Chinook - Still Hitting Back
A really irritating PPRuNer
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Right here it is......
http://www.chinook-justice.org/
My thanks to Chocks Wahay for all the hard work.
Please support the petition and pass the URL to all your friends.
Thank you
Brian
"Justice has no expiry date" - John Cook
http://www.chinook-justice.org/
My thanks to Chocks Wahay for all the hard work.
Please support the petition and pass the URL to all your friends.
Thank you
Brian
"Justice has no expiry date" - John Cook
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Brian thanks for the e-mail I have had a look at the web-site and you have excelled yourself this time mate, I have sent mail to the support site lets keep pushing do I need to any more pushing on our friend
A really irritating PPRuNer
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Thank you everyone, for your support of the web site. We hope to update the list of supporters on a regular basis, so your name will appear there sometime. What we will not do is disclose addresses or personal details (ie e-mail addresses) to anyone.
Once the list has grown a little, I will attempt to link it to the e-petition site of the official No 10 Downing Street web site. It will serve as a reminder to those at that site, that we will not go away.
Basing - thanks for the comments mate. I took the liberty of mailing our friend at the same time I bothered you. Hope that was in order.
Regards all
Brian
"Justice has no expiry date" - John Cook
Once the list has grown a little, I will attempt to link it to the e-petition site of the official No 10 Downing Street web site. It will serve as a reminder to those at that site, that we will not go away.
Basing - thanks for the comments mate. I took the liberty of mailing our friend at the same time I bothered you. Hope that was in order.
Regards all
Brian
"Justice has no expiry date" - John Cook
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The website is superb Brian, well done. Thankyou for adding my name to the list.
I am delighted with Derek Hine's submission to the committee. I have to be there to see the Wratten & Day answers in the flesh - surely the arrogance cannot continue in a state of blatant denial given the evidence that is now publicly available. It was obviously easy for them to attempt to destroy the reputations of dead pilots when it was a relatively anonymous paper exercise- I hope that they can be brave enough to reinstate those same young men's excellent reputations when they are facing professional people who are not overawed by military rank!! What a simple and honourable statement they can make to give 2 families back their peace of mind and pride.
The 5 questions stated from the continuing excellent reporting from the Scotland on Sunday have been regularly discussed by my own family - most especially why the yachtsman was so discredited/ignored in his submission? He was a technically trained man with a sound sense of perspective who asked the MOD for information that was not forthcoming, but he continued to offer his support in spite ot the lack of respect afforded to his witness.I have 2 questions to add :- What will it cost W&D to make the appropriate, honest statements ? What will it benefit them and many others?
I am delighted with Derek Hine's submission to the committee. I have to be there to see the Wratten & Day answers in the flesh - surely the arrogance cannot continue in a state of blatant denial given the evidence that is now publicly available. It was obviously easy for them to attempt to destroy the reputations of dead pilots when it was a relatively anonymous paper exercise- I hope that they can be brave enough to reinstate those same young men's excellent reputations when they are facing professional people who are not overawed by military rank!! What a simple and honourable statement they can make to give 2 families back their peace of mind and pride.
The 5 questions stated from the continuing excellent reporting from the Scotland on Sunday have been regularly discussed by my own family - most especially why the yachtsman was so discredited/ignored in his submission? He was a technically trained man with a sound sense of perspective who asked the MOD for information that was not forthcoming, but he continued to offer his support in spite ot the lack of respect afforded to his witness.I have 2 questions to add :- What will it cost W&D to make the appropriate, honest statements ? What will it benefit them and many others?
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We've been inundated with responses to the petition - keep them coming, your support makes a difference.
I've uploaded the first batch of names tonight, I'll try and keep on top of it, but it might take a day or two to get up to date.
Just to reiterate - the site is www.chinook-justice.org, or simply email your name to [email protected] and we'll do the rest.
I've uploaded the first batch of names tonight, I'll try and keep on top of it, but it might take a day or two to get up to date.
Just to reiterate - the site is www.chinook-justice.org, or simply email your name to [email protected] and we'll do the rest.
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Aha - that'll be why the [email protected] mailbox is full again :-)
Good stuff, keep 'em coming, the more the merrier.
Good stuff, keep 'em coming, the more the merrier.
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Thank you to everyone who has already signed up the petition on www.chinook-justice.org
If we can get over 300 signatures on the petition (sorry Chocks!), I will submit the site to the official 10 Downing Street web site and ask them to link it to their e-petition page. That way we can be a constant reminder Mr Blair and his Ministers.
Updates after the public meeting next week.
Regards as always
Brian
"Justice has no expiry date" - John Cook
If we can get over 300 signatures on the petition (sorry Chocks!), I will submit the site to the official 10 Downing Street web site and ask them to link it to their e-petition page. That way we can be a constant reminder Mr Blair and his Ministers.
Updates after the public meeting next week.
Regards as always
Brian
"Justice has no expiry date" - John Cook
A really irritating PPRuNer
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Hi Ark,
thanks for the names and the comments on the site. Much credit to Chocks Wahay too!
Low & Slow,
Sorry, can't think why you are unable to link to the campaign site. I have just tried the link on my last posting and it worked OK on my machine. Can you get to the site if you type direct in your address title bar? Are you including the http:// bit (I always used to forget that). If you're still having problems, please get back to me.
The House of Lords dates are as follows:
Thursday 27th Sep - 11.00am to 16.30pm.
Friday 28th Sep - 10.30am to 16.30pm.
Entrance on both days is via St Stephens Gate, and the meetings are scheduled to be heard in Committee Room 8. (I'll have to ask directions when I get inside too!).
Hope this answers your questions. If not, please let me know.
Regards all,
Brian
"Justice has no expiry date" - John Cook
thanks for the names and the comments on the site. Much credit to Chocks Wahay too!
Low & Slow,
Sorry, can't think why you are unable to link to the campaign site. I have just tried the link on my last posting and it worked OK on my machine. Can you get to the site if you type direct in your address title bar? Are you including the http:// bit (I always used to forget that). If you're still having problems, please get back to me.
The House of Lords dates are as follows:
Thursday 27th Sep - 11.00am to 16.30pm.
Friday 28th Sep - 10.30am to 16.30pm.
Entrance on both days is via St Stephens Gate, and the meetings are scheduled to be heard in Committee Room 8. (I'll have to ask directions when I get inside too!).
Hope this answers your questions. If not, please let me know.
Regards all,
Brian
"Justice has no expiry date" - John Cook
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Not sure why you can't get the site - I did take it down for about 30 minutes on Sunday evening, but it should have been ok since then.
If you're using Netscape it may require a / at the end - I have 4.75 and I notice it sticks a / in there automatically, perhaps earlier versions don't do this? Internet Explorer doesn't seem to require the /.
John Nichol / Low & Slow - can you confirm what software you're using to access the site?
If anyone else has problems with the site please contact me: [email protected]
Another bunch of names going on the petition tonight - keep 'em coming :-)
If you're using Netscape it may require a / at the end - I have 4.75 and I notice it sticks a / in there automatically, perhaps earlier versions don't do this? Internet Explorer doesn't seem to require the /.
John Nichol / Low & Slow - can you confirm what software you're using to access the site?
If anyone else has problems with the site please contact me: [email protected]
Another bunch of names going on the petition tonight - keep 'em coming :-)
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Me again, just wanted to say thank you to the people who have supported the petition - tonight I've just added the hundredth name to the website - an amazing response in the ten days since the site was launched.
Plenty room for more!
[email protected]
Plenty room for more!
[email protected]
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I can get to the site. It just wont open up when I get there(story of my life)
I'm using IE5, and it's the same with both my ISP. No big think though. I'll see you all at the Enquiry
I'm using IE5, and it's the same with both my ISP. No big think though. I'll see you all at the Enquiry
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for info guys...today's proceedings
CHINOOK INQUIRY OFFICER STANDS BY FINDINGS<
By PA News<
The officer who presided over the initial inquiry into the RAF's worst
peacetime disaster today said he stood by his finding that pilot error was to
blame for the tragedy.<
Group Captain Andrew Pulford told a House of Lords committee that he had not
been convinced by any other arguments since Chinook Mark 2 helicopter ZD576
crashed on the Mull of Kintyre in June 1994.<
The pilots and 27 senior police and intelligence officers were killed in the
crash.<
Group Capt Pulford told the House of Lords inquiry: "I have seen and heard
nothing, and believe me there are evenings when I wish I knew, why it occurred
the way it did.<
"I have not been convinced by any other arguments, and I have heard quite a
lot over the years.''<
Asked if he still stood by his position, seven years after the crash, he
replied: "I would go with what we got, I would stand by what we did.''<
Group Capt Pulford said a simulation of the accident indicated that the pilots
were flying at the unusually high speed of 150 knots when, given the conditions
and location, they should have been flying "low and slow''.<
He also said there had been "compound errors'' in the plotting of the route.<
"They thought they were further away from the Mull, these are metres rather
than miles, but with these errors ... they might have thought in their minds
they were further away than they were.'' <
Group Capt Pulford presided over the initial phase of the RAF Board of Inquiry
which found the pilots, Flight Lieutenants Richard Cook and Jonathan Tapper,
guilty of gross negligence.<
But a campaign by their families to clear their names won widespread support,
leading to a vote by peers in April for an all-party inquiry.<
The controversy came to a head after a fatal accident inquiry in Scotland
decided the pilots could not be held responsible.<
In that inquiry, a sheriff concluded that he could not be satisfied with the
RAF's finding that the accident was caused by the crew selecting the wrong rate
of climb when overflying the Mull of Kintyre.<
The House of Lords committee was appointed to investigate the justification
for the finding of negligence.<
Asked about the board's "cavalier'' dismissal of technical failures as the
cause of the accident, Group Capt Pulford admitted that it was impossible to
rule out the possibility of "minor technical malfunction,'' such as a
flickering gauge.<
But he argued it could have been a "cause of possible distraction to the
crew'' rather than "the cause of the accident itself''.<
Group Capt Pulford, an experienced Chinook pilot, said the board had been told
of technical problems with the Mark 2 Chinook such as "spurious captions'' on
the control panel.<
"We had evidence from several witnesses that the Chinook Mark 2 was
experiencing unexpected and unforeseen malfunctions,'' he told the inquiry.<
The officer said the board had ruled out the interference of mobile phones or
personal computers as a likely cause of the crash.<
But he accepted that a voice recorder on board would have removed "a lot of
the ambiguities'' surrounding the case.<
The five-member committee of peers chaired by Lord Jauncey of Tullichettle, a
former Scottish Law Lord, will prepare a report for the House of Lords by the
end of January 2002.<
Hearings today and tomorrow will also take evidence from Air Chief Marshal Sir
John Day and retired Air Chief Marshal Sir William Wratten, who reviewed the
initial findings.<
The committee is expected to continue taking evidence through the autumn in
hearings which will be open to the public and press.<
end<
CHINOOK INQUIRY OFFICER STANDS BY FINDINGS<
By PA News<
The officer who presided over the initial inquiry into the RAF's worst
peacetime disaster today said he stood by his finding that pilot error was to
blame for the tragedy.<
Group Captain Andrew Pulford told a House of Lords committee that he had not
been convinced by any other arguments since Chinook Mark 2 helicopter ZD576
crashed on the Mull of Kintyre in June 1994.<
The pilots and 27 senior police and intelligence officers were killed in the
crash.<
Group Capt Pulford told the House of Lords inquiry: "I have seen and heard
nothing, and believe me there are evenings when I wish I knew, why it occurred
the way it did.<
"I have not been convinced by any other arguments, and I have heard quite a
lot over the years.''<
Asked if he still stood by his position, seven years after the crash, he
replied: "I would go with what we got, I would stand by what we did.''<
Group Capt Pulford said a simulation of the accident indicated that the pilots
were flying at the unusually high speed of 150 knots when, given the conditions
and location, they should have been flying "low and slow''.<
He also said there had been "compound errors'' in the plotting of the route.<
"They thought they were further away from the Mull, these are metres rather
than miles, but with these errors ... they might have thought in their minds
they were further away than they were.'' <
Group Capt Pulford presided over the initial phase of the RAF Board of Inquiry
which found the pilots, Flight Lieutenants Richard Cook and Jonathan Tapper,
guilty of gross negligence.<
But a campaign by their families to clear their names won widespread support,
leading to a vote by peers in April for an all-party inquiry.<
The controversy came to a head after a fatal accident inquiry in Scotland
decided the pilots could not be held responsible.<
In that inquiry, a sheriff concluded that he could not be satisfied with the
RAF's finding that the accident was caused by the crew selecting the wrong rate
of climb when overflying the Mull of Kintyre.<
The House of Lords committee was appointed to investigate the justification
for the finding of negligence.<
Asked about the board's "cavalier'' dismissal of technical failures as the
cause of the accident, Group Capt Pulford admitted that it was impossible to
rule out the possibility of "minor technical malfunction,'' such as a
flickering gauge.<
But he argued it could have been a "cause of possible distraction to the
crew'' rather than "the cause of the accident itself''.<
Group Capt Pulford, an experienced Chinook pilot, said the board had been told
of technical problems with the Mark 2 Chinook such as "spurious captions'' on
the control panel.<
"We had evidence from several witnesses that the Chinook Mark 2 was
experiencing unexpected and unforeseen malfunctions,'' he told the inquiry.<
The officer said the board had ruled out the interference of mobile phones or
personal computers as a likely cause of the crash.<
But he accepted that a voice recorder on board would have removed "a lot of
the ambiguities'' surrounding the case.<
The five-member committee of peers chaired by Lord Jauncey of Tullichettle, a
former Scottish Law Lord, will prepare a report for the House of Lords by the
end of January 2002.<
Hearings today and tomorrow will also take evidence from Air Chief Marshal Sir
John Day and retired Air Chief Marshal Sir William Wratten, who reviewed the
initial findings.<
The committee is expected to continue taking evidence through the autumn in
hearings which will be open to the public and press.<
end<