Save The Red Arrows - Sign the Petition
Join Date: Aug 2005
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I have no time, and make no apologies, for this wretched so called Government, but they will not get rid of BBMF or RAFAT. That is not how things work. However they could save them.
The Treasury gives the RAF an inadequate sack of money for the tasks they are asked to perform. The Treasury then says, exceed your allowance and you are in the poo, so tell us what you consider worth saving and what should be binned to stay within budget.
The RAF then produces a list of costed assumptions for binning. If the CAS is a gambler, he may put into that list high-profile items he believes the Government would not accept being binned because of the attendant negative publicity and so will order their retention. CAS can then argue for additional funding. The danger is, of course, that his bluff may be called and the Treasury will say thank you and take them.
So it will be the RAF who get rid of the RAFAT and/or BBMF. No direct blame will be admitted by the shower in power.
The Treasury gives the RAF an inadequate sack of money for the tasks they are asked to perform. The Treasury then says, exceed your allowance and you are in the poo, so tell us what you consider worth saving and what should be binned to stay within budget.
The RAF then produces a list of costed assumptions for binning. If the CAS is a gambler, he may put into that list high-profile items he believes the Government would not accept being binned because of the attendant negative publicity and so will order their retention. CAS can then argue for additional funding. The danger is, of course, that his bluff may be called and the Treasury will say thank you and take them.
So it will be the RAF who get rid of the RAFAT and/or BBMF. No direct blame will be admitted by the shower in power.
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Just as an aside to this, what could we get rid of in the RAF to secure the future of BBMF & RAFAT??
Lets see now;
RAF Regiment - what do they do anyway?
RAF PTI - as above
RAF Police - hmmmm
Travel Cells - what a fu$%£ng waste of maney they are!
Oh well, that should secure the boys at Scampton and Coningsby for quite a few years methinks, and what a boost for morale!!
Kind regards
TSM
Lets see now;
RAF Regiment - what do they do anyway?
RAF PTI - as above
RAF Police - hmmmm
Travel Cells - what a fu$%£ng waste of maney they are!
Oh well, that should secure the boys at Scampton and Coningsby for quite a few years methinks, and what a boost for morale!!
Kind regards
TSM
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Thought that readers might be interested to know that the Reds Petition now stands as follows:
Deadline to sign up by: 24 July 2007 – Signatures: 44,110
Deadline to sign up by: 24 July 2007 – Signatures: 44,110
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Air Shows Generally
Save the Reds? What about air shows? I suspect that this year, only cause it is too late to stop now, may be the last air show round as we know it.
Future shows will be task or mission orientated to demonstrate the EAW - ISTAR at Waddo and this will include cooks, suppliers etc with very little emphasis on fast pointy things - left fast, right fast, up fast, down slow, left slow . . .
That may showcase aircraft but it does not showcase the Royal Air Force. The target audience will change too. No longer will it be targeted at the converted - the air show anorak. It might not even be at the traditional venues! What price the Reds then?
Future shows will be task or mission orientated to demonstrate the EAW - ISTAR at Waddo and this will include cooks, suppliers etc with very little emphasis on fast pointy things - left fast, right fast, up fast, down slow, left slow . . .
That may showcase aircraft but it does not showcase the Royal Air Force. The target audience will change too. No longer will it be targeted at the converted - the air show anorak. It might not even be at the traditional venues! What price the Reds then?
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
TSM
TSM, I think you are off beam citing the Regiment as a negative asset. They are doing their traditional job in Afghanistan and doing it very well compared with the previous NATO unit who effectively retreated behind the wire.
Join Date: Sep 2005
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F3s
What about F3s being shot at in Deny Flight - they were the first combat aircraft to arrive in the Gulf in 1990 and they have sat on QRA continually for over 20 years.
That said, you don't have to have been shot at to be of use and be operational.
All forces have a role. I would rather keep the SAR force than the Reds if I had to choose - ideally I would keep both!
That said, you don't have to have been shot at to be of use and be operational.
All forces have a role. I would rather keep the SAR force than the Reds if I had to choose - ideally I would keep both!
Join Date: Mar 2007
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eye opener
Well I was going to vote yes and sign up,then i read this load of kybosh.It just reminded me of the days when the airforce was a jolly display club for our commisioned brethren...( incidentally i love the way you have just endeared yourself to all those hard working engineers out there) ..as for boosting our trade,the only things i ever saw advertised seriously at air shows was other countries military equipment.Thanks for reminding me as a front line recipient,that the Red Arrows are now an outmoded and expensive irrellevance in todays helter skelter air force.
Join Date: Feb 2007
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CM,
If, and I'm not sure that I agree with you, Doggrobber is a supposed class warrior your supposition that Pilots and Officer are things that "smack of excellence" there by suggesting everyone else is merely ordinary does lend some credence to your class warrior theory and some possible insecurity issues on your part
If, and I'm not sure that I agree with you, Doggrobber is a supposed class warrior your supposition that Pilots and Officer are things that "smack of excellence" there by suggesting everyone else is merely ordinary does lend some credence to your class warrior theory and some possible insecurity issues on your part
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Seldomfitforpurpose
I’ve corrected your Delphic pronouncement for spelling and punctuation, to enhance comprehension, although I’ve ignored the spilt infinitive (all done in the spirit of maintaining excellence).
Even though Clockwork Mouse did allude to class warfare I suspect he actually had meritocracy in his sights when writing “anything that smacks of excellence”. I also suggest that confusion exists in your own mind as to which of the two is applicable here.
Did you really mean it when you suggested that Clockwork Mouse has “insecurity issues” and if so, why?
Incidentally, the Reds Petition now stands at 51,333
I’ve corrected your Delphic pronouncement for spelling and punctuation, to enhance comprehension, although I’ve ignored the spilt infinitive (all done in the spirit of maintaining excellence).
If, and I'm not sure that I agree with you, dogrobber is a supposed class warrior, your supposition that Pilots and Officer are things that "smack of excellence", thereby suggesting everyone else is merely ordinary, does lend some credence to your class warrior theory and some possible (personal?) insecurity issues on your part.
Did you really mean it when you suggested that Clockwork Mouse has “insecurity issues” and if so, why?
Incidentally, the Reds Petition now stands at 51,333
Join Date: Nov 2005
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Arrows 2007
As mensioned in a previous comment it is to late this year.
The Arrows from what I have picked up were due to leave yesterday on there way to Greece the to Cyprus to put the last pieces of the flying programme together.
In two months time we will have the finished article for 2007 the Red Arrows Air Display Team for 2007.
Good luck to them all we await your return to mone shores and see the new package.
The Arrows from what I have picked up were due to leave yesterday on there way to Greece the to Cyprus to put the last pieces of the flying programme together.
In two months time we will have the finished article for 2007 the Red Arrows Air Display Team for 2007.
Good luck to them all we await your return to mone shores and see the new package.
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Just received the following email. Looks like Number 10 has listened. One cannot help but wonder if the MoD stuff-ups in recent days might've made them look for any positive news they could pump out! 
E-petition: response from the Prime Minister
The e-petition asking the Prime Minister to "continue funding for the Royal Air Force Aerobatics Team - The Red Arrows" is on-going. This is a response in advance of the closing date from the Prime Minister, Tony Blair.
Thank you for signing the petition on the No.10 website calling for the maintenance of the Red Arrows. It is a sign of the place they hold in the national affections that so many people have joined you in signing it - one of the highest numbers since the e-petition service began. That's why I wanted to reply personally. It's also why I am replying before the petition officially closes, in order to reassure people who are clearly concerned.
I am pleased to be able to give you good news. There are no plans to change the funding for the Red Arrows, let alone to disband them.
It is important, of course, that the MOD looks at the full range of its spending plans as part of its routine financial planning, to ensure that taxpayers' money is spent where our Armed Forces most need it. Obviously it is this review which prompted fears that the Red Arrows might be scrapped.
However, like you, the Government recognises just what an important role the Red Arrows play in our national life. As the world's premier aerobatic team, they have thrilled millions of spectators over many years. I was lucky enough to see their extraordinary skills myself only last year at the Farnborough Air Show.
More importantly, the Red Arrows have maintained public support for the Royal Air Force, encouraged recruitment, acted as ambassadors for Britain in the world and promoted British industry for many years. So I am pleased to assure you that this government fully intends to keep the Red Arrows flying.
Thank you for signing this petition, and I hope you get a chance to see the Red Arrows yourself soon.
Yours sincerely,
Tony Blair
E-petition: response from the Prime Minister
The e-petition asking the Prime Minister to "continue funding for the Royal Air Force Aerobatics Team - The Red Arrows" is on-going. This is a response in advance of the closing date from the Prime Minister, Tony Blair.
Thank you for signing the petition on the No.10 website calling for the maintenance of the Red Arrows. It is a sign of the place they hold in the national affections that so many people have joined you in signing it - one of the highest numbers since the e-petition service began. That's why I wanted to reply personally. It's also why I am replying before the petition officially closes, in order to reassure people who are clearly concerned.
I am pleased to be able to give you good news. There are no plans to change the funding for the Red Arrows, let alone to disband them.
It is important, of course, that the MOD looks at the full range of its spending plans as part of its routine financial planning, to ensure that taxpayers' money is spent where our Armed Forces most need it. Obviously it is this review which prompted fears that the Red Arrows might be scrapped.
However, like you, the Government recognises just what an important role the Red Arrows play in our national life. As the world's premier aerobatic team, they have thrilled millions of spectators over many years. I was lucky enough to see their extraordinary skills myself only last year at the Farnborough Air Show.
More importantly, the Red Arrows have maintained public support for the Royal Air Force, encouraged recruitment, acted as ambassadors for Britain in the world and promoted British industry for many years. So I am pleased to assure you that this government fully intends to keep the Red Arrows flying.
Thank you for signing this petition, and I hope you get a chance to see the Red Arrows yourself soon.
Yours sincerely,
Tony Blair