Dan D'air

Does it perchance stand for Trolling Despite Turning out to be a W & a C??

goudie

Close enough Dan

Dan D'air

flipflopman RB199

Knowing the back seater, I'm still trying to work out whether the seat ejected him from the aircraft, or whether it actually pushed the earth away


Flipflopman

Bo Nalls

Maybe I'm stating the obvious here but, why are the nosegear doors closed? Hard to tell, but there's also no evidence of the main gear being down. From reports on this site and elsewhere was this not a landing incident? Was this a wheels-up landing? The longitudinal scrapes under the fuselage could also add more evidence to this.

Lurking123

Interesting, I'll bin my pitot theory and go for......

Biggles turns final without gear. Caravan controller too busy reading Heat/Cosmopolitan/porn magazine and Biggles lands wheels up having not got a red flare. Pi$$ed off with ATC for not doing their job, Biggles dabs in a bit of left rudder, takes aim and then jumps out.

Of course, I could be very wrong.

(All comments completely tongue in cheek)

taxydual

Surely, if it was a wheels-up landing, the 'scandal' would have leaked by now. Cranners can't be that zip-lipped.

Al R

Lost track of this one, glad the blokes are ok.

IF there was a cock up (and I'm thinking about the principles, not the specifics) then some posts here are stupid, tasteless, tacky and downright innapropriate for many reasons, including legal ones. Crap like that belongs in The Sunday Sport. I hope that the person who posted what he did earlier, is ashamed. But if you're the sort of person who would post that anyway, then somehow I don't think shame is ever going to be an issue.

I have complained this week about Osbaston TV coverage, because BBC and Ch4 reported that the alleged murderer 'ran' around the house, in a 'frenzied' state and 'splashing' accelarant everywhere when no one knows what happened. One report even suggested the chronology of events. I am getting to hate spurious and speculative crap dressed up as information so lets have none of that here. Lets stick the knife in when its needed, lets raise issues and lets argue like hell when we have to, but lets not cause harm and injury to innocent people, reputations and family simply because we think we can.

No matter what happened here (I haven't got a clue, its not my place to speculate or be judgemental and frankly, its not that important to me), the crew is innocent until process has been served and passed judgement. Whatever happened on that day, I know who I'd rather break bread with given the choice - the process may not be always perfect, but its a damned site better than aircrew character assasination by spineless, anonymous wankers on the internet.

And if someone (as suggested) IS insider dealing and handing out imagined or real info as tittle tattle which only gets diluted further, then I hope the bastard is tracked down and strung up by their balls/clitoris.

PICKS135

Al R wrote




The BOI will decide what happened. All that should matter at the moment is when things went to ratsh1t, the MB cloud avoidance system worked, and 2 people hobbled away alive.

Lurking123

Al R, someone touch a nerve?

Anyone who bothers to read this forum needs to take serious note of the words in red at the bottom of each page. You only need to have a look at the BA038 discussion (which in most respects is far more interesting and relevant than another Hawk steaming off the side of a runway) to realise that there is a load of crap (self included) spouted here.

Picks - agreed. An additional question that needs to be asked is about the safeguarding of manned facilities around an aerodrome. There is little/no doubt that those in ATC had a bit of a close call.

MAINJAFAD

Yes you are, noted it as well. However, its the BoI's job to work out the reason why, not yours, mine or anybody else on an open public forum.

Al R

Possibly, another coffee wouldn't have gone amiss before I wrote that.

But even though I might have mellowed it a little, I still mean it. Free speech and publishing comes with rights, but also responsibilities, and just because there's a thread about BA038, does that mean 2 wrongs make a right? I'm not suggesting censureship, but more a sense of responsibility. Instead of jumping to the defence of daft posts, lets spare a thought for the people it was aimed at.

I don't know the crew from Adam, but neither I imagine, did the poster. I know the military is a tough dog eat dog environment and no place for shrinking violets, but if you're not man enough to level accusations to someone's face, then it speaks more of you if you strike up a new identity here to do it.

And finally, when I was learning to lead men, my section commander told me about keeping counsel: "Never slag someone else off for getting lost, having an ND or being a fat bastard - you never know when its going to happen to you". If TDTWC is aircrew, then he could do with remembering the logic. If he isn't, as I suspect, then when he's walked a mile in somoene else's boots, he might just be worth the steam off their sh#t?

1588

"However, its the BoI's job to work out the reason why, not yours, mine or anybody else on an open public forum. "

I made exactly the same comment on the original thread that had been deleted and my stance remains.

I am dumbfounded by the stupidity of some of the posters here and hope that all of them aren't current aircrew who should know better.

I have heard that the SIB are investigating the leaked pictures too so hopefully those who deserve it will be appropriately "rebriefed".

Double Zero

I don't know the crew - just happy they are safe - but one thing remarkable about this incident is that comments immediately went to banter or worse, with little or no speculation ( it's a rumour network, & in the best instance may even lead to lessons learned, not finger pointing ) - as to what caused the crew to get out...

A few little points -

No matter how it appears, the thing didn't land vertically like something out of Hotshots, so I'm not surprised by longitudinal scrapes.

Why is the tailfin so badly damaged - explosion on impact ? Unusual.

What is the black tape around the pitot ?

Not looking for conspiracies here, though one problem with this picture ( situation ) springs to mind...

It's quite normal for shots of incidents to be out in the public quickly, so the delay then hysteria seem begging conspiracy theorists; I think I can guess roughly what happened, but will not bother stating it here, and the world isn't waiting for my opinion !

Pure Pursuit

SIB...Leaked pictures, why are the Army involved? I think P&SS may be weeing in the wind when you take into account the approved photos shown by the BBC. Perhaps the Reds are expecting a little too much protection, if you are RAFAT???

I seem to remember you making a rather silly post on the last thread, which resulted in a little flaming from the guys. Neither this thread (or the last one for that matter) come across as a witch hunt so, chill out people! It's just a bunch of guys guessing and no posts will have any impact on the BOI. I very much doubt that any of the board members are reading this!

Personally, I blame the bird in the tower for getting her tits out whilst DW was on short finals. Might have got away with it if the back seater hadn't shouted, "F**K ME they are huge!" at 50ft...

No wonder the jet veered towards the tower.

Op_Twenty

2008 guys, not the 1950's - stop all this 'wait 'till the BOI' stuff, you're posting on a 'RUMOUR' site. If you don't like the RUMOURS go post somewhere else. Find the TRUTH forum and post there, as far as I'm concerned it seems reasonably obvious what happened but why? I don't know but I'm as happy as everyone else to speculate.

Rumour - Idle speculation, general talk or opinions of uncertain reliability.

Questions?

scarecrow450

Well at least it'll give the SIB something to do, will their brain on a chain be house trained ?

Just noticed the title of PPRUNE includes 'Rumour Network' guess some others did'nt !

longer ron

Double Zero... I think the 'black tape' you refer to may be the rubber sealing assembly (pitot to nose seal) which has slipped forward in the excitement.

regards b

Double Zero

Longer On,

( great callsign BTW, some people think I'm a James Bond wannabee while I was in fact referring to Dastardly & Muttley's car ! )

I'm used to seeing Hawks in every stage of build - they were not a Wart On product, no matter what they would have one believe - and that doesn't look like the pitot / nose seal.

I am not for a second suggesting it's relevant, just wonder what it is - a bit late for blanking off.

Still, all sorts of wierd things happen in accidents, I have been in the wrong place at the wrong time as passenger in a few car accidents where some silly things happened which seemed at the edges of the laws of physics - anyway the end result was exactly the same as that film of the display Mig's colliding, and the reported ' later injury ' to the guy responsible !

I would add that the chap who crashed me in a car was the idiot, the Mig pair just got unlucky while performing a very skilled & tasking manouvre -

in the meantime, is there a contract going to supply loo rolls and 'calmer down pills ' to Cranwell ATC ?!

Please don't take that seriously, I would think it was a bad shake up or worse for those in ATC, not dissimilar from taking a large missile near hit.

dick.tracy

Yes, the "black tape" is, as suggested, the sealing rubber from the pitot/nose join. I have replaced many. There is a reinforced bolt hole through the middle, and it bolts just above the nose lamp assembly. The lamp is visibly trashed, so no surprise, it has migrated down the pitot head. In other words, normal.

Oh, and onother thing - if photos are to be believed, the photo of the A/C taking off had both crew wearing white helmets - If, as has been suggested, the pilot was RAFAT, he would, I am sure, be wearing his RAFAT "arrowed " helmet.

For info, the aircraft stored for future Red Arrows use are at RAF Shawbury, not Valley as many may believe...