http://www.dote.osd.mil/pub/reports/...2016f35jsf.pdf (0.9Mb)
Do I need to quote anything? Youse knows it all already so no cutee/pastie.
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
First F-35B Squadron Moves to Japan
WASHINGTON — A Marine Corps F-35B squadron has transferred from the United States to Marine Corps Air Station Iwakuni in Japan, marking the first permanent international deployment of the joint strike fighter, the service announced Tuesday.
Marine Corps spokesman Capt Kurt Stahl told Defense News that 10 F-35Bs from Marine Fighter Attack Squadron 121 (VMFA-121) departed Marine Corps Air Station Yuma in Arizona on Monday, with the first jets slated to arrive in Japan on Wednesday. All 10 F-35s will arrive at Iwakuni by Thursday. Eventually, an additional six jets will be relocated from Yuma to Iwakuni, bringing the squadron up to a full 16 aircraft. VMFA-121 is a part of the 3rd Marine Aircraft Wing.........
WASHINGTON — A Marine Corps F-35B squadron has transferred from the United States to Marine Corps Air Station Iwakuni in Japan, marking the first permanent international deployment of the joint strike fighter, the service announced Tuesday.
Marine Corps spokesman Capt Kurt Stahl told Defense News that 10 F-35Bs from Marine Fighter Attack Squadron 121 (VMFA-121) departed Marine Corps Air Station Yuma in Arizona on Monday, with the first jets slated to arrive in Japan on Wednesday. All 10 F-35s will arrive at Iwakuni by Thursday. Eventually, an additional six jets will be relocated from Yuma to Iwakuni, bringing the squadron up to a full 16 aircraft. VMFA-121 is a part of the 3rd Marine Aircraft Wing.........
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
Lord LuvAduck spews 62 pages about the F-35
You mean the Director of the Operational Test and Evaluation Directorate of the United States Department of Defense annual report to Congress on the F-35 program?
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
Since you were making an as hominem attack on the gentleman in question - plus making a preemptive attempt to stop discussion of this year's paper I consider d it need to be said.
It obviously got under your skin - must contain some seriously adverse comment on the program. Obviously worth everyone reading and discussing.
......The Defense Department’s F-35 program office “has no plan to adequately fix and verify hundreds of these deficiencies using flight testing within its currently planned schedule and resources,” Gilmore wrote. Deploying F-35s “with capable mission systems is critical to our national security,” but the program now “is at high risk of sacrificing essential combat performance,” he added..........
It obviously got under your skin - must contain some seriously adverse comment on the program. Obviously worth everyone reading and discussing.
......The Defense Department’s F-35 program office “has no plan to adequately fix and verify hundreds of these deficiencies using flight testing within its currently planned schedule and resources,” Gilmore wrote. Deploying F-35s “with capable mission systems is critical to our national security,” but the program now “is at high risk of sacrificing essential combat performance,” he added..........
Administrator
within its currently planned schedule and resources,”
This appears to be code for "{the program says} give us more money to get those tests done in a more timely manner." ORAC, is that how it came across to you?
I think most of us are aware that full mission systems testing can get expensive.
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
When it fails to meet the specification, it's not our fault, you should have given us more money.
When it proves unable to perform essential operational tasks, it's not our fault and it's to late now, so change the spec to meet what you've got.
Did we say it's not our fault and we need more money?
When it proves unable to perform essential operational tasks, it's not our fault and it's to late now, so change the spec to meet what you've got.
Did we say it's not our fault and we need more money?
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: London, New York, Paris, Moscow.
Posts: 3,632
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Shares of Lockheed Martin, the maker of the F-35 fighter jet, are falling after President-elect Donald Trump attacked the cost of the program during his press conference on Wednesday.
http://uk.businessinsider.com/lockhe...17-1?r=US&IR=T
http://uk.businessinsider.com/lockhe...17-1?r=US&IR=T
Last edited by glad rag; 12th Jan 2017 at 13:47.
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
SHOCK!! HORROR!! SURPRISE!!
Who'da thunk or forecast it........
F-35 delayed — again — despite CEO's promise to Trump
The F-35 will be delayed an additional seven months at a cost of at least $500 million despite a recent promise from Lockheed Martin's CEO to drive down costs, the chairman of the Senate Armed Services Committee said Tuesday.
Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., in a statement, said the CEO's personal promise to President-elect Trump was "surprising" given a letter he received from the Pentagon last month detailing the latest delay. "This is yet another troubling sign for a program that has already nearly doubled in cost, taken nearly two decades to field, and has long been the poster child for acquisition malpractice," McCain said.
After trashing the program's rising costs on Twitter, Trump met with Lockheed Martin CEO Marillyn Hewson in late December, when she offered her "personal commitment" to "aggressively" drive down the cost of the most expensive acquisition project ever undertaken by the Pentagon. But if she intends to do that, McCain said she had better be ready to explain how. "If Lockheed Martin believes it is possible to aggressively drive down the cost of the F-35, it is time for the company to reveal its plans to do so to the Congress and to American taxpayers," he said.
The seven-month delay means the system development and demonstration phase of the program won't be completed until May 2018, according to a letter Frank Kendall, the acquisition, technology and logistics undersecretary, sent to McCain. McCain said the delay just shows the need to further reform the acquisition process, something he intends to focus on as chairman of the Senate Armed Services Committee.
Who'da thunk or forecast it........
F-35 delayed — again — despite CEO's promise to Trump
The F-35 will be delayed an additional seven months at a cost of at least $500 million despite a recent promise from Lockheed Martin's CEO to drive down costs, the chairman of the Senate Armed Services Committee said Tuesday.
Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., in a statement, said the CEO's personal promise to President-elect Trump was "surprising" given a letter he received from the Pentagon last month detailing the latest delay. "This is yet another troubling sign for a program that has already nearly doubled in cost, taken nearly two decades to field, and has long been the poster child for acquisition malpractice," McCain said.
After trashing the program's rising costs on Twitter, Trump met with Lockheed Martin CEO Marillyn Hewson in late December, when she offered her "personal commitment" to "aggressively" drive down the cost of the most expensive acquisition project ever undertaken by the Pentagon. But if she intends to do that, McCain said she had better be ready to explain how. "If Lockheed Martin believes it is possible to aggressively drive down the cost of the F-35, it is time for the company to reveal its plans to do so to the Congress and to American taxpayers," he said.
The seven-month delay means the system development and demonstration phase of the program won't be completed until May 2018, according to a letter Frank Kendall, the acquisition, technology and logistics undersecretary, sent to McCain. McCain said the delay just shows the need to further reform the acquisition process, something he intends to focus on as chairman of the Senate Armed Services Committee.
Last edited by ORAC; 12th Jan 2017 at 10:58.
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: London, New York, Paris, Moscow.
Posts: 3,632
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
SHOCK!! HORROR!! SURPRISE!!
Who'da thunk or forecast it........
F-35 delayed — again — despite CEO's promise to Trump
The F-35 will be delayed an additional seven months at a cost of at least $500 million despite a recent promise from Lockheed Martin's CEO to drive down costs, the chairman of the Senate Armed Services Committee said Tuesday.
Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., in a statement, said the CEO's personal promise to President-elect Trump was "surprising" given a letter he received from the Pentagon last month detailing the latest delay. "This is yet another troubling sign for a program that has already nearly doubled in cost, taken nearly two decades to field, and has long been the poster child for acquisition malpractice," McCain said.
After trashing the program's rising costs on Twitter, Trump met with Lockheed Martin CEO Marillyn Hewson in late December, when she offered her "personal commitment" to "aggressively" drive down the cost of the most expensive acquisition project ever undertaken by the Pentagon. But if she intends to do that, McCain said she had better be ready to explain how. "If Lockheed Martin believes it is possible to aggressively drive down the cost of the F-35, it is time for the company to reveal its plans to do so to the Congress and to American taxpayers," he said.
The seven-month delay means the system development and demonstration phase of the program won't be completed until May 2018, according to a letter Frank Kendall, the acquisition, technology and logistics undersecretary, sent to McCain. McCain said the delay just shows the need to further reform the acquisition process, something he intends to focus on as chairman of the Senate Armed Services Committee.
Who'da thunk or forecast it........
F-35 delayed — again — despite CEO's promise to Trump
The F-35 will be delayed an additional seven months at a cost of at least $500 million despite a recent promise from Lockheed Martin's CEO to drive down costs, the chairman of the Senate Armed Services Committee said Tuesday.
Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., in a statement, said the CEO's personal promise to President-elect Trump was "surprising" given a letter he received from the Pentagon last month detailing the latest delay. "This is yet another troubling sign for a program that has already nearly doubled in cost, taken nearly two decades to field, and has long been the poster child for acquisition malpractice," McCain said.
After trashing the program's rising costs on Twitter, Trump met with Lockheed Martin CEO Marillyn Hewson in late December, when she offered her "personal commitment" to "aggressively" drive down the cost of the most expensive acquisition project ever undertaken by the Pentagon. But if she intends to do that, McCain said she had better be ready to explain how. "If Lockheed Martin believes it is possible to aggressively drive down the cost of the F-35, it is time for the company to reveal its plans to do so to the Congress and to American taxpayers," he said.
The seven-month delay means the system development and demonstration phase of the program won't be completed until May 2018, according to a letter Frank Kendall, the acquisition, technology and logistics undersecretary, sent to McCain. McCain said the delay just shows the need to further reform the acquisition process, something he intends to focus on as chairman of the Senate Armed Services Committee.
http://www.npr.org/2017/01/11/509137239/watch-live-trump-holds-first-press-conference-as-president-elect
"I'm very much involved with the generals and admirals on the airplane, the F-35 you’ve been reading about it.
And it’s way, way behind schedule and many billions of dollars over budget.
I don't like that.
And the admirals have been fantastic. The generals have been fantastic. I've really gotten to know them well.
And we’re going to do some big things on the F-35 program and perhaps the F-18 program.
And we’re going to get those costs way down, and we’re gonna get the plane to be even better and we’re going to have to some competition.
And it’s going to be a beautiful thing. "
Wow never realised the Donald was a hippy at heart...man..
Last edited by glad rag; 12th Jan 2017 at 13:49. Reason: reference corrected