Defending the Harrier - I need ammunition
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Defending the Harrier - I need ammunition
I frequent another forum - and so does a rabid anglophobe who goes by the name "Shooter20000". The man is legendary. Anyway he's currently having a go at that brilliant, though flawed, british invention - the Harrier.
http://forums.delphiforums.com/autog...ges?msg=2488.8
Here's a quote;
I find it interesting that you quote Boyd as thinking the Harrier is a good fighter plane, yet at Red Flag and all of the other ACM/exercise ranges, they regularly get their clocks cleaned and in fact did not have a single A2A kill at any of the various events up untill the time I retired.
Any harrier or ex-harrier pilots out there who can give me ammunition to shoot this odious little tick down? Or better still join the above forum call him on his bull**** yourself.
http://forums.delphiforums.com/autog...ges?msg=2488.8
Here's a quote;
I find it interesting that you quote Boyd as thinking the Harrier is a good fighter plane, yet at Red Flag and all of the other ACM/exercise ranges, they regularly get their clocks cleaned and in fact did not have a single A2A kill at any of the various events up untill the time I retired.
Any harrier or ex-harrier pilots out there who can give me ammunition to shoot this odious little tick down? Or better still join the above forum call him on his bull**** yourself.
for those Ppruners not familiar with ARRSE, the following link relates to the freak of lab testing known as 'Shooter2000'.
http://http://www.arrse.co.uk/cpgn2/...c/t=46647.html
truly the ultimate reason for Post-Natal Abortion...
http://http://www.arrse.co.uk/cpgn2/...c/t=46647.html
truly the ultimate reason for Post-Natal Abortion...
TAC Int Bloke
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in fact did not have a single A2A kill at any of the various events up until the time I retired.
(Much as I hate to 'big up' the SHAR)
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Red Flag 2003, on a range near to a secret base close to Las Vegas, 800 NAS playing Aggressor in SHARs with the Vipers. Numerous A2A 'kills' (not all BVR!) on muds not paying attention.
Maybe this was after Shooters time but it did happen.
As for getting our 'clocks cleaned' the whole point of playing the bad guy is that the good guys learn how to deal with you. When you are pretending to be a Flogger with all the limits set on you is it overly surprising?
Not sure the GR7s ever get A2A kills as that's not the point of the GR7.
Don't want to start another debate here about SHAR vs GR7
Maybe this was after Shooters time but it did happen.
As for getting our 'clocks cleaned' the whole point of playing the bad guy is that the good guys learn how to deal with you. When you are pretending to be a Flogger with all the limits set on you is it overly surprising?
Not sure the GR7s ever get A2A kills as that's not the point of the GR7.
Don't want to start another debate here about SHAR vs GR7
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I wouldn't even get drawn into debate with him, you can't say something like "The Falklands war not withstanding. Those were special circumstances and under different ones the out come might have been very different." and then purport to be giving balanced judgement, its nonsensical!
To me thats like saying "Ford cars are very unreliable, notwithstanding all the journeys they do make without breaking down, and those are special circumstances where the car has been filled with oil, had it not then the outcome might have been very different!"
To me thats like saying "Ford cars are very unreliable, notwithstanding all the journeys they do make without breaking down, and those are special circumstances where the car has been filled with oil, had it not then the outcome might have been very different!"
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Shooter2000 is welcome to hate any aircraft he likes. At various times over the last 20 odd years there have been loads of people who arbitrarily decided that the F-16 was too light-weight to do anything, or that the A-10 needed scrapping cause it was a waste of money, or that the B-52 has had its day etc etc.
Based on his devastating lack of knowledge of the Harrier, he thinks it's rubbish.
Based upon his justification, I'd have to say I think that Shooter is either ill-informed or just plain ignorant.
Either one of us could be right or wrong (or both of us for that matter). Frankly I don't care and am off to the bar for a glass of milk and to talk about me and my latest viff-viff nozzley-nozzley exploits.
Single Seat, Single Engine, The Only Way To Fly
Based on his devastating lack of knowledge of the Harrier, he thinks it's rubbish.
Based upon his justification, I'd have to say I think that Shooter is either ill-informed or just plain ignorant.
Either one of us could be right or wrong (or both of us for that matter). Frankly I don't care and am off to the bar for a glass of milk and to talk about me and my latest viff-viff nozzley-nozzley exploits.
Single Seat, Single Engine, The Only Way To Fly
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It's quite simple really. There is no defending the Harrier. It's a noisy hoover set on "blow".
And that bowing thing it does at air shows is really old hat now.
Take it you never made the grade QFIdude
all spelling mistakes are "df" alcohol induced
And that bowing thing it does at air shows is really old hat now.
Take it you never made the grade QFIdude
all spelling mistakes are "df" alcohol induced
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Have you not made the grade for the C-17 yet? Or even the J?
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Just to stir things a bit more:
After a few beers during a friday afternoon session at a secret airbase in Wiltshire, SAOEU members chilling -
"Whats the difference between a Harrier pilot and a 1000lb GP - the latter is not retarded"
"Whats the difference between a Harrier and its driver - the former stops whinning once the sorties over"!
After a few beers during a friday afternoon session at a secret airbase in Wiltshire, SAOEU members chilling -
"Whats the difference between a Harrier pilot and a 1000lb GP - the latter is not retarded"
"Whats the difference between a Harrier and its driver - the former stops whinning once the sorties over"!
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And at least on the GR1, when you put the throttles forward, you got a kick in the pants.
You obviously never "put the throttle forward" in a lightweight Harrier. I saw 180 kts from parked in less than 1200 feet, approx 5 seconds after brake release. The thing is a screaming jet engine with a seat. And after getting airborne you could pull it into a almost vertical climb, and roll off the top with aplomb. It's amazing, best fun you can have.
You obviously never "put the throttle forward" in a lightweight Harrier. I saw 180 kts from parked in less than 1200 feet, approx 5 seconds after brake release. The thing is a screaming jet engine with a seat. And after getting airborne you could pull it into a almost vertical climb, and roll off the top with aplomb. It's amazing, best fun you can have.
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And at least on the GR1, when you put the throttles forward, you got a kick in the pants.
You obviously never "put the throttle forward" in a lightweight Harrier. I saw 180 kts from parked in less than 1200 feet, approx 5 seconds after brake release. The thing is a screaming jet engine with a seat. And after getting airborne you could pull it into a almost vertical climb, and roll off the top with aplomb. It's amazing, best fun you can have.
You obviously never "put the throttle forward" in a lightweight Harrier. I saw 180 kts from parked in less than 1200 feet, approx 5 seconds after brake release. The thing is a screaming jet engine with a seat. And after getting airborne you could pull it into a almost vertical climb, and roll off the top with aplomb. It's amazing, best fun you can have.
No offence intended to Harrier mates. A fine aircraft.
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Good reply QFIHawkman,
but until your airplane has two ovens, two fridges, two hot jugs and two freezers at least, it does not matter how fast it goes, it is still not worth flying in!
Y_G
but until your airplane has two ovens, two fridges, two hot jugs and two freezers at least, it does not matter how fast it goes, it is still not worth flying in!
Y_G
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I agree Yella, it is always a nice touch to get into YOUR aircraft with all those comforts of home while you whisk us off back home after we drop all those bombs etc from the cramped conditions of 7-8 hours in my not so well equipped aircraft.
Gee! Almost vertical!
What about lighting the twin fires....rotate on takeoff to vertical and accelerate past mach 1.0 then roll out at the top and go about your business at some ridiculous height and speed?
What about lighting the twin fires....rotate on takeoff to vertical and accelerate past mach 1.0 then roll out at the top and go about your business at some ridiculous height and speed?
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Yeller gait..... I'm having trouble. Two fridges, ovens, FREEZERS? You had me for a while there, I was thinking about the BAe146. You must be a L1011 man!
A mighty fine aeroplane. Got me back from Kabul last year in three seat comfort all the way. A big thanks guys, always nice to fly 216.
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