Has the ISK Staish Lost the Plot?
Join Date: Aug 2004
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Dont get me started on him, smocks....sorry shirts...tucked in at all times!!
I think you will find that the correct way of wearing said "smock" is to be un-tucked.
correct me if i am wrong which i am sure many of you will!!!
I think you will find that the correct way of wearing said "smock" is to be un-tucked.
correct me if i am wrong which i am sure many of you will!!!
Hunter you mean that. The green smock you wear tucked in?Now theres a variation I have never heard of. RAF service dress version 965!!!!
Spell checked just for Flap!!
Join Date: May 2004
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Gentlemen. (I use the term ironically)
You are an embarrasment your service.
Members of all three services are currently living and dying in sh1te conditions in war zones, and you whinge about the irritation and inconvenience of wearing a cap to your crew bus.
You should be ashamed.
You are an embarrasment your service.
Members of all three services are currently living and dying in sh1te conditions in war zones, and you whinge about the irritation and inconvenience of wearing a cap to your crew bus.
You should be ashamed.
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Guys I am not kidding, I am thinking of rejoining, eating loads of pies and volunteering to fly the mighty hunter. I haven't laughed so much in ages.
Fantastic, especially half of Laurel and Hardy....
Fantastic, especially half of Laurel and Hardy....
Cunning Artificer
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SAC F*ckwit, Bomber Command bod on Exercise Mickey at Lyneham, has missed the bus for lunch. He walks, in the pouring rain, wearing - perhaps appropriately, but definitely illegally - filthy 2nd hand cold weather parka, 2nd hand boots and 2nd hand sea-boot socks. His beret is folded neatly in his epaulette, with the parka hood up and the beaver tail hanging down behind. His hands are in his pockets (cold innit?) Staff car with flag screeches to a halt alongside and a red faced Group Captain leans across and flings the nearside door open. SAC F*ckwit leaps smartly into front seat beside the Staish "Thanks very much Sir! Its jolly kind of you!" Staish proceeds home for lunch, dropping the genial F*ckwit off at the Airmen's Mess on the way. I mean, what else could he do?
In the afternoon Detachment Commander cops an invitation to Station HQ. Then we all cop a monster bollocking. Touché. C'est la vie and all that.
I reckon the ISK Staish has his hat on the right way round. If you want to be a scruff, expect a bollocking, but don't make a fuss about it. Its just a laugh and there's more important things in life. Like women and beer for instance.
In the afternoon Detachment Commander cops an invitation to Station HQ. Then we all cop a monster bollocking. Touché. C'est la vie and all that.
I reckon the ISK Staish has his hat on the right way round. If you want to be a scruff, expect a bollocking, but don't make a fuss about it. Its just a laugh and there's more important things in life. Like women and beer for instance.
So what's new? There have always been staishs complaining about dress regulations not being adhered to. In my long experience, it's always those who aren't very good at their jobs who aren't professional in all respects, like wearing hats in appropriate locations. Just buckle down, do the little things well and just maybe the big ones will be a little bit easier.
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Duff Gen
PAMCC
Thats not quite how it went down but lets not let the truth or emotion get in the way of a good story. The function exists for the participants to thank those that have assisted the visiting crews and renew camaraderie and friendships amongst the competitors. This year was somewhat different, I don't know who chose to change it. One thing I do know however is that morale at ISK is the lowest I have ever seen it and it saddens me having spent a lot of years there. I think the hat thing is as others have said a venting of anger but also frustration. Is it due to the command chain, I dont know but command starts at LAC and goes all the way to the very top, thus everyone up to Trust me Tone should maybe listen to their troops and grasp the nettle or the rod depending on what is needed.
As for Aircrew being scruffy it is one of the core skills needed long may it continue. As for our USA cousins they have to be deemed smart at something and they do have nice smart clothes.
Charlie sends
Thats not quite how it went down but lets not let the truth or emotion get in the way of a good story. The function exists for the participants to thank those that have assisted the visiting crews and renew camaraderie and friendships amongst the competitors. This year was somewhat different, I don't know who chose to change it. One thing I do know however is that morale at ISK is the lowest I have ever seen it and it saddens me having spent a lot of years there. I think the hat thing is as others have said a venting of anger but also frustration. Is it due to the command chain, I dont know but command starts at LAC and goes all the way to the very top, thus everyone up to Trust me Tone should maybe listen to their troops and grasp the nettle or the rod depending on what is needed.
As for Aircrew being scruffy it is one of the core skills needed long may it continue. As for our USA cousins they have to be deemed smart at something and they do have nice smart clothes.
Charlie sends
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For a start no, I am not the son of Southside - nor am I OC ISK. However, I have 2 points:
a) The order to wear hats on buses is a myth. If it isn't, it hasn't reached me or anybody I know at ISK!
b) The reports about morale at ISK being at an all-time low maybe true; however, I believe the aircrew PVR* rates at ISK are significantly lower than those at Brize or Lyneham. Suggestive, perhaps, that the morale of the Stn is reflective of the RAF as a whole not a direct function of the Staish?
* The Staish's recent PVR noted
a) The order to wear hats on buses is a myth. If it isn't, it hasn't reached me or anybody I know at ISK!
b) The reports about morale at ISK being at an all-time low maybe true; however, I believe the aircrew PVR* rates at ISK are significantly lower than those at Brize or Lyneham. Suggestive, perhaps, that the morale of the Stn is reflective of the RAF as a whole not a direct function of the Staish?
* The Staish's recent PVR noted
I can't believe the self-serving rot talked by some posters here.. I recently spoke to an old mate who is still in and he told me that he is now being paid £61k.. He's a flt lt nav.
So it can't be the pay that is causing the low morale.. What is it then..? Having to go on 'ops'? Isn't that what you joined for? Or was it the thought of all that go-karting or sub aqua?
Being a good operator is not just about striving for excellence in the air - it's also setting an example on the ground. Bimbling around on the ground with flying boots that have never seen shoe polish, with a tatty hat, a non-standard T shirt, with a flying suit from Badges-U-Like and a bit of egg yolk down the front says unprofessional and lack of self discipline to me. As a nation, we are generally scruffy - but that's no reason for anyone in the military to aspire to scruffiness. And before you think who's this sanctimonious tw*t, I was once pulled up by the SWO for not fastening up my cw flying jacket when riding my bike on the station. He was absolutely right. (on reflection!)
There's also the suggestion that not wearing a hat between the Ops Block and the crew coach is making some sort of statement. You're right - it does. It says the person making it needs to get real. The standard of uniform in the RAF is not a matter of personal choice. It's called 'uniform' for a reason. If you can't conform, then leave and start looking for that job outside that pays £61k. Any organisation will have a few people who kick against the rules and the RAF has its share. They shouldn't be surprised that the ISK staish has reacted. High time the whingers grew up and joined the rest of the air force. All power to his elbow.
Needless to say I have no connection with any of the events on this thread.
Feel better for that!
sv
So it can't be the pay that is causing the low morale.. What is it then..? Having to go on 'ops'? Isn't that what you joined for? Or was it the thought of all that go-karting or sub aqua?
Being a good operator is not just about striving for excellence in the air - it's also setting an example on the ground. Bimbling around on the ground with flying boots that have never seen shoe polish, with a tatty hat, a non-standard T shirt, with a flying suit from Badges-U-Like and a bit of egg yolk down the front says unprofessional and lack of self discipline to me. As a nation, we are generally scruffy - but that's no reason for anyone in the military to aspire to scruffiness. And before you think who's this sanctimonious tw*t, I was once pulled up by the SWO for not fastening up my cw flying jacket when riding my bike on the station. He was absolutely right. (on reflection!)
There's also the suggestion that not wearing a hat between the Ops Block and the crew coach is making some sort of statement. You're right - it does. It says the person making it needs to get real. The standard of uniform in the RAF is not a matter of personal choice. It's called 'uniform' for a reason. If you can't conform, then leave and start looking for that job outside that pays £61k. Any organisation will have a few people who kick against the rules and the RAF has its share. They shouldn't be surprised that the ISK staish has reacted. High time the whingers grew up and joined the rest of the air force. All power to his elbow.
Needless to say I have no connection with any of the events on this thread.
Feel better for that!
sv
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>Thats not quite how it went down but lets not let the truth or emotion get in the way of a good story. <
Charlie Luncher:
Exactly which bit wasn't true? You don't say. I was there and saw the ambulences, a guy with a badly cut face, blood streaming down it, the unconcious folk and the glass and muck all over the hangar floor.
I understand the ethos of the party and think it's a great, but this time it all fell apart. I felt sincerely sorry for the crews and folk who had put so much work into it. However, the fact remains that the overly free flow of alcohol was a major factor and it could have been stemmed, without spoiling the party. However, this needed to be done from a position of authority. Instead I saw the Staish ISK watching it all go down and doing nothing. I'm not saying that he should have intervened personally, but he could have done so quietly using his authority to get personel to ease up on things a bit.
It was a huge shame that such an event was allowed to descend into such a shambles. Talking to some of the crews the following day, I am not alone in my sentiments.
I agree wholeheartedly, with everything else you said though
Charlie Luncher:
Exactly which bit wasn't true? You don't say. I was there and saw the ambulences, a guy with a badly cut face, blood streaming down it, the unconcious folk and the glass and muck all over the hangar floor.
I understand the ethos of the party and think it's a great, but this time it all fell apart. I felt sincerely sorry for the crews and folk who had put so much work into it. However, the fact remains that the overly free flow of alcohol was a major factor and it could have been stemmed, without spoiling the party. However, this needed to be done from a position of authority. Instead I saw the Staish ISK watching it all go down and doing nothing. I'm not saying that he should have intervened personally, but he could have done so quietly using his authority to get personel to ease up on things a bit.
It was a huge shame that such an event was allowed to descend into such a shambles. Talking to some of the crews the following day, I am not alone in my sentiments.
I agree wholeheartedly, with everything else you said though
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An Teallach
Not quite true
You need to look at the Mission Statement for the Station which was brought on by the EU and the Nobs at Main Buildind some 10+ years ago. This has to be supported by the crass, infantile and embarrassing Directives from every section on the unit to support this cr*p
The Nimrod capabillity has changed by leaps and bounds since then, but the statement remains the same
In fairness to the present Staish, who I know well; he is not the first who has tried to maintain Military Standards on his unit when things get very busy - it's during these times that standards can slip - A diplomatic and subtle approach is to use the middle management chain of command to sort this for you - then they take the flak - if he has to come up front to sort it, then his people are letting him down
I remember one stroppy FS aircrew who insisted that putting polish on his flying boots would create a fire risk on the ac - I told him to take his head for a sh*t - go to flying clothing and use the non-flammable silicone polish - and that I would also be writing his next report
As in civvy street, we have the odd awkward bast*rd who wants to buck the system, let down the crew and and challenge authority - I am delighted to say that I have p*ssed off an awful lot of these people over the years in support of Service standards, but also to their benefit - that FS eventually got commissioned
Still loving many, Trusting a few, but paddling my own canoe
Not quite true
You need to look at the Mission Statement for the Station which was brought on by the EU and the Nobs at Main Buildind some 10+ years ago. This has to be supported by the crass, infantile and embarrassing Directives from every section on the unit to support this cr*p
The Nimrod capabillity has changed by leaps and bounds since then, but the statement remains the same
In fairness to the present Staish, who I know well; he is not the first who has tried to maintain Military Standards on his unit when things get very busy - it's during these times that standards can slip - A diplomatic and subtle approach is to use the middle management chain of command to sort this for you - then they take the flak - if he has to come up front to sort it, then his people are letting him down
I remember one stroppy FS aircrew who insisted that putting polish on his flying boots would create a fire risk on the ac - I told him to take his head for a sh*t - go to flying clothing and use the non-flammable silicone polish - and that I would also be writing his next report
As in civvy street, we have the odd awkward bast*rd who wants to buck the system, let down the crew and and challenge authority - I am delighted to say that I have p*ssed off an awful lot of these people over the years in support of Service standards, but also to their benefit - that FS eventually got commissioned
Still loving many, Trusting a few, but paddling my own canoe
