3 more Apache pilots resign
Purveyor of Egg Liqueur to Lucifer
As any military person will know, there is not a single piece of equipment, from the humble sock to the super-snazzy jet fighter, that has worked as advertised at any stage of its time in service.
And ultimately, regardless of the hot air about who should fly it (done to death in so many other threads, so please not start it here!) the bottom line with the Lynx Fleet being reduced, Gazelles joining history and according to the press releases only 48 frontline AH, then every single seat in any Army aircraft is high value for their own Corps and future career progressions.
Is it true that they are the 'safest' TA unit to be a part of, bearing in mind present TA deployments?
Just wondered!
SS
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It's been said before, but will bear saying again. Like any new bit of kit, there is a honeymoon period, followed by a reality check.
When the Scout came into service, contrary to urban myth, it was such a piece of Sh1t, that the light-blue jobs bought Alouette 2 off the shelf so that they had something to fly. Much, much later was the old brussel sprout considered the landrover of the skies - and even then it was rumoured that on completion of a Scout AH1 conversion the successful candidate filled in a Green Endorsement but left the date blank - it was not a case of if, but when, the mighty Nimbus would fail...
The Apache is a mighty piece of kit, and is currently operated by the leading experts (at least in Europe), at direct-fire weapons from rotary aircraft. Let us hope that they do not continue to leach manpower of the quality that they seem content to do so. Several very fine young men indeed appear to have just had enough, including one Sandhurst Sword of Honour Winner (how's the sword case JVB). The other two that I know of are also a huge loss to a fine Corps.
When the Scout came into service, contrary to urban myth, it was such a piece of Sh1t, that the light-blue jobs bought Alouette 2 off the shelf so that they had something to fly. Much, much later was the old brussel sprout considered the landrover of the skies - and even then it was rumoured that on completion of a Scout AH1 conversion the successful candidate filled in a Green Endorsement but left the date blank - it was not a case of if, but when, the mighty Nimbus would fail...
The Apache is a mighty piece of kit, and is currently operated by the leading experts (at least in Europe), at direct-fire weapons from rotary aircraft. Let us hope that they do not continue to leach manpower of the quality that they seem content to do so. Several very fine young men indeed appear to have just had enough, including one Sandhurst Sword of Honour Winner (how's the sword case JVB). The other two that I know of are also a huge loss to a fine Corps.
Indeed - that compo can widger was an engineering masterpiece! One of the few military things which actually did what it was supposed to.
As did the old 'gorilla snot' glue for joining maps together.
As did the old 'gorilla snot' glue for joining maps together.
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Aytoo, the Sandhurst Sword of Honour Winner that you speak of hasn't had enough of the Apache, I hear it's the thought of no more Apache flying that he's not happy with. Indeed it's the same old Army Air Corps Officer career profile that a lot of bright young Army Officers have to come to terms with, or leave the Corps. I dare say that for the first time this profile is coming to bite the AAC on the @rse. It now takes too long to train a replacement Apache Flight Commander, to the point that Apache CTT (already pushed to the limit) won't be able to keep the numbers of Apache pilots up to the required quantity! At a time when the requirement is for the number of pilots to increase, it makes no sense to remove pilots from a flying role at a time when this fledgling pragram is trying to grow.
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Good point about YOs leaving due to career path restrictions.
Are these 3 leaving all officer Apache pilots?
Are they all QHIs?
I am told it is more than 3? (4 from Dishforth and 3 from Wallop)??which doesn't seem like many to me but when it is out of a small number I guess it does make a difference.
I thought the PA spine was designed to keep these guys in? or does the AAC army career path still come first?
I genuinelly hope the AAC doesn't blow Apache and handit on a plate to another service who will be able to man it...
I am due to go on Apache CTT soon and am interested if I am going to get the flying I am being promised or whetehr it is more of the same but leaving me even less competent as I will have even less time to get to grips with a more complicated platform. Why won't they let us get good?
Are these 3 leaving all officer Apache pilots?
Are they all QHIs?
I am told it is more than 3? (4 from Dishforth and 3 from Wallop)??which doesn't seem like many to me but when it is out of a small number I guess it does make a difference.
I thought the PA spine was designed to keep these guys in? or does the AAC army career path still come first?
I genuinelly hope the AAC doesn't blow Apache and handit on a plate to another service who will be able to man it...
I am due to go on Apache CTT soon and am interested if I am going to get the flying I am being promised or whetehr it is more of the same but leaving me even less competent as I will have even less time to get to grips with a more complicated platform. Why won't they let us get good?
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Fenestronuk, if you want to see what life in an Attack Sqn is like pop up to Dishforth if you get the chance. You could also go to 673 Sqn at Wallop, but bare in mind that they a funded by ATRA, the 673 Sqn crewroom cost more than 656 Sqns hangar!! Only joking but they are well looked after.
The program needs top quality individuals who want to fly the Apache because the Apache is what they want to fly, without that want, you'll fall by the way-side. It is hard graft, no two ways about it, and it's a long old haul, but every time you sit in the cockpit (front or rear seat) you'll grin from ear to ear and when you let rip with the M230 for the first time, your world will rock.
Give us a call on 94713 4669 and have a chat.
Merry Christmas
Tom
P.S. Not sure about who has or who hasn't resigned, but it's sure getting people talking!
The program needs top quality individuals who want to fly the Apache because the Apache is what they want to fly, without that want, you'll fall by the way-side. It is hard graft, no two ways about it, and it's a long old haul, but every time you sit in the cockpit (front or rear seat) you'll grin from ear to ear and when you let rip with the M230 for the first time, your world will rock.
Give us a call on 94713 4669 and have a chat.
Merry Christmas
Tom
P.S. Not sure about who has or who hasn't resigned, but it's sure getting people talking!
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TRF,
Looking at the timing of your post, you MAY just be excused for attempting to crowbar this thread into the traditional crab v pongo slanging match - but I doubt it! There are very serious issues being discussed here, but the ownership of said capable piece of hardware ought not to be one of them.
All right then, at your level - just how much experience has the SH force got in direct fire weapons against armour or even SSVs? Really? As much as all that?
ps - do you fly the front or the back cyclic
Looking at the timing of your post, you MAY just be excused for attempting to crowbar this thread into the traditional crab v pongo slanging match - but I doubt it! There are very serious issues being discussed here, but the ownership of said capable piece of hardware ought not to be one of them.
All right then, at your level - just how much experience has the SH force got in direct fire weapons against armour or even SSVs? Really? As much as all that?
ps - do you fly the front or the back cyclic
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Can someone confirm as QHI656 states - who has resigned?
Can someone confirm the following have resigned (not including those chopped):
3 (BA, PD, SG) ex A model QHIs in USA in the early days
1 (KM) to industry
1 (TD) to Shawbury DHFS as FBH QHI
RQHI 9 Reg (MG)
Ops Offr 9 Reg (DW)
Adjt 9 Reg (RT) - not sure if he is Apache trained
Ex OC 673 Sqn (NW)
Ex SSM 673 Sqn (SW)
Rumour of RN exchange pilot (SD) too
Rumour of one member of AMTAT (CW or CE?)
Reg Flt Comd (JVB)?
This can not be good news for the program at this stage.
What I want to know is why? and what can we do about it? particularly as alot of these QHIs have a great deal of experience that we should not be loosing before we have even finished fielding Apache.
Positive proposals only but obviously appreciate the negatives will address the why question. Think broadly and yes ownership may be one solution but I doubt it.
I may be in a position to try and help.
Can someone confirm the following have resigned (not including those chopped):
3 (BA, PD, SG) ex A model QHIs in USA in the early days
1 (KM) to industry
1 (TD) to Shawbury DHFS as FBH QHI
RQHI 9 Reg (MG)
Ops Offr 9 Reg (DW)
Adjt 9 Reg (RT) - not sure if he is Apache trained
Ex OC 673 Sqn (NW)
Ex SSM 673 Sqn (SW)
Rumour of RN exchange pilot (SD) too
Rumour of one member of AMTAT (CW or CE?)
Reg Flt Comd (JVB)?
This can not be good news for the program at this stage.
What I want to know is why? and what can we do about it? particularly as alot of these QHIs have a great deal of experience that we should not be loosing before we have even finished fielding Apache.
Positive proposals only but obviously appreciate the negatives will address the why question. Think broadly and yes ownership may be one solution but I doubt it.
I may be in a position to try and help.
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Re: 3 more Apache pilots resign
CSRO, if you might be in a position to try and help, why not pick up a telephone and call the units or individuals effected?
Check PM
Check PM
Last edited by AHQHI656SQN; 3rd Jan 2006 at 20:29.
Re: 3 more Apache pilots resign
CSRO,
Your apparant lack of knowledge is at odds with the intimate depth of knowledge you appear to have of individuals career plans. If you feel that you can help, how about doing it? You should not have to be asked.
Your apparant lack of knowledge is at odds with the intimate depth of knowledge you appear to have of individuals career plans. If you feel that you can help, how about doing it? You should not have to be asked.
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Re: 3 more Apache pilots resign
Crab Beefer,
The RAF cannot yet fill the Lynx exchange QHI slot at SAAvn (after gapping it for 3 months already and looking at another 3 months until it is filled), let alone front up with a suitable candidate for AH. Rumour has it that the proposed individual is ex-RN, recently transferred to the RAF and on his first posting. Lots of confidence in the quality then......
BS
The RAF cannot yet fill the Lynx exchange QHI slot at SAAvn (after gapping it for 3 months already and looking at another 3 months until it is filled), let alone front up with a suitable candidate for AH. Rumour has it that the proposed individual is ex-RN, recently transferred to the RAF and on his first posting. Lots of confidence in the quality then......
BS
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Re: 3 more Apache pilots resign
Cant let this one disappear, its not even started to hit any raw nerves yet!
I must ask this question, just why are AH pilots so down in the mouth about life in an AH sqn??
Honesty must be the best policy if anything is to change.
I must ask this question, just why are AH pilots so down in the mouth about life in an AH sqn??
Honesty must be the best policy if anything is to change.
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Re: 3 more Apache pilots resign
Peoplespoet
You ought to read what folks who actually fly the Apache say rather than fishing for manure. AH pilots are not down in the mouth.
Check out AHQHI's posts on this thread - 'he wouldn't want to go to war wearing anything else' he goes on to say, I paraphrase, it needs dedicated people who really want to do this and it is challenging. He's even offering visits to an AH Sqn for likely applicants to check it out before they apply. I assume you do not fall into this category since you seem to know little about the Apache or the men and women who fly it.
LB
You ought to read what folks who actually fly the Apache say rather than fishing for manure. AH pilots are not down in the mouth.
Check out AHQHI's posts on this thread - 'he wouldn't want to go to war wearing anything else' he goes on to say, I paraphrase, it needs dedicated people who really want to do this and it is challenging. He's even offering visits to an AH Sqn for likely applicants to check it out before they apply. I assume you do not fall into this category since you seem to know little about the Apache or the men and women who fly it.
LB