Why NCO's Are The Backbone Of The Military!
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Why NCO's Are The Backbone Of The Military!
I ran across this while researching an altogether different topic and it got me to thinking....which usually is an unwise act on my part.
I took a pause over a cup of Tea and reflected upon my time in and around the various military organizations I have encountered or been part of over the years.
One salient truth seemed evident.....NCO's are the heart and soul of any military organization....they run it....and allow the officers to think they themselves do.
Everyone of us (that is honest with himself) knows that to be true and has at least one particular NCO to whom he owes his career. This is an example of just what I mean about the NCO being the "Heart and Soul".
I took a pause over a cup of Tea and reflected upon my time in and around the various military organizations I have encountered or been part of over the years.
One salient truth seemed evident.....NCO's are the heart and soul of any military organization....they run it....and allow the officers to think they themselves do.
Everyone of us (that is honest with himself) knows that to be true and has at least one particular NCO to whom he owes his career. This is an example of just what I mean about the NCO being the "Heart and Soul".
Operation Homecoming
Most Americans welcomed the 1973 Paris Peace Accords that resulted in a cease-fire in Vietnam. Although the cease-fire was short of full victory, it seemed enough that the killing had ended and that several hundred Americans imprisoned in North Vietnam would soon be free.
By the terms of the Paris Peace Accords, the cease-fire was to become effective in Vietnam the morning of January 28, 1973, Saigon time. American prisoners in North Vietnam were to be released and the last 23,700 American troops withdrawn from Vietnam within sixty days.
Planning for Operation Homecoming, the return of the Americans held by the communists, was given to the Military Airlift Command. C-141s of the 63d Military Airlift Wing, stationed at Norton AFB, California were given the coveted responsibility for bringing out the men. On February 11, two C-130s of the TAC 374th Tactical Airlift Wing flew from Ching Chuan Kang Air Base(CC), Taiwan to Clark AB as primary and spare ships for the movement of the support team to Hanoi the next day. A second C-130 left Tan Son Nhut AB carrying members of the international commission to Hanoi oversee the repatriations. This C-130 arrived at Gia Lam Airport about one hour before the C-130 from CCK arrived.[6]
On the ground at Gia Lam the C-130 crew met the airport manager, and went indoors for tea offered by the North Vietnamese. The first of three C-141s flown in from Clark landed soon after and repatriation began.
As the first returnee moved from the release desk, one of the C-130 flight engineers quickly moved to clear the way, leading the former prisoner by the arm. Taking the cue, the other C-130 crewmen in the same way escorted each man to the waiting C-141.
Over and over, returnees expressed their deepest appreciation at having been greeted by a 'brother-in-arms' and, in those first few moments of freedom, welcomed home by their own kind. A total of 116 Americans were released at Gia Lam that day and all were flown to Clark by the C-141s.
Further releases of Americans in Hanoi followed the pattern of the first day. Releases took place on February 18 and on seven dates in March, ending with the final repatriation of the last sixty-seven men on March 29, 1973.
Most Americans welcomed the 1973 Paris Peace Accords that resulted in a cease-fire in Vietnam. Although the cease-fire was short of full victory, it seemed enough that the killing had ended and that several hundred Americans imprisoned in North Vietnam would soon be free.
By the terms of the Paris Peace Accords, the cease-fire was to become effective in Vietnam the morning of January 28, 1973, Saigon time. American prisoners in North Vietnam were to be released and the last 23,700 American troops withdrawn from Vietnam within sixty days.
Planning for Operation Homecoming, the return of the Americans held by the communists, was given to the Military Airlift Command. C-141s of the 63d Military Airlift Wing, stationed at Norton AFB, California were given the coveted responsibility for bringing out the men. On February 11, two C-130s of the TAC 374th Tactical Airlift Wing flew from Ching Chuan Kang Air Base(CC), Taiwan to Clark AB as primary and spare ships for the movement of the support team to Hanoi the next day. A second C-130 left Tan Son Nhut AB carrying members of the international commission to Hanoi oversee the repatriations. This C-130 arrived at Gia Lam Airport about one hour before the C-130 from CCK arrived.[6]
On the ground at Gia Lam the C-130 crew met the airport manager, and went indoors for tea offered by the North Vietnamese. The first of three C-141s flown in from Clark landed soon after and repatriation began.
As the first returnee moved from the release desk, one of the C-130 flight engineers quickly moved to clear the way, leading the former prisoner by the arm. Taking the cue, the other C-130 crewmen in the same way escorted each man to the waiting C-141.
Over and over, returnees expressed their deepest appreciation at having been greeted by a 'brother-in-arms' and, in those first few moments of freedom, welcomed home by their own kind. A total of 116 Americans were released at Gia Lam that day and all were flown to Clark by the C-141s.
Further releases of Americans in Hanoi followed the pattern of the first day. Releases took place on February 18 and on seven dates in March, ending with the final repatriation of the last sixty-seven men on March 29, 1973.
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Oh dear....................
I was in total agreement with every element of this article until...... Well, I'm sure that most PPRuners will spot the bit that made me spill my beer.
I was in total agreement with every element of this article until...... Well, I'm sure that most PPRuners will spot the bit that made me spill my beer.
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Oh dear....................
I was in total agreement with every element of this article until...... Well, I'm sure that most PPRuners will spot the bit that made me spill my beer.
I was in total agreement with every element of this article until...... Well, I'm sure that most PPRuners will spot the bit that made me spill my beer.
Er..... no, do clarify for the hard of thinking please.
I've been listening to this claptrap about NCO's v officers ever since I was commissioned in 1964. The theory is perpetuated by Hollywood where every junior army officer is a fool/coward/drunk etc who is propped up by a salt of the earth tough sergeant, usually called Joe, and usually from Brooklyn. Over here the officer is a chinless public school wonder whose men only follow him out of curiosity, as the old joke goes, and who relies on a grizzly NCO from Barnsley or Bermondsey to keep him out of trouble. Both stereotypes are complete parodies of the truth.
The fact is if you are comparing a newly-commissioned officer with an NCO with 10 - 15 years or so service in you are obviously going to find that the young officer is going to lean on the NCO for advice and guidance until he/she finds his/her feet (sod it, I'm going to say his,women will have to take it as read they I include them).
I certainly found myself in this position as a very young officer with my first command, but after a few years I found I could look my NCO's in the eye in the knowledge that I knew the job pretty much as well as they did. We just had different jobs to do - my sergeant's contribution was no less than my own, it was just different.
So SASless I have to disagree - NCO's are no more the heart and soul of the military than are the officers (or indeed the other ranks who havent made their first stripe yet). All play their part.
The fact is if you are comparing a newly-commissioned officer with an NCO with 10 - 15 years or so service in you are obviously going to find that the young officer is going to lean on the NCO for advice and guidance until he/she finds his/her feet (sod it, I'm going to say his,women will have to take it as read they I include them).
I certainly found myself in this position as a very young officer with my first command, but after a few years I found I could look my NCO's in the eye in the knowledge that I knew the job pretty much as well as they did. We just had different jobs to do - my sergeant's contribution was no less than my own, it was just different.
So SASless I have to disagree - NCO's are no more the heart and soul of the military than are the officers (or indeed the other ranks who havent made their first stripe yet). All play their part.
OF 3 Ranks and WO's are the backbone. Look at any Coy/Sqn/Regt/Stn/Bde HQ/DivHQ. They are the workhorses in every situation.
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I'm going to have to disagree that SNCOs are the be-all and end-all of the organisation. Sure, they are a source of experience and advice, particularly to wet-behind-the-ears junior officers who don't know any better, and they can do things that no officer should get involved in if he's wise, but the ultimate responsibility and accountability was mine, not theirs! I was as good as any SNCO I ever served with, including the Warrant Officers' soviet which ran everything, but I ensured the respect went both ways. The NCOs are an essential part, and play an appropriate role, but they don't run the ship! Not my ship at least!
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Funny.....the "Officers" that have enlisted servants seem to think so much of theselves. Probably a hold over from when money bought Commissions and family connections ensured retention. The expression "Lions led by Donkey's! springs to mind.
Our own US Navy has a problem with Officer arrogance....assisted by having enlisted stewards who do their house keeping and laundry quite unlike the Army and Air Force where it is a punishable offense under UCMJ.
Yes the Officer has the responsibility.....and the authority....but it is the NCO's that carry out the duties and have first line leadership for the Troops. They see the NCO as the writ and article of the military and rightfully so.
Our own US Navy has a problem with Officer arrogance....assisted by having enlisted stewards who do their house keeping and laundry quite unlike the Army and Air Force where it is a punishable offense under UCMJ.
Yes the Officer has the responsibility.....and the authority....but it is the NCO's that carry out the duties and have first line leadership for the Troops. They see the NCO as the writ and article of the military and rightfully so.
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Cobblers mate! I went through the ranks and was commissioned the hard way, so I know from personal experience that your analogies are utter nonsense. NCOs are an important part of the command chain and no one who has ever served in any capacity would deny that, but "enlisted servants?" Complete and utter bolleaux! It's a team effort, but the buck in my experience most certainly didn't stop at any SNCO under me.
I also once took the blame for two SNCOs who had been falsely accused, then took it to a much higher authority , and won. So I've been there, done that...
I also once took the blame for two SNCOs who had been falsely accused, then took it to a much higher authority , and won. So I've been there, done that...
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In my experiance I cannot see how any officer can be effective without S/NCO's. The officer of any rank is normaly only in post for for around 2 years, and yes he can gain SOME knowledge, but the WO's and Snco's will probably have 3 or 4 or more times time served in that particular area, especially engineering. I will admit that this is less of a problem now than we had a larger selection of aircraft.
The biggest problem I can remember were new O/C arriving with 'new' ideas, that had been tried before, advised why they could/did not work but still insisting on them being carried out, only to revert within days/weeks because they still did not work.
For these officers who believe that THEY run their sections/flights/squadrons, give the WO and S/NCOs a few weeks off, then see how they get on !!
The biggest problem I can remember were new O/C arriving with 'new' ideas, that had been tried before, advised why they could/did not work but still insisting on them being carried out, only to revert within days/weeks because they still did not work.
For these officers who believe that THEY run their sections/flights/squadrons, give the WO and S/NCOs a few weeks off, then see how they get on !!
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Cobblers mate! I went through the ranks and was commissioned the hard way, so I know from personal experience that your analogies are utter nonsense. NCOs are an important part of the command chain and no one who has ever served in any capacity would deny that, but "enlisted servants?" Complete and utter bolleaux! It's a team effort, but the buck in my experience most certainly didn't stop at any SNCO under me.
He was on the apron when the door opened. I think he expected us officers to dismount, riding boots and swagger sticks, while the 'man' (we only had two crew chiefs) did the work.
Instead he was amazed how we all piled in, panel opening, power conections, fuelling hose etc etc while we all did the rapid turn round.
So for some it probably hasn't changed; for others it is only team work that makes it work.
But then there are WOs.
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In my experience I cannot see how any officer can be effective without S/NCO's.
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Reading through this thread has given me some time for thought and reflection. I did a tour in the early 70’s on a lightning squadron based in Cyprus. On joining the squadron I was a humble corporal armament fitter who, after a spell in the hangar, was sent to work on line. We did composite turn-round servicing in those days a team compromising NCO i/c, Man A, Man B and Man C. Man C was always an armament man anyhow so in most instances I wore two hats, NCO i/c and Man C. The team spirit was superb, excellent turn-around times were standard sometimes involving wheel or brake unit changes along with all the other requirements to launch a hot ship ready for action. Pilots sometimes sat in the cockpit while all the activity took place and on other occasions there was a pilot swap while everything was happening around them. Line SNCO’s were generally to be found in the line office overseeing activity and clearing documents as required occasionally venturing outside to cast a passing eye on things or a judgment on technical issues. The Junior Engineering Officer was a frequent visitor, a youngish guy who came to swim in the pool of experience the line team exuded throughout their shift and the Senior Engineer was never far away either. Extra manpower and assistance was readily available from the hangar teams. Towards the end of my tour I was promoted to Sergeant and remained on the Line Team as a Shift NCO. Throughout my time on the squadron EVERYBODY PULLED TOGETHER, from TOP TO BOTTOM and also LATTERALLY. We had a great bunch of pilots (both young and inexperienced and older more sage individuals) who understood what was happening and knew enough of the challenges faced by us grunts to let us get on with what we knew best how to accomplish. Good engineering officers who knew every tradesman by name and were active at all levels along with knowledgeable SNCO’s. Junior NCO’s were given real responsibilities and junior technicians and airmen tradesmen respected and encouraged. It was a superb tour of duty in a professional well run military environment. EVERYBODY played a part. Slackers and incompetents were as much as possible isolated, their annual assessments ultimately reflecting their weaknesses.
In a properly run unit everybody is a competent or is encouraged either to improve or be removed. If there is a shambles somewhere along the line that requires SNCO’s to continually support a weak or incompetent officer then there is a serious breakdown of oversight from the next highest level of authority.
During my service I did by contrast to the original starting point of this thread come across a few SNCO’s who were (IMHO) a complete and total waste of rations. Such individuals were in fact to be found at all levels, from quite high-up to the very bottom.
PS – On that particular squadron we played pretty damn hard also
In a properly run unit everybody is a competent or is encouraged either to improve or be removed. If there is a shambles somewhere along the line that requires SNCO’s to continually support a weak or incompetent officer then there is a serious breakdown of oversight from the next highest level of authority.
During my service I did by contrast to the original starting point of this thread come across a few SNCO’s who were (IMHO) a complete and total waste of rations. Such individuals were in fact to be found at all levels, from quite high-up to the very bottom.
PS – On that particular squadron we played pretty damn hard also
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After 40 years service, 29 as a SNCO/WO, I concluded that both officers and NCOs have their place. The officer (I set baby ones to one side at this point) to decide on the strategic direction of his bit of the organisation and the NCO cadre to take the tactical approach and get there. As a WO you tend to have a foot in both camps. Even CAS has a CASWO. The problems occur when the roles are confused. As the saying goes "there's nothing more dangerous than an officer with a map." Tell your Sgt where you want to be (don't ask him) then lead him from behind.
My Pa was a Flight Sargeant for the last twelve years of his service. He was the most bigotted, lazy, self-opinionated bullying loudmouth that I've ever known. How he was supposed to inspire leadership I'll never know.
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Picking up from the experience of Q-RTF-X I joined a Sqdn , as a cpl/tech, at Akrotiri in the early 60's, where the servicing organisation was a complete shambles. No Flt / Sgt or WO (The previous F/S had suffered a nervous breakdown and been sent home.) just a very worn out Ch/ Tech trying to keep things going until a replacement arrived. Moral was at rock bottom. Flt /Sgt Arther xxxxx duly arrived, took one look at the situation and after a meeting with the (new) CO got things moving. He had all the groundcrew together told us what he was going to do and what he expected from us, in no uncertain terms. In short, he transformed the set-up, got rid of a few Sgt's, shift system in place, accountability to all NCO'S etc., and in doing so improved servicing efficiency and moral no-end. Was he doing an officers job? No, just doing what a good SNCO is paid to do, with the backing of his CO.
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A true tale from the Land of the Long White Cloud.
Junior pilot goes to the line office, all kitted up to fly, and greets the SNCO present, who is head down into the paperwork with : "Is my frame ready Chief?"
Without looking up from said paperwork, Chief replies, " It's not your frame, it's mine until such time as I loan it to you,which isn't right now so bugger off......"
Junior pilot goes to the line office, all kitted up to fly, and greets the SNCO present, who is head down into the paperwork with : "Is my frame ready Chief?"
Without looking up from said paperwork, Chief replies, " It's not your frame, it's mine until such time as I loan it to you,which isn't right now so bugger off......"
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Redhill.....by chance were you a bit rebellious in yer youth? Some say perception is truth but not always!