WSOP PAY UPBANDING?
Apparantly, there were some "unexpected issues" that the NCA job evaluation team raised with PMA. I am led to believe that PMA are addressing them at present and will broadcast the result of the evaluation once these issues have been sorted.
No news is bad news.
No news is bad news.
Join Date: May 2002
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From poster' e mail last year, we will all be paid the same from April 06. This would then stop the farce of 2 Wsops doing the same job, but getting paid £3k difference because one is high band the other low.
Hurry up and make the decision.
Hurry up and make the decision.
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Situation at a secret but noisy (if you complain enough you get compensation and your pictures in the paper as well as TV) air base in Hampshire, is that that the boys are getting hacked off already as there is a FS Eng doing the same job as those around him but earning £3,500 more.
Those of us in line for promotion have nothing but resentment against the system (not against the Air Eng I hasten to say). We were promised we would know last December, then Feb and then Apr. And now it's gone quiet...
Is promotion worth the hassle of just a couple a quid more a day? Many are saying not. And I can fully understand their point of view.
The delay is also causing resentment amongst those who have just gone onto the (and those coming up for it) PA spine as they are missing out because of entering on a lower pay band than they would should pay be equal across the board.
Have to say that it does absolutely nothing for the already low morale...
Those of us in line for promotion have nothing but resentment against the system (not against the Air Eng I hasten to say). We were promised we would know last December, then Feb and then Apr. And now it's gone quiet...
Is promotion worth the hassle of just a couple a quid more a day? Many are saying not. And I can fully understand their point of view.
The delay is also causing resentment amongst those who have just gone onto the (and those coming up for it) PA spine as they are missing out because of entering on a lower pay band than they would should pay be equal across the board.
Have to say that it does absolutely nothing for the already low morale...
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I dont suppose that the long awaited upbanding of the WSOps, formally known as Loadies, could possibly turn into a downbanding of the WSOps formally known as Engs and AEOps. Could it?
Join Date: Aug 2002
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Hi Gang;
Hmm...quiet out there isn't it.
How perverse it would be that the NCA cadre (ie WSOps) would be the lowest paid workers for their rank in today's RAF if the upbanding were to fail!!! I may have to remuster to Rock or Plod!!!
Never mind....JPA will sort it out!!!
More LAter;
'J' Bloke!!
Hmm...quiet out there isn't it.
How perverse it would be that the NCA cadre (ie WSOps) would be the lowest paid workers for their rank in today's RAF if the upbanding were to fail!!! I may have to remuster to Rock or Plod!!!
Never mind....JPA will sort it out!!!
More LAter;
'J' Bloke!!
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Well there are people out there who know, well to tell the truth they know more than we do.
However it doesn't sound good at the moment but if we are valued less than mr plod then there must be a reason for it.
I guess that the powers that be have their priorities and if it turns out not to be aircrew or flying then so be it. After all it is the royal paper shuffling farce, even more so now after the introduction of JPA.
At least we have the paps, now they wouldn't scrap that would they ????????????????????
However it doesn't sound good at the moment but if we are valued less than mr plod then there must be a reason for it.
I guess that the powers that be have their priorities and if it turns out not to be aircrew or flying then so be it. After all it is the royal paper shuffling farce, even more so now after the introduction of JPA.
At least we have the paps, now they wouldn't scrap that would they ????????????????????
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The latest rumours contain bad news and it seems unlikely that the upbanding will occur! Only the military could have members of the same trade on different pay scales. Mark time pay for the other elements is going to go down really well. Recruitment and retention will reflect such narrow minded policy, were we foolish enough to expect anything less !!!
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Where do you think the money will come from to support an (approx) £ 10/ day pay rise for x WSOps ? Once somebody puts together the mother of all business cases to support the spend, or the impact statement which would make AMP have kittens, as he is presented with a real and unsustainable meltdown in WSOp manning , then you have a chance. I totally agree with your point fellas, but bend over and smile................
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So where did the funding come from to pay for the increase in pay for other trades (mainly ground), who are a larger cadre than NCA, come from? This is about recognition for the valuable and outstanding contribution the ALM fraternaty make, just look at current ops, how many ALMs/crewman are involved???
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And your point is ?
Outstanding contribution - yup, agree with that 100%. Numbers of WSOp on ops - too many, which can be said for all trades. The Service considers that you are already well rewarded for your efforts (flying pay), but it all comes back to the same issue of unless PMA is swamped with PVRs / NGRs to the point of unsustainabilty, your cause is (sadly), doomed.
Outstanding contribution - yup, agree with that 100%. Numbers of WSOp on ops - too many, which can be said for all trades. The Service considers that you are already well rewarded for your efforts (flying pay), but it all comes back to the same issue of unless PMA is swamped with PVRs / NGRs to the point of unsustainabilty, your cause is (sadly), doomed.
Join Date: Mar 2000
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Vote with your feet
As an ex PMA 33c(1) or (2) or (?) when it was called something else ridiculous, my sympathies are with you but its not the PMA guys who are at fault; they can do nothing to represent your case unless they have substantive evidence that retention is falling.
Unfortunately this means voting with your feet....are you brave enough?
Their Lordships are only too well of the contribution you are making to front line duties but they have to balance funds against manpower and if its the Cooks leaving in droves this week then thats who they will target.
(The only exception to this rule is for pilots who pay themselves using the same morality denial philosophy as Politicians.)
The AA fraternity have had the bat shoved up their jolly dark places since the NCR revisions; conned into believing empowerment was a step forward. Well its now coming home to roost, no voice in PMA means no vote, get used to it there is a great deal more pain and disappointment on the way unless you all VOTE WITH YOUR FEET!
GOOD LUCK!
Unfortunately this means voting with your feet....are you brave enough?
Their Lordships are only too well of the contribution you are making to front line duties but they have to balance funds against manpower and if its the Cooks leaving in droves this week then thats who they will target.
(The only exception to this rule is for pilots who pay themselves using the same morality denial philosophy as Politicians.)
The AA fraternity have had the bat shoved up their jolly dark places since the NCR revisions; conned into believing empowerment was a step forward. Well its now coming home to roost, no voice in PMA means no vote, get used to it there is a great deal more pain and disappointment on the way unless you all VOTE WITH YOUR FEET!
GOOD LUCK!
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Klingon speaks very wise words folks, I think the best you can hope for to give any sort of parity is that Eng and AEOP wages will be made to"mark time", shed loads of scopies and Eng is a dying breed so who gives a rats ass about them, until we catch them up. That is not an intentional dig at either of those trades just a simple statement of fact so apologies in advance to you all.
The latest strong rumour here is that all those expecting PA spine in the NEAR future had better think long and hard about some other sort of pension plan as that is about to be withdrawn due to cost..........but only for NCA of course, wont affect drivers airframe in ant way shape or form..........
all spelling mmistakes are "df" alcohol induced
The latest strong rumour here is that all those expecting PA spine in the NEAR future had better think long and hard about some other sort of pension plan as that is about to be withdrawn due to cost..........but only for NCA of course, wont affect drivers airframe in ant way shape or form..........
all spelling mmistakes are "df" alcohol induced
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Just so I am clear on the issues here (sorry been away from the jungle drums for some time), would I be correct in saying that the AEOps/Engs are on the Technical spine and the ALM on the Non Technical?
And how can the AEOps and Eng's mark time pay until the lower paygraded ALM's catch up? are you suggesting that A's and E's don't receive annual increments until the ALM's increment to a level of parity, even though they would remain on the lower level?
And how can the AEOps and Eng's mark time pay until the lower paygraded ALM's catch up?
are you suggesting that A's and E's don't receive annual increments until the ALM's increment to a level of parity, even though they would remain on the lower level?
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I suspect that ABIW is quite close to the truth. You lot dont get any more cash, which works for the system and the AEOps mark time (system 2 NCA 0). They will whinge, and we will all be back at square one except the problem has moved 500 miles north. But the basic problem of too much job / too little cash will remain. As an earlier post stated, if you are that pissed off, walk. There are opportunities outside for people with your background, and will they miss you - probably not.
As for ABIWs comment on pensions - how many NCA really think they will walk with a Wg Cdr's pension ? Possible on paper, but I suspect that once AASS has fully matured, you will be lucky to see 5% of NCA getting it. Think about it, 2-3 (max) promotions per year to MACR rank for each role, so once the remaining pre 1989 review lot have gone the MACR ratio goes to bugger all. Furthermore, you will have to sell your soul to even make the board. If you dont believe me, find an eng and ask him (or better still, her) what they had to do to get picked up.
Enjoy.
As for ABIWs comment on pensions - how many NCA really think they will walk with a Wg Cdr's pension ? Possible on paper, but I suspect that once AASS has fully matured, you will be lucky to see 5% of NCA getting it. Think about it, 2-3 (max) promotions per year to MACR rank for each role, so once the remaining pre 1989 review lot have gone the MACR ratio goes to bugger all. Furthermore, you will have to sell your soul to even make the board. If you dont believe me, find an eng and ask him (or better still, her) what they had to do to get picked up.
Enjoy.
