VC10s in Nice
Join Date: Mar 2007
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Occwmf
Clearly a fellow Gentlemen chap with your command of Grammar.
But what a misguided Moron you present yourself as.
Not for one moment did I suggest that they would all instantly be leaving the Force. But, as this will end F3 Ops at Leeming, the vast majority will be posted to pastures new.
At the same approximate time, 43 join 56 to form a 'Super' Sqn and thus also reducing in numbers of personnel. Rocket scientists apart I will assist you with the math...... The equivalent of 1.5 Sqn's worth of Gingers and Aircrew mates all now needing new postings. The F3 world would seem to be full so the experience of that frame, either maintaining or flying, on overseas excerise is wasted.
Yes, life experience expands as a result of the deployment but as it is training a specific unit to operate together, primarily as a coherent and capable force, the impetous of the training is wasted.
So, my cretinous friend, I stand by my previous post and wonder if it is not more likely that you have a finger in a hole....... and I bet you like it too!!
But what a misguided Moron you present yourself as.
Not for one moment did I suggest that they would all instantly be leaving the Force. But, as this will end F3 Ops at Leeming, the vast majority will be posted to pastures new.
At the same approximate time, 43 join 56 to form a 'Super' Sqn and thus also reducing in numbers of personnel. Rocket scientists apart I will assist you with the math...... The equivalent of 1.5 Sqn's worth of Gingers and Aircrew mates all now needing new postings. The F3 world would seem to be full so the experience of that frame, either maintaining or flying, on overseas excerise is wasted.
Yes, life experience expands as a result of the deployment but as it is training a specific unit to operate together, primarily as a coherent and capable force, the impetous of the training is wasted.
So, my cretinous friend, I stand by my previous post and wonder if it is not more likely that you have a finger in a hole....... and I bet you like it too!!
Join Date: Jun 2000
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Jayand justify this then:
Why the hell should crews that are on average flying every other night or day in support of ops on an infinitely variable swing shift system and those ground crew supporting them are forced to stay in the DOB at Muscat yet those just transitting through can get HOTAC at public expense. How can that be justified? Don't give me s$$t about being on a different fleet we are from the same group and there are spare rooms here. Maybe you should become more realistic towards what the RAF can really afford these days....We are a tin pot outfit surviving on a shoestring. If you don't like that then bang out!
Yes I enjoyed time in HOTAC during Gulf 1 and ops dets in between but money is tight and when there is a perfectly satisfactorary DOB here then get a grip and join in with the rest of us. Maybe you will realise what it means to be operational!! You may learn something you never know!
PS Jeyand
I owned my own house near Benson so
. You can afford what you want to.
Why the hell should crews that are on average flying every other night or day in support of ops on an infinitely variable swing shift system and those ground crew supporting them are forced to stay in the DOB at Muscat yet those just transitting through can get HOTAC at public expense. How can that be justified? Don't give me s$$t about being on a different fleet we are from the same group and there are spare rooms here. Maybe you should become more realistic towards what the RAF can really afford these days....We are a tin pot outfit surviving on a shoestring. If you don't like that then bang out!
Yes I enjoyed time in HOTAC during Gulf 1 and ops dets in between but money is tight and when there is a perfectly satisfactorary DOB here then get a grip and join in with the rest of us. Maybe you will realise what it means to be operational!! You may learn something you never know!
PS Jeyand
I owned my own house near Benson so
. You can afford what you want to.
Last edited by nav attacking; 22nd Feb 2008 at 19:25. Reason: IAW NotAms
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"Yes I enjoyed time in HOTAC during Gulf 1 and ops dets in between but money is tight and when there is a perfectly satisfactorary DOB here then get a grip and join in with the rest of us"
Only a Nav could suggest something so stupid
Only a Nav could suggest something so stupid
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Just down the road from ISK
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I did actually ask to go 10's once but I was told that I would have to work a lot harder to be crap enough to get chopped from a real aircraft first!!
Not that I'm saying you were chopped Jayand - just for public record!
Not that I'm saying you were chopped Jayand - just for public record!
Join Date: Feb 2008
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Originally Posted by VageRot
I did actually ask to go 10's once but I was told that I would have to work a lot harder to be crap enough to get chopped from a real aircraft first!!
Laughed so loud at this I had to open a profile instead of just browsing!!
We certainly do tend to send our rejects South for a simpler life don't we!!
Join Date: Nov 2007
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NA and VR I have spent many weeks every year at seeb for the last 6 years, so don't preach to me like I don't know what I am talking about!
I have witnessed on numerous occasions VC10, tristar, fast jet and a multitude of other aircraft types and their crews pass through seeb, most of whom have stayed off base, and it has never bothered me in the slightest.
I am not the one whingeing! if you don't like it do as you say and bang out!
I have witnessed on numerous occasions VC10, tristar, fast jet and a multitude of other aircraft types and their crews pass through seeb, most of whom have stayed off base, and it has never bothered me in the slightest.
I am not the one whingeing! if you don't like it do as you say and bang out!
Nav Attacking,
You don't seem very happy mate. I would like to think that you have genuine concerns about MOD expenditure and your post about HOTAC was driven by a desire to promote frugality in all we do. (But I guess you are looking forward to the arrival of the MRA4)
I cannot help thinking however, that your driving motivation is the sheer jealousy of seeing crews climb on a bus and head off to a hotel while you remain on the DOB. I have experienced the accommodation on the det and the accommodation downtown. I can assure you that the chances of being well rested prior to an 0200 report are vastly improved if crew rest has been taken in a quiet hotel room rather than a portakabin with a 90db Air Conditioner and all the associated noise of Seeb at pub closing time. Fact!!
That being the case, perhaps you would like to explain to me why flight safety should take a back seat to everybody sharing in your (and others) discomfort? I assume you would be willing to pitch a 12 by 12 and live in that as a mark of solidarity with those who can only dream of life in a portakabin.
I salute you sir, if you are not already one, I am sure you will make a fine senior officer.
You don't seem very happy mate. I would like to think that you have genuine concerns about MOD expenditure and your post about HOTAC was driven by a desire to promote frugality in all we do. (But I guess you are looking forward to the arrival of the MRA4)
I cannot help thinking however, that your driving motivation is the sheer jealousy of seeing crews climb on a bus and head off to a hotel while you remain on the DOB. I have experienced the accommodation on the det and the accommodation downtown. I can assure you that the chances of being well rested prior to an 0200 report are vastly improved if crew rest has been taken in a quiet hotel room rather than a portakabin with a 90db Air Conditioner and all the associated noise of Seeb at pub closing time. Fact!!
That being the case, perhaps you would like to explain to me why flight safety should take a back seat to everybody sharing in your (and others) discomfort? I assume you would be willing to pitch a 12 by 12 and live in that as a mark of solidarity with those who can only dream of life in a portakabin.
I salute you sir, if you are not already one, I am sure you will make a fine senior officer.
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Originally Posted by arty fufkin
That being the case, perhaps you would like to explain to me why flight safety should take a back seat to everybody sharing in your (and others) discomfort? I assume you would be willing to pitch a 12 by 12 and live in that as a mark of solidarity with those who can only dream of life in a portakabin.
As the impartial newcomer hare: The MR2 fleet, In-theatre Tristar, Merlin and Herc crews seem to manage on the DOB with all sorts of weird and wonderful departure times so, if you have a FS precedent that those fleets could quote to 2Gp then I'm sure that they would love to have the reference - especially as everyone is part of 2Gp now!!
Serious bit over! Why can't people just have a bit of banter these days? Then again, lack of a sence of humour always was a truckie trait!!
I'd love to quote the exact GASOs that detail acceptable levels of accommodation but those particular orders have been conveniently removed. 
With regards to the Flt Saftey issue, surely the goal is to ensure that crews are affored the best rest that is possible. If it is possible to put all personel in better accommodation that should be the goal. If it is only posible to offer decent accommodation to transiting crews, why not? We have all flown absoloutely knackered in the past and will all do it again if the nature of the task demands it. I do however fail to see what is wrong with reducing the inherent risks if it is within our means to do so.
Personaly, if im one of 230 passengers being landed in a 200' cloudbase with 30kts across after a 8 hr night flight, I wouldn't begrudge the pilot a shot at some decent rest before hand. Mind you, I'm obviously a coward!!
Standing by, white feather in hand.
With regards to the Flt Saftey issue, surely the goal is to ensure that crews are affored the best rest that is possible. If it is possible to put all personel in better accommodation that should be the goal. If it is only posible to offer decent accommodation to transiting crews, why not? We have all flown absoloutely knackered in the past and will all do it again if the nature of the task demands it. I do however fail to see what is wrong with reducing the inherent risks if it is within our means to do so.
Personaly, if im one of 230 passengers being landed in a 200' cloudbase with 30kts across after a 8 hr night flight, I wouldn't begrudge the pilot a shot at some decent rest before hand. Mind you, I'm obviously a coward!!
Standing by, white feather in hand.
Join Date: Nov 2003
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arty fufkin!!
well said mate! Thats what its all about, making sure joe punter all 200 of em get home safely, and hopefully on time ish! ducking for inbound on that one
As for Nav attacking hmmm obviously the tranisting crew are just that they only see the place once, err NOT! have a look at the crews when they come through and how often, and sticking up for the back end crew here, dont forget with an augmented crew we can do 24 hr crew day, have a look what constitutes an augmented crew and maybe you might re think why a decent bed is worth its weight in gold. And obviously we stick rigidly to the 24 hrs prior to augmented crew ops
As for ops hmmmmm so ask yourself where the heck do you think the jets arrive from??
well said mate! Thats what its all about, making sure joe punter all 200 of em get home safely, and hopefully on time ish! ducking for inbound on that one
As for Nav attacking hmmm obviously the tranisting crew are just that they only see the place once, err NOT! have a look at the crews when they come through and how often, and sticking up for the back end crew here, dont forget with an augmented crew we can do 24 hr crew day, have a look what constitutes an augmented crew and maybe you might re think why a decent bed is worth its weight in gold. And obviously we stick rigidly to the 24 hrs prior to augmented crew ops
As for ops hmmmmm so ask yourself where the heck do you think the jets arrive from??
In more civilised times, before Blair and his Bush bum-sucking wars, I recall being obliged to double up in detachment accommodation so that a number of 'transit' rooms could be kept free for Ascoteers....
It is often much simpler to throw the problem at others (Hotel W'at Ever - a contract for 10 rooms for the next 3 years please) than it is to pi$$ of fresidents with the embuggeration of sorting out transit arrangements for every transiting crew. Plus it also liberates more space for those on detachments.
Even so-called 'permanent' bases such as Akrotiri found it difficult to manage the chaos of Ascot movements at the turn of the century - much easier (though less enjoyable) to get the Episkopiana to sort it all out.
However, those living in $hit in Incapability Browne's war zones will not be easily persuaded, no matter how cogent the argument.
It is often much simpler to throw the problem at others (Hotel W'at Ever - a contract for 10 rooms for the next 3 years please) than it is to pi$$ of fresidents with the embuggeration of sorting out transit arrangements for every transiting crew. Plus it also liberates more space for those on detachments.
Even so-called 'permanent' bases such as Akrotiri found it difficult to manage the chaos of Ascot movements at the turn of the century - much easier (though less enjoyable) to get the Episkopiana to sort it all out.
However, those living in $hit in Incapability Browne's war zones will not be easily persuaded, no matter how cogent the argument.
Join Date: Apr 2003
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Nice was nice!!
Yeah Nice was nice we were pre positioned for a trail and to stay there for the night saved about £20000 in airframe hours and maintenance, so I was told. As an ex kipper fleet dude I've done tents and portacabins and still do out in the deid so dry your eyes and start sharin the love cos us tanker dudes ain't all that bad
!!
