CAS and Typhoon
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All the time money and effort for a solo sortie in the log book - WHY? What real value does it bring?
Go for a whizz in the simulator = a damn good idea of what the thing can do.
Dear Sir, can I have a go too?
Go for a whizz in the simulator = a damn good idea of what the thing can do.
Dear Sir, can I have a go too?
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Can't say I blame the man; I'd love to have a go in one, even a 2-seater. As well as that, it's not a bad idea that the Head Honcho has first-hand experience of some of the new kit. I understand that he will also be checked out on the RAF's newest fire engine, followed by a quick course on the Mk XV lawnmower and ending the year with a conversion to the latest model toaster.
What would Bader have done?
1) Never reached senior rank
2) Made the wrong decision
3) Been guided by self promotion and ego
4) Over-claimed
5) Represented an entirely inappropriate and irrelevant point of comparison within this thread
or
1) Led from the front
2) Not let rules, regs or petty safety get in the way
3) Inspired his boys while irritating the rest of the Command
4) Gone down in history
5) Criticised Bob Judson's diamond nine as a very, very pale imitation of what a big wing should be
1) Never reached senior rank
2) Made the wrong decision
3) Been guided by self promotion and ego
4) Over-claimed
5) Represented an entirely inappropriate and irrelevant point of comparison within this thread
or
1) Led from the front
2) Not let rules, regs or petty safety get in the way
3) Inspired his boys while irritating the rest of the Command
4) Gone down in history
5) Criticised Bob Judson's diamond nine as a very, very pale imitation of what a big wing should be
I seem to recall a certain, then senior rank, blagging a last solo in one of the BAe Warton F.6's a few weeks before they stopped flying them......must have been years since his last Lightning flight
.......and thus becoming the last serving RAF pilot to fly a UK military Lightning.
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What an utter waste of time and money. Why aren't we throwing hours at the guys who are going to need it...Surely the most recently converted pilots would be a more sensible use of the assets. Would be interesting to see how many hours and sims were spent doing this. Especially as my unit has just been told to look at cutting trg hours from on high. And we've got aircraft on ops.
Smart political move by the Typhoon boys though...Keeps it in CAS's eye when it's show-boating around the UK airshow circuit for the next few years.
Still, CAS is a top bloke but he's been poorly advised on this.
Smart political move by the Typhoon boys though...Keeps it in CAS's eye when it's show-boating around the UK airshow circuit for the next few years.
Still, CAS is a top bloke but he's been poorly advised on this.
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It may have been irrelevant Jackonicko but I think that leading from the front does have it's benefits.
After all he can now talk to pilots on a level.
I would hate to be an Admiral who couldn’t command a ship or a General who couldn't fire the latest weapon etc. How on earth could you look your men in the eye whilst taking a parade?
How much would this solo have cost? How much time has it taken etc? has it put that bigger dent in pilot training?
Is there a hint of jealousy here?
After all he can now talk to pilots on a level.
I would hate to be an Admiral who couldn’t command a ship or a General who couldn't fire the latest weapon etc. How on earth could you look your men in the eye whilst taking a parade?
How much would this solo have cost? How much time has it taken etc? has it put that bigger dent in pilot training?
Is there a hint of jealousy here?
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Fly him in a T bird by all means - but leading from the front? Do me a favour - this sounds like 'boys with their toys'. I'd rather CAS would keep his eye on the ball in town. There are one or 2 hotspots out there that need a bit of attention surely!
Did Dowding fly Spitfires or Hurricanes in combat? Did Harris fly Lancs? Yes the great sqn cdrs such as the likes of Gibson and Cheshire led from the front, but I rather think that spending time on putting CAS in the air solo could be better spent elsewhere.
In the recent past, too many AOC 11 Gps (and 11/18) were rather too keen on flying the BBMF aeroplanes rather than leading and managing an organization. I rather admired BKB's attitude that he was there to concentrate on the key issues and operational deployments, rather than some of his predecessors- some of whom amassed a disgracefully high number of hours at the expense of sqn JPs.
Did Dowding fly Spitfires or Hurricanes in combat? Did Harris fly Lancs? Yes the great sqn cdrs such as the likes of Gibson and Cheshire led from the front, but I rather think that spending time on putting CAS in the air solo could be better spent elsewhere.
In the recent past, too many AOC 11 Gps (and 11/18) were rather too keen on flying the BBMF aeroplanes rather than leading and managing an organization. I rather admired BKB's attitude that he was there to concentrate on the key issues and operational deployments, rather than some of his predecessors- some of whom amassed a disgracefully high number of hours at the expense of sqn JPs.
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Personally, I think it was a good thing. The 'Top Man' taking the time to get out of the office, and qualify on the latest kit can only:
a) Enhance his understanding of current issues.
b) Show him what a great job the front(ish) line is doing, despite all the cuts.
c) Show to the whole lot of us that he still can and more importantly
Wants to fly!
The costs are minimal, the rewards are great. Or, maybe you'd rather he was like the 'B' Word, with no interest in flying, and only 1500Hrs or so in his book.... Truely Shameful that was, IMHO.
Good on the Man says I !!
PS- Gizza Go?!
Advo
a) Enhance his understanding of current issues.
b) Show him what a great job the front(ish) line is doing, despite all the cuts.
c) Show to the whole lot of us that he still can and more importantly
Wants to fly!
The costs are minimal, the rewards are great. Or, maybe you'd rather he was like the 'B' Word, with no interest in flying, and only 1500Hrs or so in his book.... Truely Shameful that was, IMHO.
Good on the Man says I !!
PS- Gizza Go?!
Advo
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I am rather impressed by the rational replies to this thread so far (except for the appauling mention of the "B word", damn nearly threw up sir)!
The solo sortie will have shown him enough to get solo. Not enough for him to have seen the current issues. That solo flight cost thousands.
I would have been impressed with CAS's " leadership from the front" had I seen a piccy of him in a C130 / Nimrod / Chinny jump-seat in the fun-sandy places that we are playing in now. I.E. "A leader at the front, with the boys and girls in harms way, actually seeing the job in hand.
The "jump seat" by the way cos we need the qualified professionals in the drivers seats
Now, "Military Tourism" is a whole new can-o-worms.
The solo sortie will have shown him enough to get solo. Not enough for him to have seen the current issues. That solo flight cost thousands.
I would have been impressed with CAS's " leadership from the front" had I seen a piccy of him in a C130 / Nimrod / Chinny jump-seat in the fun-sandy places that we are playing in now. I.E. "A leader at the front, with the boys and girls in harms way, actually seeing the job in hand.
The "jump seat" by the way cos we need the qualified professionals in the drivers seats
Now, "Military Tourism" is a whole new can-o-worms.
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Stillin,
Agreed, and I promise I won't mention the 'Scotish Grp Cpt' again! Oooh Bogger!
However, some is better than nowt.......... Terminally officebound senios are of no use to anyone! I take your point tho, some cockpit time in other types would definately help.
Advo
Agreed, and I promise I won't mention the 'Scotish Grp Cpt' again! Oooh Bogger!
However, some is better than nowt.......... Terminally officebound senios are of no use to anyone! I take your point tho, some cockpit time in other types would definately help.
Advo
On the other hand.....what possible good is it to the RAF that the CAS can take time out of a supposedly busy schedule to prepare for and conduct such a flight? Are we to expect annual refreshers etc? Every time a military aircraft, especially a FJ, gets airborne it is, or should be, a calculated risk assessed by the authorising officer of the chance of an accident happening now versus the need of the sortie to be flown.
It's not his train set, by the way, it's mine, and the 60m odd other shareholders of UK plc, and I can't see the advantage to us of the CAS adding yet more time to the much advertised 4,000 FJ time in his Log Book. Stay in the office, Sir. There is a pile of stuff in your in tray of much much greater importance, as per nearly every thread on this Forum!
Senior Officers should stay well away from the sharp end of their aircraft, they have a bad habit of ending up in the middle of a cabbage patch. I was once asked by one of them for a "go", and respectfully told him that it was beyond my authority, or his, to oblige. He accepted that with grace, perhaps today's Airships are less reasonable?
It's not his train set, by the way, it's mine, and the 60m odd other shareholders of UK plc, and I can't see the advantage to us of the CAS adding yet more time to the much advertised 4,000 FJ time in his Log Book. Stay in the office, Sir. There is a pile of stuff in your in tray of much much greater importance, as per nearly every thread on this Forum!
Senior Officers should stay well away from the sharp end of their aircraft, they have a bad habit of ending up in the middle of a cabbage patch. I was once asked by one of them for a "go", and respectfully told him that it was beyond my authority, or his, to oblige. He accepted that with grace, perhaps today's Airships are less reasonable?
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Having just read a thread about why everyone is leaving the RAF and that all the good bits of service life have gone, I'm now reading that someone who stays the course shouldn't take the smooth with the rough. So which do you want?
Red On, Green On
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If the CAS had sorted all the problems facing his team(s), had reduced the PVR rate to well below the 5 year running average, had all RAF posts filled with the right people etc., then perhaps it'd be time for a jolly.
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Chugalug,
You're a right barrel of laughs
What would people say if it was discovered that CAS had an opprotunity to go solo on a Typhoon and declined? There'd be far more manking about what a bad show that would be.
He's CAS - it IS his train set, to all effective intents and purposes. Or should all 60m people in this country be consulted each time a decision is required?
You're a right barrel of laughs
What would people say if it was discovered that CAS had an opprotunity to go solo on a Typhoon and declined? There'd be far more manking about what a bad show that would be.
He's CAS - it IS his train set, to all effective intents and purposes. Or should all 60m people in this country be consulted each time a decision is required?