Capped Actuals
Join Date: Jan 2006
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Ref: The Leave Thing
On the point about leave raised above...
The leave year will become 1 April - 31 March. We will still get 30 days annual leave and up to 15 automatically carried over, and will still have to apply for additional leave to be carried over - so no change there.
We will also be changing to POL (replacing PODL), which is an Army system. We will get one day leave automatically added to our entitlement for every 9 days spent OOA (so 13 days for 4 months, 20 days for 6 months).
Hope this is useful!
The leave year will become 1 April - 31 March. We will still get 30 days annual leave and up to 15 automatically carried over, and will still have to apply for additional leave to be carried over - so no change there.
We will also be changing to POL (replacing PODL), which is an Army system. We will get one day leave automatically added to our entitlement for every 9 days spent OOA (so 13 days for 4 months, 20 days for 6 months).
Hope this is useful!
Join Date: Nov 2000
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BEags,
Perhaps we can work 'capped actuals' because there will soon only be half-a-dozen or so aircrew to administer. Here's what the USAF does:
https://secureapp2.hqda.pentagon.mil...diemrates.html
I doubt it would be possible to run the system proposed for the RAF, in the USAF - they'd need to hire a few thousand more blunties to do the paperwork.
Perhaps we can work 'capped actuals' because there will soon only be half-a-dozen or so aircrew to administer. Here's what the USAF does:
https://secureapp2.hqda.pentagon.mil...diemrates.html
I doubt it would be possible to run the system proposed for the RAF, in the USAF - they'd need to hire a few thousand more blunties to do the paperwork.
Join Date: Mar 2005
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Why is it that the folks at the coal face must continually bare the brunt of the high and mighty's career pushing. The system works as it is, so why change it. This seems to be apparent throughout our armed services. JPA, whilst conforming to the draw down in personnel, will actually produce more work for those already struggling with current manning levels.
I'm sure most of us can comment on sections being stretched to the limit already. Now add the admin of JPA, plus self accounting for all dets. When is it we are supposed to find the time to fix and fly the very things the Air Force is here to do?
Can you image the extra workload on an SH loadie? After having to watch what they spend for the 9 months they're away, they then have to do all the admin they haven't been able to do, BECAUSE they've been away doing the cr***y things HMG tell us to do.
Stinks of yet more penny pinching and stretching of what can only be described as the premier armed services in the world. Once again, we are being asked to do more with less. When will our illustrious leaders actualy see this for it is??
Rant off!
I'm sure most of us can comment on sections being stretched to the limit already. Now add the admin of JPA, plus self accounting for all dets. When is it we are supposed to find the time to fix and fly the very things the Air Force is here to do?
Can you image the extra workload on an SH loadie? After having to watch what they spend for the 9 months they're away, they then have to do all the admin they haven't been able to do, BECAUSE they've been away doing the cr***y things HMG tell us to do.
Stinks of yet more penny pinching and stretching of what can only be described as the premier armed services in the world. Once again, we are being asked to do more with less. When will our illustrious leaders actualy see this for it is??
Rant off!
Join Date: Jan 2006
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JPA - Good or Bad?
I agree with some of what you say, Markerboy, but there are some aspects of JPA that will save time. No more waiting for 1771s to be returned with red pen just because you misspelt something, no more waiting for claims to be authorised (unless you get picked for audit), automatic payment of LSA and grant of POL so you won't have to check that your admin people put you on the system. Appraisals (when we start using JPA for reports) will be much simpler, and therefore quicker.
Also, you speak as if you won't be able to use JPA when detached - not true if you have any admin support, so there won't be a pile of admin tasks waiting for you on return (although I'm not 100% convinced that the access to JPA whilst deployed has really been thought through - I'll reserve judgement at the moment).
I agree that the actuals-not-rates thing will cause headaches, but JPA is not all bad. On the whole I think JPA is a good thing, although it will have its faults.
<submits fully expecting to cause a heated debate...>
Also, you speak as if you won't be able to use JPA when detached - not true if you have any admin support, so there won't be a pile of admin tasks waiting for you on return (although I'm not 100% convinced that the access to JPA whilst deployed has really been thought through - I'll reserve judgement at the moment).
I agree that the actuals-not-rates thing will cause headaches, but JPA is not all bad. On the whole I think JPA is a good thing, although it will have its faults.
<submits fully expecting to cause a heated debate...>
Join Date: Oct 2004
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Another little belter that was kept on the QT for as long as possible is the fact that as of the end of March, only days spent on "operations or op-focussed " detachments will count towards a DWR credit.
This means that all of the days you spend away on Flag, TLP, CQWI, etc..etc.. DO NOT COUNT FOR ANYTHING
SO in theory, people may be spending 6 months away each year on det, then return to a nice little DWR for 4-6 months.
Seriously now, how on God's earth are they expecting to retain personnel with working conditions like these?
This means that all of the days you spend away on Flag, TLP, CQWI, etc..etc.. DO NOT COUNT FOR ANYTHING
SO in theory, people may be spending 6 months away each year on det, then return to a nice little DWR for 4-6 months.
Seriously now, how on God's earth are they expecting to retain personnel with working conditions like these?
Join Date: Aug 2004
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I wonder if we should put a cap on the number of people pulling the Black and Yellow once this daft scheme comes in. I am surprised that anyone is defending the daftest scheme since King Olaf the Hairy ordered 20,000 Battle helmets with the horns on the inside. We are turning into Black adder. All our masters seem to be General Melchiat, helped out by Capt Darling.
This hair brained scheme just will not work for Detachments and down route crews. The problems it creates are too numerous. Flight safety for the crews will eventually come into play. The poster with the guy with the world on his back and the one that says don't take you personnel problems flying, well aren't we doing just that. I hope someone high and mighty reads this thread as we are creating a nightmare. The poor imprest holder down route on a 14hr minimum rest stop will struggle to get a good nights sleep, once he has dished out the cash, found a suitable restaurant, asked for 14 individual bills, etc... All that after the 2hr faff at ALL american bases. I joined for life initially, but already I am seriously considering jumping what seems a doomed ship. I don't think many people want to be in the situation of doing the job of 2 people with a lesser quality of life.
Rant over, by the way my point was Flight Safety!!
This hair brained scheme just will not work for Detachments and down route crews. The problems it creates are too numerous. Flight safety for the crews will eventually come into play. The poster with the guy with the world on his back and the one that says don't take you personnel problems flying, well aren't we doing just that. I hope someone high and mighty reads this thread as we are creating a nightmare. The poor imprest holder down route on a 14hr minimum rest stop will struggle to get a good nights sleep, once he has dished out the cash, found a suitable restaurant, asked for 14 individual bills, etc... All that after the 2hr faff at ALL american bases. I joined for life initially, but already I am seriously considering jumping what seems a doomed ship. I don't think many people want to be in the situation of doing the job of 2 people with a lesser quality of life. Rant over, by the way my point was Flight Safety!!
Join Date: Dec 2002
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Roguedent,
If the system relies on the imprest holder to collect and chase up receipts, then yes, it will be a royal pain in the a$$. But if it's left to individuals to keep their own receipts and input their claims on JPA, then the workload will be no less for the imprest holder than it already is ? Give out the money, record it on the balance sheet, hand it back in at home base.
I know my first post gave a defence for the system, but I do feel that this is not the kind of crap we need to be worrying about down route. If a member of my crew loses a receipt, I don't want them worrying about their accountability and the chance of being investigated for fraud whilst operating on the next sector. But I'm afraid that is what's going to happen . . .
If the system relies on the imprest holder to collect and chase up receipts, then yes, it will be a royal pain in the a$$. But if it's left to individuals to keep their own receipts and input their claims on JPA, then the workload will be no less for the imprest holder than it already is ? Give out the money, record it on the balance sheet, hand it back in at home base.
I know my first post gave a defence for the system, but I do feel that this is not the kind of crap we need to be worrying about down route. If a member of my crew loses a receipt, I don't want them worrying about their accountability and the chance of being investigated for fraud whilst operating on the next sector. But I'm afraid that is what's going to happen . . .
Join Date: Oct 2004
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Bicycle Mileage
I have learned from a (former) colleague working in Whitehall that those occupying service accommodation (Messes, quarters and 'lodgings') will now have to contribute towards the 'home to duty' costs. This friend cycles to/from MOD and is required to contributed one mile each way, each day, for the privalege of doing so. I suspect that recovery costs possible exceed the payment for the use of a bicycle. In the big world outside, even me in my Ivory tower can see that this is an absurdity...
CC
CC
Last edited by Cambridge Crash; 3rd Feb 2006 at 08:51.
Join Date: Jan 2006
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Home to Duty
The Home to Duty Travel (HDT) allowances (according to the new guide) read as follows:
If you travel daily between a RWA ("home" to the lay folk) and your place of duty you may claim HDT (Public) if you live in public accommodation, or HDT (Private) if you live in private accommodation. The allowance is based on the actual distance you travel, up to a maximum of 50 miles per single journey, less a personal contribution of 1 mile per single journey for HDT (Public) and 9 miles per single journey for HDT (Private). Automated claims are paid via salary and manual claims should be submitted via the JPA Expenses Claim system. (JSP 752 Ch 4 Sect 13 refers)
So he won't actually be 'paying' a personal contribution, he will just receive an allowance for one mile less than he actually travels. Now, since I live in the Mess and walk to work in the morning I have no idea how this will impact on people getting allowances at the moment - any one like to assess this impact?
If you travel daily between a RWA ("home" to the lay folk) and your place of duty you may claim HDT (Public) if you live in public accommodation, or HDT (Private) if you live in private accommodation. The allowance is based on the actual distance you travel, up to a maximum of 50 miles per single journey, less a personal contribution of 1 mile per single journey for HDT (Public) and 9 miles per single journey for HDT (Private). Automated claims are paid via salary and manual claims should be submitted via the JPA Expenses Claim system. (JSP 752 Ch 4 Sect 13 refers)
So he won't actually be 'paying' a personal contribution, he will just receive an allowance for one mile less than he actually travels. Now, since I live in the Mess and walk to work in the morning I have no idea how this will impact on people getting allowances at the moment - any one like to assess this impact?
Join Date: Jan 2003
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If it gets in the way of doing our job we should be prepared to HFOR.
I dont want to see a case where crew members are distracted from their primary duties by accounting admin.
On another note:
If we have ONE experienced Pilot, Nav, Eng etc leave the RAF because this is the final straw, or because he is a rate collector. (There is a guy on every Sqn who is either hard up or tight) THEN IT COSTS THE SERVICE MILLIONS.................NO SAVING.................NO SENSE...........
I don't think that I am over reacting, I can think of many good men that feel they are being pushed over the edge. Why have the blunties underestimated the ill feeling this is causing and the false economy.
I dont want to see a case where crew members are distracted from their primary duties by accounting admin.
On another note:
If we have ONE experienced Pilot, Nav, Eng etc leave the RAF because this is the final straw, or because he is a rate collector. (There is a guy on every Sqn who is either hard up or tight) THEN IT COSTS THE SERVICE MILLIONS.................NO SAVING.................NO SENSE...........
I don't think that I am over reacting, I can think of many good men that feel they are being pushed over the edge. Why have the blunties underestimated the ill feeling this is causing and the false economy.
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Originally Posted by The Rocket
Another little belter that was kept on the QT for as long as possible is the fact that as of the end of March, only days spent on "operations or op-focussed " detachments will count towards a DWR credit.
This means that all of the days you spend away on Flag, TLP, CQWI, etc..etc.. DO NOT COUNT FOR ANYTHING
SO in theory, people may be spending 6 months away each year on det, then return to a nice little DWR for 4-6 months.
Seriously now, how on God's earth are they expecting to retain personnel with working conditions like these?
This means that all of the days you spend away on Flag, TLP, CQWI, etc..etc.. DO NOT COUNT FOR ANYTHING
SO in theory, people may be spending 6 months away each year on det, then return to a nice little DWR for 4-6 months.
Seriously now, how on God's earth are they expecting to retain personnel with working conditions like these?
Rocket - this has always been the case, it is not a new JPAism.
For those not in the now about DWR credits. The are used when selecting Ground Trades personnel for NFU operational (and FI) detachments. They do not apply to officers and NCAircrew nor are they used for selecting ground trades for FU detachments.
"Originally Posted by The Rocket
Another little belter that was kept on the QT for as long as possible is the fact that as of the end of March, only days spent on "operations or op-focussed " detachments will count towards a DWR credit.
This means that all of the days you spend away on Flag, TLP, CQWI, etc..etc.. DO NOT COUNT FOR ANYTHING
SO in theory, people may be spending 6 months away each year on det, then return to a nice little DWR for 4-6 months.
Seriously now, how on God's earth are they expecting to retain personnel with working conditions like these?
Rocket - this has always been the case, it is not a new JPAism.
For those not in the now about DWR credits. The are used when selecting Ground Trades personnel for NFU operational (and FI) detachments. They do not apply to officers and NCAircrew nor are they used for selecting ground trades for FU detachments."
There is suprisingly a way around this
but you must have good management who will back you to the hilt and as always have your facts straight. Should some one be "selected" for a DWR but has done more than the required for a freeze "90 in a 12 month perioc iirc) a polite conversation followed by a letter to the drafter should sort out and get you positive results. It has for a couple of people who worked for me. One of whom had 120 (63 operational) days in nine months but was still selected for a Falklands tour.
Couldn't do that quote thingy sorry for ugly layout
Another little belter that was kept on the QT for as long as possible is the fact that as of the end of March, only days spent on "operations or op-focussed " detachments will count towards a DWR credit.
This means that all of the days you spend away on Flag, TLP, CQWI, etc..etc.. DO NOT COUNT FOR ANYTHING
SO in theory, people may be spending 6 months away each year on det, then return to a nice little DWR for 4-6 months.
Seriously now, how on God's earth are they expecting to retain personnel with working conditions like these?
Rocket - this has always been the case, it is not a new JPAism.
For those not in the now about DWR credits. The are used when selecting Ground Trades personnel for NFU operational (and FI) detachments. They do not apply to officers and NCAircrew nor are they used for selecting ground trades for FU detachments."
There is suprisingly a way around this
but you must have good management who will back you to the hilt and as always have your facts straight. Should some one be "selected" for a DWR but has done more than the required for a freeze "90 in a 12 month perioc iirc) a polite conversation followed by a letter to the drafter should sort out and get you positive results. It has for a couple of people who worked for me. One of whom had 120 (63 operational) days in nine months but was still selected for a Falklands tour.Couldn't do that quote thingy sorry for ugly layout
Join Date: Apr 2002
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It appears to me that the people at the rear are saving pennies but losing millions. As more and more "good ideas" come in, the benefits of remaining in the Service doing a job I love are decreasing every year.
The hypocrisy of it all is baffling. We are expected to do what we are told, go where we are told and achieve the aim but not spend money in the process. I look at other Public services such as the NHS which despite injections of billions of pounds is running up huge debts and think that pound for pound this countrys armed forces give the best value for money.
Unfortunately the people at the top |(not necessarily in uniform) and the Treasury see UKAF as an easy target for savings. We have no proper voice with which to object or voice our concerns. The Prime Minister, despite warnings in the media continues to send more and more people away on Operations stretching already stretched resources but seems unwilling to fund these deployments.
I believe that the next 5 years are probably some of the most important years for the Armed Forces in recent memory. If not properly managed/funded/resourced, the Country could end up with a poorly equiped, under manned and badly supported military, unable to contribute to the world stability.
I know this is a thread about JPA but it is all related morale. Don't get me wrong I love my job but sometimes you feel like you are banging your head against a wall.
The hypocrisy of it all is baffling. We are expected to do what we are told, go where we are told and achieve the aim but not spend money in the process. I look at other Public services such as the NHS which despite injections of billions of pounds is running up huge debts and think that pound for pound this countrys armed forces give the best value for money.
Unfortunately the people at the top |(not necessarily in uniform) and the Treasury see UKAF as an easy target for savings. We have no proper voice with which to object or voice our concerns. The Prime Minister, despite warnings in the media continues to send more and more people away on Operations stretching already stretched resources but seems unwilling to fund these deployments.
I believe that the next 5 years are probably some of the most important years for the Armed Forces in recent memory. If not properly managed/funded/resourced, the Country could end up with a poorly equiped, under manned and badly supported military, unable to contribute to the world stability.
I know this is a thread about JPA but it is all related morale. Don't get me wrong I love my job but sometimes you feel like you are banging your head against a wall.
Join Date: Oct 2004
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[QUOTE=comedyjock]
If not properly managed/funded/resourced, the Country could end up with a poorly equiped, under manned and badly supported military, unable to contribute to the world stability.
Haven't we got that now??
If not properly managed/funded/resourced, the Country could end up with a poorly equiped, under manned and badly supported military, unable to contribute to the world stability.
Haven't we got that now??
Join Date: Feb 2006
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Did you forget that you get paid
My god, im amazed at the comments. Try working for a civi company there arnt any ive come accross that pay "Rates". The salary aid bad lads and if you think the Service owes you a living, get a life, and if you cant do that go and get a job outside.
You get a wage because you do a job, and enhanced wage because of the X factor, and flying pay for err doing you job. Now you want beer money too...get a life
You get a wage because you do a job, and enhanced wage because of the X factor, and flying pay for err doing you job. Now you want beer money too...get a life
Join Date: Oct 2004
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Try working for a civvy company that pays rates??
The civvy chefs in iraq are on far more than any serviceman out there....
The bodyguards are on stupid money a day, flown around by us lot, who are on a whole lot less.... i think we have a right to complain - we are constantly asked to do far more and so much is taken away.
The civvy chefs in iraq are on far more than any serviceman out there....
The bodyguards are on stupid money a day, flown around by us lot, who are on a whole lot less.... i think we have a right to complain - we are constantly asked to do far more and so much is taken away.
Join Date: Feb 2006
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oh really
i think you've made my point for me...
civi chefs et al, do get pay enhancements, which by the way is the equivalent of getting the X factor and flying pay and boarding school and just about err 100 or so allowances...food, well feed yourself, oh you dont you get the money back you pay out.....
Point made
civi chefs et al, do get pay enhancements, which by the way is the equivalent of getting the X factor and flying pay and boarding school and just about err 100 or so allowances...food, well feed yourself, oh you dont you get the money back you pay out.....
Point made