F-35 Cancelled, then what ?
It's a bit late in the game to be discovering fundamental problems. (They are there, but known about, and at least don't inhibit flight.) On the other hand, reliability issues are a 
and it can take a long time and a lot of investment to sort them out and bring operating costs under control.
and it can take a long time and a lot of investment to sort them out and bring operating costs under control.
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with it's turning radius I suppose you could probably hear it back in Lot!!
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rh200 Quote:
Very true. In fact, it happened on one of the first F-18s on its way to the Farnborough Air Show years ago. A turbine disk (disc) failed in one F404 engine that had been made using a newly developed powder metallurgy process. Contamination that entered the manufacturing process caused defects not detected during normal inspection processes. The problem was solved and both engine and airplane went on to become a success.
So what where saying is, it looks as if instead of being a fundamental problem with the aircraft, its a engine or component QA problem. Wouldn't be the first time, won't be the last.
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Engine Fire Delays F-35 Transatlantic Flight AIN Defense Perspective » July 4, 2014 Chris Pocock
http://www.ainonline.com/aviation-ne...tlantic-flight
Lockheed Martin F-35 Fighter International Debut Preview - AINtv [Good VL WASP Views in Video]
"...the stealth jet will not be appearing in the flying display at Farnborough on two of the trade days there—Wednesday and Thursday, July 16 and 17... those days have been allocated for aircraft maintenance, he said...."
Lockheed Martin F-35 Fighter International Debut Preview - AINtv [Good VL WASP Views in Video]
Last edited by SpazSinbad; 3rd Jul 2014 at 21:16. Reason: URL
Nice video at that link. Gutted about missing the trade days. Let's hope they make the signing day; I can just imagine the outcry if he has to sign with the jet AWOL. Not that it can stop the signing.
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F-35 Fleet Grounded: Air Show Flights May Still Happen 03 Jul 2014 Colin Clark
F-35 Fleet Grounded: Air Show Flights May Still Happen « Breaking Defense - Defense industry news, analysis and commentary
"...UPDATE One decision has finally been made. Late Thursday evening the Office of Secretary of Defense announced that the F-35 fleet was officially grounded. That’s right. Both OSD and the Joint Program Office used the term grounded, meaning the fleet will not fly until further notice and the causes of the fire have been found and ameliorating actions recommended.
“The technical air worthiness authorities of the Department of the Air Force and Department of the Navy have issued a directive to ground the F-35 fleet based on initial findings from the runway fire incident that occurred at Eglin Air Force Base on Monday, June 23. The root cause of the incident remains under investigation. Additional inspections of F-35 engines have been ordered, and return to flight will be determined based on inspection results and analysis of engineering data,” the release says.
The Joint Program Office release says teams searching for a cause of the June 23 fire “have been unable to pinpoint the precise cause of the malfunction.” The head of the F-35 program. Air Force Lt. Gen. Chris Bogdan release, said his people ”aim to do what is prudent for the Enterprise at large without compromising the ongoing mishap investigation.” That language about compromising the investigation is a clear sign of the political sensitivities of the investigation. UPDATE ENDS..."
“The technical air worthiness authorities of the Department of the Air Force and Department of the Navy have issued a directive to ground the F-35 fleet based on initial findings from the runway fire incident that occurred at Eglin Air Force Base on Monday, June 23. The root cause of the incident remains under investigation. Additional inspections of F-35 engines have been ordered, and return to flight will be determined based on inspection results and analysis of engineering data,” the release says.
The Joint Program Office release says teams searching for a cause of the June 23 fire “have been unable to pinpoint the precise cause of the malfunction.” The head of the F-35 program. Air Force Lt. Gen. Chris Bogdan release, said his people ”aim to do what is prudent for the Enterprise at large without compromising the ongoing mishap investigation.” That language about compromising the investigation is a clear sign of the political sensitivities of the investigation. UPDATE ENDS..."
Last edited by SpazSinbad; 4th Jul 2014 at 01:22. Reason: frm
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OK, so who here claims naming copyright?
U.K. Enthusiasts On F-35 #davewatch | Ares
But with the apparent delay for the aircraft setting off from the U.S. East Coast, a handful of enthusiasts have taken to social media looking for any information, and the hashtag #davewatch has been adopted.
Why #davewatch? Well, Dave –- as in short for David -– has become something of an unofficial nickname for the F-35 in the U.K.
It was prompted by a 2006 topic thread on the well-known aviation forum PPRuNe. While there were variety of names suggested, including some that were rather distasteful, the name Dave just seemed to stick, perhaps alluding to the fact that David/Dave is a common name in the U.K. and that the aircraft is likely to be a common sight in the coming years.
Why #davewatch? Well, Dave –- as in short for David -– has become something of an unofficial nickname for the F-35 in the U.K.
It was prompted by a 2006 topic thread on the well-known aviation forum PPRuNe. While there were variety of names suggested, including some that were rather distasteful, the name Dave just seemed to stick, perhaps alluding to the fact that David/Dave is a common name in the U.K. and that the aircraft is likely to be a common sight in the coming years.
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Likely no UK airshows after all it seems.
DoD Grounds Entire F-35 Fleet; Plane Might Not Make UK Debut | Defense News | defensenews.com
DoD Grounds Entire F-35 Fleet; Plane Might Not Make UK Debut | Defense News | defensenews.com
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
DoD Grounds Entire F-35 Fleet; Plane Might Not Make UK Debut
WASHINGTON — The European debut of the Lockheed Martin F-35 joint strike fighter is now in question after the Pentagon grounded the entire fleet late Thursday based on the initial findings of an investigation into a fire that broke out on one of the jets last month. The US Defense Department says it is still making preparations to send the jet to the Farnborough International Airshow and Royal International Air Tattoo in the UK, but would not make a final decision until “early next week.”.........
“The root cause of the incident remains under investigation,” DoD said in emailed statement late Thursday. “Additional inspections of F-35 engines have been ordered, and return to flight will be determined based on inspection results and analysis of engineering data,” the statement reads. “Defense Department leadership supports this prudent approach.”
“We are working closely with the Air Force Safety Investigation Board to determine root cause and to inspect all engines in the fleet,” Pratt & Whitney spokesman Matthew Bates said in a company statement. “Safety is our top priority. Since the incident is the subject of an investigation it is inappropriate to comment further.”
A spokesman for Lockheed was not immediately available for comment.
WASHINGTON — The European debut of the Lockheed Martin F-35 joint strike fighter is now in question after the Pentagon grounded the entire fleet late Thursday based on the initial findings of an investigation into a fire that broke out on one of the jets last month. The US Defense Department says it is still making preparations to send the jet to the Farnborough International Airshow and Royal International Air Tattoo in the UK, but would not make a final decision until “early next week.”.........
“The root cause of the incident remains under investigation,” DoD said in emailed statement late Thursday. “Additional inspections of F-35 engines have been ordered, and return to flight will be determined based on inspection results and analysis of engineering data,” the statement reads. “Defense Department leadership supports this prudent approach.”
“We are working closely with the Air Force Safety Investigation Board to determine root cause and to inspect all engines in the fleet,” Pratt & Whitney spokesman Matthew Bates said in a company statement. “Safety is our top priority. Since the incident is the subject of an investigation it is inappropriate to comment further.”
A spokesman for Lockheed was not immediately available for comment.
There is a reasonable chance that, when this story is aired out, there will have been some frank and direct internal discussion leading up to last night's decision, which has been made above the levels of the JSFPO and the Commandant of the Corps.
It would seem now that the finding of a root cause, followed by the approval of an RTF procedure and any inspection/remediation, will have to precede any flight operations. The UK deployment is not impossible but grows increasingly less likely by the hour.
Flight safety > PR!
It would seem now that the finding of a root cause, followed by the approval of an RTF procedure and any inspection/remediation, will have to precede any flight operations. The UK deployment is not impossible but grows increasingly less likely by the hour.
Flight safety > PR!
Do a Hover - it avoids G
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It would seem now that the finding of a root cause, followed by the approval of an RTF procedure and any inspection/remediation, will have to precede any flight operations
The incident that caused this current grounding is pure gold from an engineering and development point of view and will improve the eventual quality of the breed because all the evidence of what went wrong is sitting safely on the ground at a home base. Imagine if the same thing had happened en route to the UK and the aircraft had been lost at sea. Now what do you do?
Funnily enough I was involved with a rather similar exercise back in 1980. MacAir was developing the AV-8B to have twice the payload radius of the AV-8A. The only aircraft at that time was a single YAV-8B (an ex USMC A model now fitted with the big wing with large flaps and better intake as proposed for the B). MacAir wanted to ferry the aircraft to the UK then show at Farnborough how much better this aircraft was compared to the Harrier. Well I ask you how on earth could one do that? (all the normal Harrier VSTOL manoeuvres would look just the same to both the trade and the public).
However, despite my protestations, three weeks before Farnborough I found myself at Whiteman AFB with the Y model trying to work up a convincing display. I did have an idea that showed promise but whenever I tried to work on it the aircraft developed snag after snag. It was a one off airframe with related spares issues and I became convinced it would let us down in the UK. Of course nobody wanted to scrub the exercise.
Taxying out for yet another rehearsal attempt on 16 Aug the nose suddenly dropped as the nose oleo collapsed. Fortunately there was not another leg available in time so the aircraft and I had our way.
Good points, John....
Taxying out for yet another rehearsal attempt on 16 Aug the nose suddenly dropped as the nose oleo collapsed.
Honestly guv, I had no idea about that pothole
.
Taxying out for yet another rehearsal attempt on 16 Aug the nose suddenly dropped as the nose oleo collapsed.
Honestly guv, I had no idea about that pothole
.
Interesting points John, and you obviously know more about it than most. I think with the F-35 though the question has to be when does it cease to be a developmental aircraft and when can we expect it to stop going t#ts-up like this all the time?
After all, the JPO already claims to have stood up the first USMC operational squadron in 2012!
USMC stands-up first operational F-35B squadron; operational testing in 2015 - 11/21/2012 - Flight Global
and IOC for the marines is only a matter of months away.
After all, the JPO already claims to have stood up the first USMC operational squadron in 2012!
USMC stands-up first operational F-35B squadron; operational testing in 2015 - 11/21/2012 - Flight Global
and IOC for the marines is only a matter of months away.
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The grounding has hit the newspapers here in Aus big time with questions because we were supposed to take delivery of the first two within "a few weeks".