Good EFATO clip
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2001
Location: ask petf
Posts: 26
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Good EFATO clip
Found this as a throw away link on a thread in JB. I appreciate it's not directly Mil related, but seems to me to be a very good example of a well handled emergency that we could all learn a bit from.
Whizz, bang, oops...
Comments please.
Whizz, bang, oops...
Comments please.
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 1,089
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Only once in 25 years have I needed to declare a mayday and this brought back memories of the FANTASTIC calm professionalism of UK ATC. In my case it was a complete loss of instruments when in clear air "on top" so not quite the emergency that these guys had but I shall always be grateful for ATC
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Nigit
Posts: 435
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Yeah, good job, but surely he should have downgraded to a Pan once the immediate danger had passed? I'd imagine the initial incident was a bit bottom-clenching, but surely the rest was nothing he hadn't practiced umpteen times in the sim?
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: South of the Watford Gap, East of Portland
Posts: 255
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
MAYDAY - The aircraft is threatened with serious and imminent danger. After the engine had been shut down and certainly after the crew advised a normal recovery would be made 'serious and imminent danger' had passed, I would suggest, and a 'downgrade' to a PAN justified. It can help to take the drama out of what was a crisis.
JetBlast member 2005.
JetBlast member 2006.
Banned 2007
JetBlast member 2006.
Banned 2007
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: The US of A - sort of
Posts: 10
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
surely he should have downgraded to a Pan once the immediate danger had passed
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Glasgow
Posts: 281
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
ProfessionalStudent,
Yeah probably, however, the choice to downgrade the MAYDAY it is not going to be on his mind in a heavy weight 757. It is quite low on the list of priorities really.
L Met
Yeah probably, however, the choice to downgrade the MAYDAY it is not going to be on his mind in a heavy weight 757. It is quite low on the list of priorities really.
L Met
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Solihull
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This is the first thing i got told and to this day i will never forget it, as a result i have included it as my first rule of thumb – this is military btw. However the vast majority of pilots including civilian adopt it to their everyday flying and I certainly would regard it as being my bible.
1. Aviate – Fly the A/C, Assess Situation, Deal with it in a calm and controlled manor.
2. Navigate – Decide where you are going and potentially land.
3. Communicate – Your Situation AND Intentions.
All of this depends on the situation in hand. So it may differ. It is only a guidline.
But a sure good one, i sincerely believe.
Thumbs, up to the Thomson Pilots. Very impressive!
1. Aviate – Fly the A/C, Assess Situation, Deal with it in a calm and controlled manor.
2. Navigate – Decide where you are going and potentially land.
3. Communicate – Your Situation AND Intentions.
All of this depends on the situation in hand. So it may differ. It is only a guidline.
But a sure good one, i sincerely believe.
Thumbs, up to the Thomson Pilots. Very impressive!
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Hong Kong
Age: 60
Posts: 491
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Fine professional example. Also very impressed with ATC, having a calm helpful voice in your ear in a tight spot is akin to an "Angel on your shoulder" for the poetic, or having the ref on your side for the less so. 
JetBlast member 2005.
JetBlast member 2006.
Banned 2007
JetBlast member 2006.
Banned 2007
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: The US of A - sort of
Posts: 10
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
OT but,
My dad told me a similar one, namely that BSM stood not for British School of Motoring, but Brakes Signal Mirrors
My dad told me a similar one, namely that BSM stood not for British School of Motoring, but Brakes Signal Mirrors
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: England
Posts: 488
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I disagree with those who think that the emergency should have been downgraded. The loss of one engine on a twin-jet public transport aircraft certainly warrants a mayday. What advantage would be gained by then downgrading? Remaining on a mayday keeps ATC focussed (and hopefully quiet) and everyone else out of the way. On my current type if I lose 50% of installed thrust I will declare and maintain a mayday, notwithstanding that in such circumstances I have the added luxury of still having 2 engines running.
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Aberdeen, Scotland
Posts: 124
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Mayday is for immediate risk to the aircraft or occupants.
If the aircraft was in a position to go and hold at WAL then there is no immediate risk and the call would have been better downgraded to a PAN.
If the aircraft was in a position to go and hold at WAL then there is no immediate risk and the call would have been better downgraded to a PAN.
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: .....................................
Posts: 365
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Maybe you should write to the TUi chief pilot and tell him. I guess he could have the Captain in for a bollocking or maybe an extra sim ride.
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Under The Sea
Posts: 84
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Take a heavy 757 with the loss of an engine, and full of passengers.
What would you do?
On landing you have still lost one engine, so no reverse thrust, and the jet is still heavy.
Yes crews do train in a simulator, so what.
What would you do?
On landing you have still lost one engine, so no reverse thrust, and the jet is still heavy.
Yes crews do train in a simulator, so what.
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Falmouth
Posts: 1,651
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I was always taught that MAYDAY means ..... I am in imminent danger and in need of immediate assistance.
whereas PAN, PAN, PAN means.... I have an urgent message to transmit.
There are no hard and fast rues as to when and where you make each call. The type of transmission rests entirely with the Aircraft commander / Captain.
In my view, they had a serious emergency here. They knew that a bird had gone down the intake, causing a serious fire. The engine fire was extinguised by securing the enging and then chucking a heap load of foam down it. They didn't know if there was any other damage to the aircraft following the bird strike. They didn't know if the fire had spread to other parts of the aircraft. They had a load of scared and frightened passengers on board.
They did exactly the correcr thing in maintaining the MAYDAY.
whereas PAN, PAN, PAN means.... I have an urgent message to transmit.
There are no hard and fast rues as to when and where you make each call. The type of transmission rests entirely with the Aircraft commander / Captain.
In my view, they had a serious emergency here. They knew that a bird had gone down the intake, causing a serious fire. The engine fire was extinguised by securing the enging and then chucking a heap load of foam down it. They didn't know if there was any other damage to the aircraft following the bird strike. They didn't know if the fire had spread to other parts of the aircraft. They had a load of scared and frightened passengers on board.
They did exactly the correcr thing in maintaining the MAYDAY.
Red On, Green On
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Between the woods and the water
Age: 24
Posts: 6,487
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes
on
2 Posts
The primary task of the Captain and FO is to ensure the safety of all on board. The Mayday had to stay in force until the fire crews confirmed that the aircraft was safe to taxi to the terminal.
