Canberra hours

[longer ron]

Originally Posted by Sldm

Peter , longer Ron and Paul, thank you so much for remembering my father John Dennis’s tragic accident nearly 50 years ago . I am so pleased The navigator ejected successfully . It sounds like it was hard to get out of an ejection (from older type of ejection seats ) without some sort of injury if you did manage to get out of the Canberra- which sounds very tricky

Incidentally John was the same age my son is now, really just a boy .

if anyone knew him personally I would really welcome a contact

Hi Sldm
Welcome to the forum and with a really nicely written post.
Yes the early ejection seats had a fairly powerful explosive cartridge (main gun cart) to clear the seat from the aircraft which could cause spinal and other injuries,the later rocket seats had a smaller main gun cart just to move the seat a few feet and then the rocket pack would fire and clear the seat well away from the aircraft.

regards LR

[Wander00]

BB standardised me once, back in the 60s

[Wander00]

But I definitely flew it to Wroughton in about 66, and was told that was its last flight. Might possibly have been made serviceable for a last flight to St Athan. Anyone got the aircraft log book?

[Old_Slartibartfast]

Originally Posted by longer ron

The ejection sequence on Canberras was fairly 'slow' in that upon initiating ejection both the navigators hatch and the pilots canopy were jettisoned (using explosive bolts) and only then could the seat 'fire' out of the aircraft,the canberra (being a first generation jet) had older type ejection seats which did not have rocket packs,therefore any ejections had to be inside the seat limits (ie above a certain height/speed and less than a certain descent rate).

I made a very serious error whilst flying in the left hand rear seat in WT308 (what would normally be the nav seat, but the two B(I)6's we had had been modified for trials work, I was just a flight test observer). After shutting down I went to put the pins back in to find that the hatch wasn't armed. I'd flown the whole sortie with the explosive bolts disabled . . .

The seat rating was, I think, 400/400, i.e. 400ft minimum height AGL, 400kts minimum IAS. I can't remember a descent rate limit, but this was a long time ago, when WT308 and WT309 were still at Farnborough.

[reynoldsno1]

Does the B57 count as a Canberra 'variant'?

[57mm]

Works for me, a Canberra is a Canberra.

[wrymouth1]

Canberra WJ674 - 231 OCU

Dear SLDM

I thought you might like to know that I flew with your father on July 9th 1973 on a training exercise in a Canberra T4 (848). It was just a one off as he was not my student. As a matter of interest, four days later, I flew WJ674 from Cottesmore to Akrotiri returning on the 16th July. I did my last flight on 231 OCU four days later so I had left Cottesmore before your fathers terrible accident.

[Clyffe Pypard]

D o you know that you can get a grandfather clock into a Canberra T4 and fly it from St Eval to Wyton.

[oldbilbo]

Originally Posted by Jackonicko

How many variants?

What - in proper UK service?

I make it 23 with their own 'variant designation', though there were others - like the Elint B2s used by 192 Squadron, the recce-modded B2s used on Op Robin, etc. the B2 and B6 samplers, etc.

B2 - original bomber
B2T - one off with Decca, last with 100 Squadron?
B2E - ex-Boscombe, once fitted out for single seat operation (WK162, or 164?)
PR3 - original recce, usually two crew but three ejection seats???
T4 - trainer
B6 - bomber with integral wing tanks triple breech starters, bigger Avons, etc.
B6(BS) - as above with Blue Shadow, mainly for 109/139 Sqns, designation also used by B6 Mod
B6 Mod - four modified B6/B6(BS) for 51 Squadron for Elint role. Additional tail warning receivers, Elint antennas in nose, which initially followed 'normal' contours, before addition of T11 type nose, and finally extended rounded nose radome. Blue Shadow fitted. Three crew.
B(I)6 - as B6 with provision for gun pack in rear part of bomb bay, underwing hardpoints, LABS gear as standard. Three crew???
PR7 - recce version with integral wing tanks triple breech starters, bigger Avons, etc. Usually two crew but three ejection seats???
B(I)8 - interdictor/strike derivative of B6 with offset 'fighter type canopy' (non-opening) nav on rumble seat for take off, or sideways facing at forward plotting table or prone in the nose. Provision for gun pack (4 x 20mm Hispano) in rear part of bomb bay, underwing hardpoints, LABS gear as standard.
PR9 - recce version with opening offset 'fighter type canopy' for access, nav on ejection seat in front of pilot in sideways hinged nose, with frangible panel above. Powered ailerons.
U10 - drone conversion of B2
T11 - crew trainer for Javelin crews converted from B2, with AI radar in extended conical nose, long pitot boom on port wingtip. Did it have dual controls and an ejection seat for both pilots???
D14 - drone conversion of B2 with PR9 type powered controls
B15 - Converted B6 for the Akrotiri Strike Wing and 45 Squadron, Decca Doppler, underwing hardpoints for unguided rockets, and later Nord AS30 ASMs.
E15 - calibration conversion of B15
B16 - Converted B6 for the Akrotiri Strike Wing with Blue Shadow SLAR. (Did this supplant one of the rear crew ejection seats? Was this a two-crew aircraft?)
T17 - EW training conversion of B2, extended bulbous nose and numerous antenna fairings, scoops, etc. Long pitot boom on port wingtip.
T17A - Further conversion of T17, with new kit (externally identifiable by new underwing blade antennas
TT18 - Target towing conversion of B2 with underwing Rushton winches, extra window in starboard fuselage to allow nav to see starboard winch.
T19 - Silent target conversion of T11 with radar replaced by 'Blue Circle'.
T22 - Conversion of PR.Mk 7 with Buccaneer radar in extended nose. Intended as Buccaneer radar trainer for observers, but used as silent target.

I can't add to the above list of types 'in RAF service' but I can add the SAAF's Can B(I)12s - the export version of the B(I)8, some of which went to New Zealand. I had 3 years in those to add to my modest time in TT18s out of St Mawgan where I flew on occasion with S/Ldr Bruce Bull where he was QFI - and learned a darn sight more airmanship from him than I imagine he was aware of. That saved my bacon on a full fistful of occasions, which I'd gladly relate over a bottle of Islay malt, a jug of cold water, and two glasses.

The B(I)12 was used by the Hairybacks, during my time there, in the high-level PR role and also Low Level Strike. The guns were removed from the conformal gunpack and replaced with a multiple cameras fit. Although the medium-level bombing role was practised annually, after the aborted 'Thunder Run' towards Luanda in 1975 no-one considered it seriously. Instead, the Cans were used 'a la RAFG' in very low-level* penetration and FRA Laydown Strike using 'Alpha' bomblets, intended as defence suppression - and on several occasions followed in by SAAF Buccaneers S.50s with conventional dumb iron bombs in conventional pitch up/shallow dive-bombing profiles.

Two of those Cans were earmarked for service as South Africa's 'viable means of delivery' of their burgeoning deterrent, as the engineering 'state of the art' was - certainly initially - not capable of being fitted into the Bucc's bomb-bay.

*There were hundreds of miles of scrub/bush consisting of flat-top mopane thorn trees. We practised flying ON the treetops, when the Drivers/Airframe could just feel the 'whispers' of the twigs on the underbelly, scraping some paint off - causing some strange looks among the groundcrew on shutdown. I understand veterans of RAFG will have had similar tales to tell.....

[BBadanov]

Originally Posted by Jackonicko

How many variants?

What - in proper UK service?
I make it 23 with their own 'variant designation', though there were others - like the Elint B2s used by 192 Squadron, the recce-modded B2s used on Op Robin, etc. the B2 and B6 samplers, etc.
T19 - Silent target conversion of T11 with radar replaced by 'Blue Circle'.
T22 - Conversion of PR.Mk 7 with Buccaneer radar in extended nose. Intended as Buccaneer radar trainer for observers, but used as silent target.

So why the gap between Mark 19 (T.19) and Mark 22 (T.22) you may have thought?
These mark numbers were used for Australian production for the RAAF.
The Mk 20 (sometimes referred to incorrectly as the B.20, even in my logbook!) was for the bomber variant of the B.2 from 1953 and B.6 from 1956.
- But was the Mk 20 a B.2 or a B.6? Actually both. First production 27 aircraft were essentially B.2s, with "Avon Mk 1" (RA.3) engines and initially no integral fuel tanks.
The later production 21 aircraft were B.6s, more powerful "Mk 109" (RA.7) engines, integral tanks and better avionics fit (Green Satin doppler and GPI, and eventually UHF and TACAN). It was these newer aircraft that were deployed to Vietnam operations over 1967-1971.
- These later aircraft had been considered for designation in about 1956 as the Mk 22, but this did not eventuate.
The Mk 21 (similarly referred to as the T.21) was the trainer conversion of B.2s and Mk 20s, with no bang seats in the front, one in the back for the nav.
- The RAAF trainers retained the perspex bomber nose, not the solid T.4 nose.
- A pair of B.2s had been ferried from UK to act as pattern aircraft for Australian production, and these were subsequently converted to Mk 21 trainers in 1958.
- The very first Mk 20s too were subsequently converted to trainers over 1956/58.

[MrBernoulli]

Originally Posted by Clyffe Pypard

D o you know that you can get a grandfather clock into a Canberra T4 and fly it from St Eval to Wyton.

Okay. But why?

[Asturias56]

Saves on postage?

Checks on the on-board clock??

Backup???

Serious vison issues?????

[Martin the Martian]

Originally Posted by Asturias56

Saves on postage?

Checks on the on-board clock??

Backup???

Serious vison issues?????

Just an exaggerated way of proving that time flies.