Campaign Medal for Bomber Command?

[Lon More]

Currently in Jet Blast, but of interest here, An attempt to belatedly get a campaign medal for those of Bomber Command during WWII Petition

[Chugalug2]

Nice one LM, and done! Interestingly the petition cites the "men" of Bomber Command, and I understand that Harris insisted that such an award should go to the Ground Staff as well as the Aircrew, and hence would have surely included women. It isn't really clear if this is also the intention of this campaign, if it is it might hit the same buffers that derailed the original, as it was felt that many others supported the war effort in the UK without such an award. As to the Aircrew though, definitely a long overdue acknowledgement of their courage and sacrifice, and a PC scandal that it has not been done before.

[Brian Abraham]

Looked at the petition and seems those from Canada, Oz etc who flew in RAF, RAAF, RCAF Squadons would not be eligible. Am I correct? They all received Imperial awards and decorations at the time.

[Lon More]

Petition states "men of Bomber Command"so I believe it is not linked to nationality.

BTW I didn't bring this to light originally, thanks should go to Mr. Draper on JB

[Robert Cooper]

This one is worth supporting, and I hope it will include groundcrew.

[Jackonicko]

Why?

The groundcrew are entitled to and received EXACTLY the same gongs as any other serviceman serving within the UK in a frontline capacity. Why should they receive any more than (say) Fighter Command, Coastal Command or Army Co-operation Command groundcrew?

And indeed, why should there be any need for a separate medal for Bomber Command aircrew, who received the same medals as other UK-based frontline aircrew - whether that was 'Air Crew Europe', 'France and Germany' or whatever.

The idea of a separate Bomber Command campaign medal is divisive nonsense, in my view.

[Chugalug2]

Why? Because The Bomber Campaign, from the very beginning of the war to the very end was unique, in that it was the only major campaign that was not so acknowledged. And we all know why, because having tasked them throughout the war and called for ever greater effort (and sacrifice!) the "establishment", including Churchill, disowned them. The latter did so for purely political reasons, both those of realpolitik and electoral, the former because they wished to distance themselves from the ever apparent devastation now clear to everyone that had been wrought on Germany. The soundbite for this attitude was of course "Dresden", as though the people who died in that hell hole were any more undeserving to die than anyone else. Whatever the rights and wrongs of that one operation, the brave young men who went out night after night, until of course the night that they didn't return, deserve our respect and recognition. Those who are still with us should receive the physical demonstration of that recognition. If the Battle of Britain, that kept us in the War, was so acknowledged, the Bomber Campaign, which was essential to Victory, should be as well!

[vecvechookattack]

Ah, the controvesy surrounding Butcher Harris continues....

"Flying in a British bomber during World War Two was one of the most dangerous jobs imaginable. Some 55,000 aircrew died in raids over Europe between 1939 and 1945, the highest loss rate of any major branch of the British armed forces"......

Those guys should be recognised for the sacrifcice they gave.

[Jackonicko]

I disagree.

To elevate Bomber Command's sacrifices above those of Fighter Command, Coastal Command (look at the Blenheim losses, for example), Army Co-operation Command et al, is offensive and divisive.

[Chugalug2]

Originally Posted by Jackonicko

I disagree.

To elevate Bomber Command's sacrifices above those of Fighter Command, Coastal Command (look at the Blenheim losses, for example), Army Co-operation Command et al, is offensive and divisive.

Well you could say the same about any Campaign Medal! The point is this was a campaign, and of a duration only matched by the Battle of the Atlantic. This wouldn't be a Command Medal, which of course was never issued, but a Campaign Medal, which crews of other Commands did receive if involved in an acknowledged campaign.
Those Blenheims by the way Jacko, whoever flew them were fated, including those operated by Fighter Command in the Battle of Britain, the crews of which were thus acknowledged, or those of Bomber Command that were lost in the Bomber campaign, who weren't.

[Yellow Sun]

Jacko,

and anyone else who doubts the correctness of this cause. You should stand in the North transcept of Lincoln Cathedral and then decide.

YS

[cribble]

Does not the campaign medal described below fit the bill?
"British Commonwealth War and Campaign Medals
- The Air Crew Europe Star
This medal was awarded for flying operations from UK bases over Europe between September 1939 and June 1944.
About the ribbon
The ribbon is light blue with black edges, with a narrow vertical yellow stripe on each side between the light blue and the black. The colours and layout symbolise the continuous service of the Air Force by night and day.
Clasps and Bars
Two clasps, ‘Atlantic' and ‘France and Germany' were awarded with this medal. When ribbons only were worn on military uniform, a silver rose emblem on the ribbon denoted the award of a clasp."

[Jackonicko]

Cribble,

Spot on!

[PPRuNe Pop]

Not so!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/1948647.stm

Some of the veterans were wearing medals - although there is still no official campaign medal commemorating Bomber Command.

[228 OCU]

Done.
In memory of the 55,573

[philrigger]

Originally Posted by cribble

Does not the campaign medal described below fit the bill?
"British Commonwealth War and Campaign Medals
- The Air Crew Europe Star
This medal was awarded for flying operations from UK bases over Europe between September 1939 and June 1944.
About the ribbon
The ribbon is light blue with black edges, with a narrow vertical yellow stripe on each side between the light blue and the black. The colours and layout symbolise the continuous service of the Air Force by night and day.
Clasps and Bars
Two clasps, ‘Atlantic' and ‘France and Germany' were awarded with this medal. When ribbons only were worn on military uniform, a silver rose emblem on the ribbon denoted the award of a clasp."

Conditions did apply:
There are 3 medals in question;

France & Germany Star (Jun 44 to May 45)
Atlantic Star (Sep 39 to May 45)
Aircrew Europe Star (Sep 39 to June 44)

Only one of these medals and one further clasp could be awarded.
(The first medal for which you qualified and a clasp for the second that you qualified for).
Eg: You could have the Atlantic Star with the France and Germany clasp (Or vie versa). And still not be able to wear the Aircrew Europe Star/Clasp.
Or you could have the Air Crew Europe with the Atlantic Clasp and not be awarded the France and Germany Clasp.



'We knew how to whinge but we kept it in the NAAFI bar.'

[StuartP]

More than happy to sign in memory of my wife's grandfather, who did come back but would never talk about it.

Incidentally, you/we are currently about 33400 signatures behind the anti-road pricing petition, and a few signatures behind the one requesting Our Tone to stand on his head and juggle ice cream.

(I know my posting adds nothing to the debate but it will at least get rid of that annoying "Hey - you've gone all quiet" reminder I get every time I log on.)

[GelBoyCT]

So it's Ok for the BoB Boys to have their own medal?

The Battle of Britain Boys were issued with their own bar to the 39-45 star, for what was a relatively short period during the war. Bomber Crews lost over 55000 Aicrew and their sacrifice was, undoubtedly, the single biggest effort from any one organisation. Though it goes without saying that, the war was won because of the joint effort of all those involved. Why couldn't there be more bars for other Commands?

[Chugalug2]

Originally Posted by GelBoyCT

Bomber Crews lost over 55000 Aicrew and their sacrifice was, undoubtedly, the single biggest effort from any one organisation. Though it goes without saying that, the war was won because of the joint effort of all those involved. Why couldn't there be more bars for other Commands?

Hear hear GB! I think I read somewhere that the Bomber Command losses were unmatched by any other unified command of any country, save for the Kriegsmarine U-boat arm. A very special sacrifice that was an essential prelude to victory. For other thoughts on this there was a similar thread "Canadians question morality of Bomber Command" at:
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=254162
Perhaps it is easier for us to view these events from a distance than it was at the time. There is a debt to be paid. We should pay it.

[Flash2001]

This would no doubt delight my uncle W/C W.M. Stephen RCAF, DSO, Croix de Guerre etc. Unfortunately he passed away 59 years after the campaign ended and so will never get to see it. It is with some bitterness that I see that the petition is restricted by residence to the British Isles. There were a few colonials in Bomber Command.

He was one.