Senior Officer Takes Responsibility
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Senior Officer Takes Responsibility
BBC NEWS | World | Europe | French chief quits over shooting
Respect to him.
At what point should the head of a military organization take direct responsibility for a foul-up?
Respect to him.
At what point should the head of a military organization take direct responsibility for a foul-up?
Last edited by GasFitter; 2nd Jul 2008 at 11:53.
At what point should the head of a military organization take direct responsibility for a foul-up?
The theoretical answer is - very early on. However, for the current issue, which is what one would earnestly hope was in the nature of an one-off, I'm not sure that I would expect it to merit a resignation at that level.
This is especially relevant when one considers that on the occasion of the last notable resignation in the UK, when in 1966 the then First Sea Lord, Admiral Sir David Luce, resigned in protest over the issue of the cancellation of CVA-01, which I hope I may describe as a much more serious long-term issue, it scarcely caused a ripple even in the short-term.
I appreciate that this was not strictly a foul up as such, since the real villain of the piece was Denis Healey, but that to my mind only serves to enhance the level of Admiral Luce's integrity.
In the same context, it will be interesting to see what happens at the top if/when the Royal Navy's two promised carriers are cancelled.....
Incidentally, in 1966, the entire Admiralty Board, including the Navy Minister, tendered their resignations but were subsequently dissuaded from doing so by Admiral Luce on the basis that such an act would have far too great long term consequences for the Navy.
Jack
PS Back to la belle France - I appreciate that General is not a para, but did he jump or was he pushed?
The theoretical answer is - very early on. However, for the current issue, which is what one would earnestly hope was in the nature of an one-off, I'm not sure that I would expect it to merit a resignation at that level.
This is especially relevant when one considers that on the occasion of the last notable resignation in the UK, when in 1966 the then First Sea Lord, Admiral Sir David Luce, resigned in protest over the issue of the cancellation of CVA-01, which I hope I may describe as a much more serious long-term issue, it scarcely caused a ripple even in the short-term.
I appreciate that this was not strictly a foul up as such, since the real villain of the piece was Denis Healey, but that to my mind only serves to enhance the level of Admiral Luce's integrity.
In the same context, it will be interesting to see what happens at the top if/when the Royal Navy's two promised carriers are cancelled.....
Incidentally, in 1966, the entire Admiralty Board, including the Navy Minister, tendered their resignations but were subsequently dissuaded from doing so by Admiral Luce on the basis that such an act would have far too great long term consequences for the Navy.
Jack
PS Back to la belle France - I appreciate that General is not a para, but did he jump or was he pushed?
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Interesting Jack ....
In this case, fortunately, there has not been any loss of life. Whereas, for example, if you take the issue of the Hercules Low Fly Past that killed a soldier, would we expect CAS to resign?
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According to the Getelarph, General Cuche resigned because the President did not acknowledge his salute, prodded him in the chest and said, "You are irresponsible; you are unprofessional."
Carcassonne shootings
The Left wing media in France is trying to spin this resignation following the Carcassonne shootings into an indication of Général Cuche's disagreement with the restructuring of the French military recently announced by President Sarkozy (Army to lose 54,000).
Général Cuche has publicly rebutted this interpretation in a statement in which he said that "..as the head of the Army he carried the responsibility for "serious dysfunctions" (sounds better in French) and that all other interpretations are completely unfounded."
Honourable man.
Général Cuche has publicly rebutted this interpretation in a statement in which he said that "..as the head of the Army he carried the responsibility for "serious dysfunctions" (sounds better in French) and that all other interpretations are completely unfounded."
Honourable man.
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Gawd, someone of Flag Rank taking it on the chin? Who'd have thunk it? Can't see it happening where English is spoken - in either hemisphere. Where English is spoken, responsibility for any disaster/cockup, no matter how major, seems to hit the (armoured) glass ceiling at about Lt Col or equivalent level -if they can't find a Corporal they can pin it on.
According to the Getelarph, General Cuche resigned because the President did not acknowledge his salute, prodded him in the chest ......
Scribes - So he was pushed!
Jack
PS for Gas Fitter - " ... if you take the issue of the Hercules Low Fly Past that killed a soldier, would we expect CAS to resign?" No, certainly not in my view because of the very different factors involved.
Scribes - So he was pushed!
Jack
PS for Gas Fitter - " ... if you take the issue of the Hercules Low Fly Past that killed a soldier, would we expect CAS to resign?" No, certainly not in my view because of the very different factors involved.
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Wouldn't happen in Australia - they would have just called the paras cowboys:
http://www.pprune.org/forums/rotorhe...g-cowboys.html
http://www.pprune.org/forums/rotorhe...g-cowboys.html
Wiley
There's a couple of jobs up for grabs at the top of the USAF, following 'resignations' over missing nukes etc. I know they don't speak our version of english but.....
There's a couple of jobs up for grabs at the top of the USAF, following 'resignations' over missing nukes etc. I know they don't speak our version of english but.....
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Quoted from the BBC article:
So the regulations are already in place to supposedly prevent this sort of thing from happening, but they were clearly ignored (albeit inadvertently). Yep, the General was pushed, alright.....
The Baffler
It is now thought he had held on to some live ammunition from a previous exercise in breach of regulations and mistakenly loaded them into his assault rifle during the display.
The Baffler
French. Regulations...... Riiiiiiiiiggggggghhhhhhhttt....
One imagines Les Grenouilles probably have quite a lot of unused live ammo.
And, as told to me by an Airbus test pilot:
A German, a Brit and a Frenchman all receive a shiny new aeroplane and an Operating Manual.
The German looks in the book to find the rules for a particular procedure. No rules - no can do.
The Brit looks in the book to see if there's anything prohibiting from doing the procedure. Nothing written down - well, it must be OK then.
The Frenchman looks puzzled. "Book? What book?"
One imagines Les Grenouilles probably have quite a lot of unused live ammo.
And, as told to me by an Airbus test pilot:
A German, a Brit and a Frenchman all receive a shiny new aeroplane and an Operating Manual.
The German looks in the book to find the rules for a particular procedure. No rules - no can do.
The Brit looks in the book to see if there's anything prohibiting from doing the procedure. Nothing written down - well, it must be OK then.
The Frenchman looks puzzled. "Book? What book?"
