BEagle
BEagle,
I hope you're right and I've been away from the UK for the last 2/3 years but, from afar, the 'non-remunerative retention incentives' so far look like a load of old toss (not to make too fine a point). Judging from the MoD's previous forays into these sorts of measures we can probably expect more electronic blueys, the odd morale phone call, Old Spice and the new RAF Community Website (http://208.194.177.71/). None of these will make much material difference to the bloke who's just missed out on the Retention Package and will probably infuriate many more. You only have to look at the US system to see that they take 'non-remunerative retention incentives' much more seriously ie proper gyms, GI Bill, decent terms of service.
I hope you're right and I've been away from the UK for the last 2/3 years but, from afar, the 'non-remunerative retention incentives' so far look like a load of old toss (not to make too fine a point). Judging from the MoD's previous forays into these sorts of measures we can probably expect more electronic blueys, the odd morale phone call, Old Spice and the new RAF Community Website (http://208.194.177.71/). None of these will make much material difference to the bloke who's just missed out on the Retention Package and will probably infuriate many more. You only have to look at the US system to see that they take 'non-remunerative retention incentives' much more seriously ie proper gyms, GI Bill, decent terms of service.
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BEagle
Thank you. It is difficult to not come across as being a very negative, dripping little git when you find yourself watching the light at the end of the tunnel become a memory.
Those who have read this forum for some time may remember that the last time I had a little Pprune frenzy was about this time last year. My problem then (and I guess still is) was the fact that FS and Master ALM’s were to be placed on the lower band whilst the rest of the RAF’s sky gods would move to the higher band, or be carried along with the officers’ band of brothers (and commissioned rates of flying pay).
My particular gripe was that there was so much winging about lack of recognition when yet another blow had been dealt to both myself and my trade. That particular flurry of posts probably made me about as popular as AG at present. However, now that the RAF has finally come up with what appears to be an excellent package, not so much the bonuses but more the Professional Aircrew Spine, maybe you could all take a look at SNCO Aircrew and find out what we do.
This is a tall order because even my own trade can’t be bothered to look at what their colleagues on fixed/rotary wing do, demonstrated by the awful ‘my jobs better than your job’ slurry on Pprune last year.
If you do take any interest then here’s a little taster of my ‘Big Air Force’ career to date:
1983 Join up.
1986 Become ALM.
1988 Terms of reference changed removing right of time promotion. Promotion was the only way to get ANY pay increase. However I get ‘reserved rights’ to time promotion pay scales.
1994 Start to be paid as FS even though Sgt.
1995 Offer of promotion to FS, with adjuncts! Categorically told (sadly not in writing) that this included offer of service to age 55. If accepted would have to sign on to new terms of service (no right to Masters pay/pension). If turned down would NEVER be offered again. Service past 22 year point would be refused. Signed on to new terms, looking to start a family.
1999 RAF signing just about anything with a brevet on past 22 year point. I got offered my FS on ‘merit’. It was rammed down my throat but I’d had to work for it. Perverse! Now every toe rag that’d been in long enough for the pay but were unfit promotion got signed on with their Masters pay (and pension) in their back pocket.
2001 I’m left behind on the low band of pay.
2002 I’m sat here typing this.
Please guys, if you’ve read this far and know nothing about SNCO Aircrew other than what you read on here get out and meet some of us. We come across as complete Muppets on Pprune because we’re always so bitter and twisted, come and have a look at what we do, it is honestly up there with the navs and we are just as cack handed!
Cheapseat
Thank you. It is difficult to not come across as being a very negative, dripping little git when you find yourself watching the light at the end of the tunnel become a memory.
Those who have read this forum for some time may remember that the last time I had a little Pprune frenzy was about this time last year. My problem then (and I guess still is) was the fact that FS and Master ALM’s were to be placed on the lower band whilst the rest of the RAF’s sky gods would move to the higher band, or be carried along with the officers’ band of brothers (and commissioned rates of flying pay).
My particular gripe was that there was so much winging about lack of recognition when yet another blow had been dealt to both myself and my trade. That particular flurry of posts probably made me about as popular as AG at present. However, now that the RAF has finally come up with what appears to be an excellent package, not so much the bonuses but more the Professional Aircrew Spine, maybe you could all take a look at SNCO Aircrew and find out what we do.
This is a tall order because even my own trade can’t be bothered to look at what their colleagues on fixed/rotary wing do, demonstrated by the awful ‘my jobs better than your job’ slurry on Pprune last year.
If you do take any interest then here’s a little taster of my ‘Big Air Force’ career to date:
1983 Join up.
1986 Become ALM.
1988 Terms of reference changed removing right of time promotion. Promotion was the only way to get ANY pay increase. However I get ‘reserved rights’ to time promotion pay scales.
1994 Start to be paid as FS even though Sgt.
1995 Offer of promotion to FS, with adjuncts! Categorically told (sadly not in writing) that this included offer of service to age 55. If accepted would have to sign on to new terms of service (no right to Masters pay/pension). If turned down would NEVER be offered again. Service past 22 year point would be refused. Signed on to new terms, looking to start a family.
1999 RAF signing just about anything with a brevet on past 22 year point. I got offered my FS on ‘merit’. It was rammed down my throat but I’d had to work for it. Perverse! Now every toe rag that’d been in long enough for the pay but were unfit promotion got signed on with their Masters pay (and pension) in their back pocket.
2001 I’m left behind on the low band of pay.
2002 I’m sat here typing this.
Please guys, if you’ve read this far and know nothing about SNCO Aircrew other than what you read on here get out and meet some of us. We come across as complete Muppets on Pprune because we’re always so bitter and twisted, come and have a look at what we do, it is honestly up there with the navs and we are just as cack handed!
Cheapseat
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Cheapseat - Sadly a typical tale for many NCO aircrew. If your case does not reflect what a poor state the cadre is in, then I dont know what will.
PS. Not that it will make you feel any better, but my own situation is identical to yours (apart from the years!), and I an seriuosly wondering if it is worth it at all?
PS. Not that it will make you feel any better, but my own situation is identical to yours (apart from the years!), and I an seriuosly wondering if it is worth it at all?
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BEagle
Sorry to disappoint, but it would seem that the “Non-remuneration staff action” referred to in the AFPRB report is the current drive to recruit AEOp’s (glossy mag adverts, new website etc etc).
Assuming you apply the same criteria (IPP –5yrs etc), most of the AA who would have been targeted are mature adults in their mid 30’s, not spotty faced teenagers. These guy’s have given most of their adult lives to an organisation that has treated them shoddily and has relied on their sense of Loyalty and Duty to ignore this treatment. Whether it has been changes in term of service, pay down banding, manning deficiencies, broken promises on promotion or additional pay, this may be the last straw for a lot of talented and highly professional people. We can only tolerate so much.
Loyalty and respect is a two way process, it must be earned and it cannot be demanded. Sadly, I feel that many AA will now accept the inevitable, the Service they joined with so much enthusiasm and optimism in the mid 80’s is now just a memory.
I’m sure that all NCO Aircrew, regardless of trade and rank, would love to believe in your sincere optimism. Unfortunately, this time, I feel that is all it will be. But thanks for your support, it’s nice to know that some appreciate us.
. .Airman Aircrew, RIP.
[ 01 February 2002: Message edited by: retard rearcrew ]</p>
Sorry to disappoint, but it would seem that the “Non-remuneration staff action” referred to in the AFPRB report is the current drive to recruit AEOp’s (glossy mag adverts, new website etc etc).
Assuming you apply the same criteria (IPP –5yrs etc), most of the AA who would have been targeted are mature adults in their mid 30’s, not spotty faced teenagers. These guy’s have given most of their adult lives to an organisation that has treated them shoddily and has relied on their sense of Loyalty and Duty to ignore this treatment. Whether it has been changes in term of service, pay down banding, manning deficiencies, broken promises on promotion or additional pay, this may be the last straw for a lot of talented and highly professional people. We can only tolerate so much.
Loyalty and respect is a two way process, it must be earned and it cannot be demanded. Sadly, I feel that many AA will now accept the inevitable, the Service they joined with so much enthusiasm and optimism in the mid 80’s is now just a memory.
I’m sure that all NCO Aircrew, regardless of trade and rank, would love to believe in your sincere optimism. Unfortunately, this time, I feel that is all it will be. But thanks for your support, it’s nice to know that some appreciate us.
. .Airman Aircrew, RIP.
[ 01 February 2002: Message edited by: retard rearcrew ]</p>
