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Brown looks at 1bn helicopter order

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Brown looks at 1bn helicopter order

Old 10th Nov 2009, 17:40
  #21 (permalink)  
 
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I can see the entry in the F700 now...

Merlin turns over, but fails to start...

Joking aside, glad to hear everyone got away with their lives.

Just goes to show how tricky this dust landing malarkey really is.
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Old 10th Nov 2009, 18:35
  #22 (permalink)  
 
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What's wrong with buying a few Blackhawks from Westlands ? I thought years ago they had a licence to build them from Sikorsky , I seam to remember them acquiring one as a demonstrator for possible overseas sales & even converted it to fly with Rolls Royce engines .
Work for RR & Westlands .
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Old 10th Nov 2009, 19:46
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If a brand spanking CH47F is about 20M per copy then how do 20 of them add up to 1Bn? that's an awful lot of Through-Life-Support!!! (about 600M by my calculations!).

I've heard a rumour that the 1Bn is for a bigger spend on not just helicopters - I just can't get anyone in Town to confirm it (but something is going on).

I wonder if Mrs Janes' outburst to the PM on the lack of military spending, and the Govt's willingness to splash money on our beleaguered Banks, has anything to do with this announcement?

The B Word
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Old 10th Nov 2009, 19:46
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Ah, I see the 2020 Vision paper results have been leaked!
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Old 10th Nov 2009, 20:08
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just pull a billion from the OLYMPICS,
lets face it, it going to cost so much, who will notice??






or care!!!
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Old 10th Nov 2009, 20:35
  #26 (permalink)  
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Rumour control suggests that a grey Merlin had a hard landing on one of the cousins' war canoes recently, though it stayed upright.

Maybe enough good parts from the pair of them to make one good one?
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Old 10th Nov 2009, 21:29
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AA, not a rumour at all, it happened and photographs have appeared on the net, a Canadian ship If I remember correctly, ship came into port and the Merlin was lifted off by crane and roaded out.
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Old 10th Nov 2009, 23:24
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Tee hee


Scrap the aircraft carrier orders, scrap the nuclear deterrent replacement and there should be enough in the budget to finance essential equipment for our forces. The Puma refurbishment and Seakings should be scrapped and replaced with Merlin and Chinooks, as should the pathetic upgrading of the Lynx engines and the purchase of the Future Lynx.

Sounds a bit drastic I know but its the only way to properly equip our brave men and women in the armed forces who are in harms way every day.
Mate, you haven't done the Staff course have you..??????
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Old 11th Nov 2009, 10:49
  #29 (permalink)  
 
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Spot on me thinks - Looks like all the ducks are lining up ready to announce the demise of Puma and Merlin. So, Belvedere II - close Benson, sell it off and find a new JHC base as Odiham is too small to house another 20 cabs - the site would have to be leveled (like Northholt) and started from scratch.

Of course all this is just rumor

Last edited by Grimweasel; 11th Nov 2009 at 17:32.
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Old 11th Nov 2009, 12:15
  #30 (permalink)  
 
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So, Belvedere II - close Benson, sell it off and find a new JHC base as Odiham is too small to house another 20 cabs - the site would have to be leveled (like Northholt) and started from scratch
Why not Benson? There are already well over 20+ cabs there with 28 and 78 split across 2 hangars, and what are the chances of the full complement of ac (Merlin or CH-47) ever being there? If you relocate the AEF and clear out all the hangars of non-28/78 assets, and assuming that not all cabs will be there at any one time, how much more space than is currently available would be needed given that a Merlin and a CH-47 footprint isn't vastly dis-similar?

Been away from Benson for a while now, so things may have changed, and granted there would be need to be some infra changes, but surely it would be cheaper than upping sticks completely, especially having forked out to convert 78 Sqn's hangar and with the sim on the same site?
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Old 11th Nov 2009, 13:57
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Melchett01,

I think you are rather forgetting the presence of 33 Sqn at Benson and the fact that 230 Sqn are about to move in from Aldergrove.
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Old 11th Nov 2009, 15:06
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Originally Posted by Seaking93
AA, not a rumour at all, it happened and photographs have appeared on the net, a Canadian ship If I remember correctly, ship came into port and the Merlin was lifted off by crane and roaded out.
Sorry to continue the thread drift, but not having seen the photos of the Mk1 on HMCS Montreal: what condition was it in after the incident (the Merlin, not the frigate)?

I/C
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Old 11th Nov 2009, 15:19
  #33 (permalink)  
 
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Perhaps these (as I know we have done to death) would be the better, more prudent buy for the CHF.

Not least because this method of folding a Chinook's blades The Boeing CH-47 Chinook helicopter - Folding the Rotor Blades. looks like a right PITA
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Old 11th Nov 2009, 15:42
  #34 (permalink)  
 
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Maybe that's why we fly them from place to place - quicker, easier, less to go wrong with complicated folding mechanisms, less weight.....

Not as much fun as cramming them all into a floating steel box where one missile can take them all out in one go....
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Old 11th Nov 2009, 17:19
  #35 (permalink)  
 
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You're right Crab

An Amphibious CHF it'll never catch on
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Old 11th Nov 2009, 18:23
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pr00ne -

Unchecked beat me to it. My cunning plan works on the basis that the CH-47 and the Merlin are roughly the same size, and therefore with a bit of thought and careful planning you should be able to get a smaller number of CH-47s into the same real estate currently occupied by almost 30 Merlins.

I can't remember off the top of my head the exact size of the Puma force, but whilst things are certainly cozy at Benson, they are certainly coping. And if push came to shove, I'm sure you could come up with some cunning plan that involved somewhere like Little Rissington (currently home to a VGS) or Kidlington to house the AEF / UAS.

Yes it might take a bit of intellectual horsepower to work it out - which would be a novelty rather than just saying 'yes Sir, splendid idea' or employing a firm of consultants on an exorbitant fee (then we could only get 18 new cabs!) to state the bleeding obvious. In our current, ahem, straightened times throwing money at some half arse plan like Belvedere which didn't work to start with really should be a non-starter now. Let's actually make us of the resources we have and if needed spend the consultancy fees on bringing them up to scratch so they are fit for their current and future purpose.
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Old 11th Nov 2009, 19:00
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And if push came to shove, I'm sure you could come up with some cunning plan that involved somewhere like Little Rissington (currently home to a VGS) or Kidlington to house the AEF / UAS.
So, you weren't aware that several years ago the nimbys local to Little Rissington beat off the RAFs moves to close the gliding school at Bicester and move it to Little Riss?
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Old 11th Nov 2009, 19:10
  #38 (permalink)  
 
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deeceethree -

Not sure what the argument was back then or when it was, but I'm fairly certain 637 VGS are currently operating motor gliders out of there, as well as Devonair conducting various aspects of ac engineering / servicing. Plus, I think it was designated a core site up to 2030 under the Defence Estate development plan, as part of which it was looked at as a relief landing ground for Brize and Benson.

Looks like the NIMBYs might have to get some ear plugs!
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Old 11th Nov 2009, 19:22
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Melchett 01

There is, of course, always Chalgrove.
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Old 11th Nov 2009, 19:27
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Caz

Indeed there is - I was simply illustrating a point. But now you mention it, Chalgrove could be a better bet. Being well out of the UAS system, do they still chop studes? If so, how about a Martin Baker let down over the fenceline for those that don't quite make the grade!
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