Farewell Colt
Hmm - sorry, but with w@nkwords such as 'air power projection', you just aren't credible.
Some of us just can't bear to watch the implosion event which is today's RAF...
Some of us just can't bear to watch the implosion event which is today's RAF...
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Coltishall
Underpowered: I drove out of the place, slightly jaded, on Sunday afternoon. All quiet, lifeless, already starting to show signs of delapidation. Almost like I was looking at it in black and white on a TV. Alot of pride, achievement, action, history, happiness, sadness, piano burning, streakers outside the mess at Christmas, all gone. Like it never mattered in the first place. Like an old friend has died.
Underpowered - that is probably the best posting on pprune I have ever read - apart from the ones I have posted. I too left on Sunday ahem sometime during daylight with feelings tinged with nostalgia. Some people can't or won't understand what we mean by this and what Coltishall meant to us. These people, as those of us who understand Sun Tzu, Clausewitz and military doctrine are aware, are known as chisellers.
RAF Coltishall and the men and women who served at the Stn had achieved harmony; a perfect compromise between operational focus and care for the service (and civilian) community. Sadly, all the critics do not have the integrity to stand up for themselves or us - too ready and willing to bleat out Orwellian fashion the lastest dogma from the top at the expense of service ethos and traditions.
Bah to the lot of them
Underpowered - that is probably the best posting on pprune I have ever read - apart from the ones I have posted. I too left on Sunday ahem sometime during daylight with feelings tinged with nostalgia. Some people can't or won't understand what we mean by this and what Coltishall meant to us. These people, as those of us who understand Sun Tzu, Clausewitz and military doctrine are aware, are known as chisellers.
RAF Coltishall and the men and women who served at the Stn had achieved harmony; a perfect compromise between operational focus and care for the service (and civilian) community. Sadly, all the critics do not have the integrity to stand up for themselves or us - too ready and willing to bleat out Orwellian fashion the lastest dogma from the top at the expense of service ethos and traditions.
Bah to the lot of them
At the end of WW2 there were 120 military aerodromes with tarmac runways in East Anglia.
Now there's just Marham and grunt-infested Wattisham.
So I'd say there's a need for something between 2 and 120?
Now there's just Marham and grunt-infested Wattisham.
So I'd say there's a need for something between 2 and 120?
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Airfields
L J R
How many airfields do we need? Probably only one. In the same way the army only need one big army base and the navy one big dockyard. Why dont we rip up HMS Victory and Belfast - we dont need them any more - nasty hulking relics of a bygone era. The wood and metal can be recycled into something useful like coca cans and JPA computers. Why do we need enormous army bases in the south of England? Prime real estate to be sold off so we can move HQ Land to Otterburn
How many airfields do we need? Probably only one. In the same way the army only need one big army base and the navy one big dockyard. Why dont we rip up HMS Victory and Belfast - we dont need them any more - nasty hulking relics of a bygone era. The wood and metal can be recycled into something useful like coca cans and JPA computers. Why do we need enormous army bases in the south of England? Prime real estate to be sold off so we can move HQ Land to Otterburn
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Last Colt days
I had an invite , but didnt go for reasons, christ gonna regret that!! Wonderful unit, 2 1/2 yrs spent there as an ATC/Opsie. Proud Sqns(54 was best obviously). My first posting and the fondest, even beating Gib, ive talked to so many peeps since who were at Colt........never never a bad word said. No other base in the RAF can honestly say that!
Originally Posted by BEagle
At the end of WW2 there were 120 military aerodromes with tarmac runways in East Anglia.
Now there's just Marham and grunt-infested Wattisham.
So I'd say there's a need for something between 2 and 120?
Now there's just Marham and grunt-infested Wattisham.
So I'd say there's a need for something between 2 and 120?
To think that Bernard Matthews probably owns more airfields in East Anglia than the MOD.
Wyton in East Anglia? Hmm - depends where you draw the line.
OK then, by that definition there might be a whole three military aerodromes left in East Anglia - although one has grunts squatting on it and another has hordes of pen pushing spanner-w@nkers and a few plastic-spastic Teutors.
Only one is what I would consider a 'real RAF aerodrome' - to think it was once know as 'El Adem with grass'!
OK then, by that definition there might be a whole three military aerodromes left in East Anglia - although one has grunts squatting on it and another has hordes of pen pushing spanner-w@nkers and a few plastic-spastic Teutors.
Only one is what I would consider a 'real RAF aerodrome' - to think it was once know as 'El Adem with grass'!
Last edited by BEagle; 5th Apr 2006 at 09:51.
Retaining infrastructure, equipment or personnel for sentiment alone is obviously silly.
And you could probably jam the whole of the current RAF onto a handful of bases.
BUT
Airfields are irreplaceable assets - you simply can not buy the land and build an airfield nowadays as you could in the 1930s, at least not in any meaningful timescale. So what happens if we ever need to expand in the future?
Why are we closing the most central, most retention-positive airfields in England while making a long term investment in bases in Taffistan and Jockistan, where there must be at least a chance that (long term) independence will deprive us of those airfields.
Why are we closing airfields when there are still Army (and RAF and even RN shore-based) units based at places without a runway? If we need to draw down, any infantry battalion should be based at a modern airfield, whose runways, lighting and tower should be kept operational. Aldershot? Close it and sell the land!
And you could probably jam the whole of the current RAF onto a handful of bases.
BUT
Airfields are irreplaceable assets - you simply can not buy the land and build an airfield nowadays as you could in the 1930s, at least not in any meaningful timescale. So what happens if we ever need to expand in the future?
Why are we closing the most central, most retention-positive airfields in England while making a long term investment in bases in Taffistan and Jockistan, where there must be at least a chance that (long term) independence will deprive us of those airfields.
Why are we closing airfields when there are still Army (and RAF and even RN shore-based) units based at places without a runway? If we need to draw down, any infantry battalion should be based at a modern airfield, whose runways, lighting and tower should be kept operational. Aldershot? Close it and sell the land!
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What about Oakhanger? Not really an aerodrome, more of a cosmodrome.
[coat, door, taxi................]
But back to the thread, I don't know of anyone who can say a bad word about Colt. 'Tis sad to see another one end it's playing days.
[coat, door, taxi................]
But back to the thread, I don't know of anyone who can say a bad word about Colt. 'Tis sad to see another one end it's playing days.
Diverted into Colt once in an F4 after my alleged leader had paid no attention to my 'Bingo' calls.......
Superbly well looked after. A really nice place with a can-do attitude.
Next time I visited was last year, some 20+ years later. As mere civilian filth, I drove to the guardroom, expecting the usual "Who are you, show yer ID, don't know nuffink' about it" you get elsewhere. But no - this was Colt and the non-contractorised guardroom staff were supremely courteous and helpful. They even arranged for the duty Landrover to show me where to go.
Later we had a meeting in the museum and a lecture from its volunteer custodian. Utterly amazing - but symptomatic of the corporate pride everyone had in the place. Looking around, it was like being back on a 'real' station before the days of the creeping cancer of contractorisation. It was well kept and overtly military - no scruffy civilians slouching about the place.
I hope that something has been done to secure the future of the museum - an astonishingly comprehensive collection of items all displayed immaculately.
The only real drawback to Colt was the poor road access.
I see that the navy are quibbling over Yeovilton or Dulldrose. Why don't they hand one or the other over to the RAF - or, even better, return Chivenor? Then we could close Valley......
Superbly well looked after. A really nice place with a can-do attitude.
Next time I visited was last year, some 20+ years later. As mere civilian filth, I drove to the guardroom, expecting the usual "Who are you, show yer ID, don't know nuffink' about it" you get elsewhere. But no - this was Colt and the non-contractorised guardroom staff were supremely courteous and helpful. They even arranged for the duty Landrover to show me where to go.
Later we had a meeting in the museum and a lecture from its volunteer custodian. Utterly amazing - but symptomatic of the corporate pride everyone had in the place. Looking around, it was like being back on a 'real' station before the days of the creeping cancer of contractorisation. It was well kept and overtly military - no scruffy civilians slouching about the place.
I hope that something has been done to secure the future of the museum - an astonishingly comprehensive collection of items all displayed immaculately.
The only real drawback to Colt was the poor road access.
I see that the navy are quibbling over Yeovilton or Dulldrose. Why don't they hand one or the other over to the RAF - or, even better, return Chivenor? Then we could close Valley......
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A real shame to lose another airfield in a location that people actually enjoyed living in. I remember in the early 90s that a particularly well connected (thru' Rugby) SMO at Colt had pointed out to the RAF Board that Colt was the happiest stn in the Service. How did he argue this? Lowest divorce rates, lowest rate of malingering at the med centre, lowest rate of depression amongst serving personnel etc.
In comparison, I recently asked an Army mate how they justified keeping little pokey units such as Westbury-on-Trym open. The RAF would have sold it off years ago I said. He looked at me as if I was a madman (probably justifiably) and said, 'bloody nice place to live, don't want to lose it'. Meanwhile, we're busily cramming more staff officers into High Wycombe and selling Bentley off. I'm all for giving the taxpayers value for money, but is everyone playing the same game as us?
In comparison, I recently asked an Army mate how they justified keeping little pokey units such as Westbury-on-Trym open. The RAF would have sold it off years ago I said. He looked at me as if I was a madman (probably justifiably) and said, 'bloody nice place to live, don't want to lose it'. Meanwhile, we're busily cramming more staff officers into High Wycombe and selling Bentley off. I'm all for giving the taxpayers value for money, but is everyone playing the same game as us?
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Great Stations
As we speak the RAF still has a few nice little stations and one of them is RAF Woodvale. A great oasis of calm and sanity in the wacky world of performance indicators and focus groups. Maybe not for much longer, if the UAS system gets messed about.
RAF Stations
Just before I left the service some wag suggested that eventually the RAF (Royal Air Flight) would be based at one station. His nomination was Cranwell.(What's yours ?)
We would have one trainer, one FJ, one transport etc.
All maintained by an offshoot of Aeroflot who put in the lowest tender for the 5 day week. However he insisted we would still have an ACM as the CAS with all the corresponding high level rank structure to go with it (including the same level of civil service 'support' )
We seem to be heading towards this state of affairs
sooner than he could have imagined
We would have one trainer, one FJ, one transport etc.
All maintained by an offshoot of Aeroflot who put in the lowest tender for the 5 day week. However he insisted we would still have an ACM as the CAS with all the corresponding high level rank structure to go with it (including the same level of civil service 'support' )
We seem to be heading towards this state of affairs
sooner than he could have imagined
Talking of airfield closures, whatever happened to the Defence Airfield Review Team (DART) report that was due last December?
When it was announced in late 2004 there were 73 military airfields in the UK, since then Coltishall has closed and Lyneham is scheduled to close, so that makes 71.
Whilst agreeing fully with BEags and others that it is sad to see these places go (of all the airfields I either served or trained at only Coningsby(edited to add that I must have obliterated from my memory banks that OTHER surviving station; VALLEY) is left!) is there really a case to retain all 73?
Jackonicko makes a good point about future expansion, if ten or 20 years down the line we face a very different world situation could we open new airfields, would we need to by then?
It wasn't as easy as many think to acquire land for airfield construction in the 1930's, it was done in the face of fierce opposition from the very influential landed gentry of the time.
Is there an outside possibility that the MOD is actually thinking along these lines with the hand over of airfields to the Army? If down the line you HAD to expand then there are many places currently serving our green bretheren that could be employed. Even in cases such as Bassingbourn and Waterbeach where the runways have gone the land remains on MOD ownership, the same applies with retained though not maintained runways in dozens of other locations.
When it was announced in late 2004 there were 73 military airfields in the UK, since then Coltishall has closed and Lyneham is scheduled to close, so that makes 71.
Whilst agreeing fully with BEags and others that it is sad to see these places go (of all the airfields I either served or trained at only Coningsby(edited to add that I must have obliterated from my memory banks that OTHER surviving station; VALLEY) is left!) is there really a case to retain all 73?
Jackonicko makes a good point about future expansion, if ten or 20 years down the line we face a very different world situation could we open new airfields, would we need to by then?
It wasn't as easy as many think to acquire land for airfield construction in the 1930's, it was done in the face of fierce opposition from the very influential landed gentry of the time.
Is there an outside possibility that the MOD is actually thinking along these lines with the hand over of airfields to the Army? If down the line you HAD to expand then there are many places currently serving our green bretheren that could be employed. Even in cases such as Bassingbourn and Waterbeach where the runways have gone the land remains on MOD ownership, the same applies with retained though not maintained runways in dozens of other locations.
Last edited by pr00ne; 5th Apr 2006 at 13:17.
It may not have been easy to buy and build aerodromes in the 1930s, but it was easier, quicker and cheaper than it would be today.
Mowing a few grass runways and slapping up a couple of hangars was easier than erecting all the paraphernalia we expect and need today.
Moreover, those stations still in use in 2000 were the best located, best equipped, and most worth retaining.
And I still think that getting rid of stations in Scotland and Wales (and perhaps Cornwall) would be better than divesting ourselves of core infrastructure in England.
Mowing a few grass runways and slapping up a couple of hangars was easier than erecting all the paraphernalia we expect and need today.
Moreover, those stations still in use in 2000 were the best located, best equipped, and most worth retaining.
And I still think that getting rid of stations in Scotland and Wales (and perhaps Cornwall) would be better than divesting ourselves of core infrastructure in England.
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For anyone whos interested in the museum at Colt...
The contents will be dispersed by the end of next month according to the EDP. Parts of the collection could find their way to the radar museum at Neatishead. The City of Norwich Aviation Museum at Horsham St Faith could get some it, as could a few other places.
The historian, Mick Jennings, owns 90% of the contents and will want to take a proportion of the artifacts with him as he's emigrating to Australia. He plans to write a book on Colt and return to the UK to give talking tours.
The contents will be dispersed by the end of next month according to the EDP. Parts of the collection could find their way to the radar museum at Neatishead. The City of Norwich Aviation Museum at Horsham St Faith could get some it, as could a few other places.
The historian, Mick Jennings, owns 90% of the contents and will want to take a proportion of the artifacts with him as he's emigrating to Australia. He plans to write a book on Colt and return to the UK to give talking tours.
Wallowing
Having spent a fair amount of my time wallowing around below Vsafe single engine around and about Colt, I think we're missing the point of this thread. At the last 2 parades at Colt, 54 and 16's demise and last weekend, CAS spoke very briefly about history and affection for units, jets and bases. Then he quickly moved on to the future and how we should all be looking there and not backwards. For me he's missing the point. The entire weekend was designed to be a celebration of the base's history, the personnel that have served there and their memories - he correctly, IMHO, declared that those memories and allegainces would go with us all. Much as I may think Typhoon is wonderful, Coningsby is a fantastic place to bring up your kids and Lincoln is great shopping area, I didn't want to hear it, either this weekend or 12 months ago. I wanted to wallow in how great we'd all been, what a superb place Colt was and how we'd all miss it. I have never seen so many old mates in the bar on Fri and I thought the ball was superb. I will never forget the hollow feeling driving away though, past the OMQs I'd lived in, (all 3 empty, one of them condemned), knowing I spent the last night ever in that Mess, drunk my last pint of Jaguar beer and attended the last ever ball. Say what you will, I was miserable and it's still sinking in. I'm not sure I like this air force any more. 