Who to vote for...?
Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 496
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From: Norwich, UK
Who to vote for...?
Ok everyone, this is my first election where i'm old enough to vote... as a youngster I figured i'd vote because if ya don't vote, you've got no right to complain - and I love to complain.
So what am I basing my votes on? Well for me, 3 things... immigration and asylum (where i'm from, lots of 'em), education (off to Uni in September), and the party's stand on Defence (looking to my hopeful future career).
Now I can find the info on asylum and education, but nothing for the Conservatives on Defence, and when it comes to Labour:
"Labour is the party of strong defence. We are providing the strategy and resources necessary for the effective defence of Britain and its interests. We are increasing the defence budget by £3.5 billion by 2005/6 - the largest sustained real increase in defence spending plans for 20 years. This contrasts with Conservative plans to cut defence spending in real terms by £1.5 billion - the equivalent of cutting the armed forces by 40,000 personnel"
(Labour Policies - http://www.labour.org.uk/defence04/)
So what are the stances? Labour just did all those cuts yet claim to be pro-Defence budget? Eh? How does that work?
Even at my age I know that the manifesto's are just what you want to hear, when it comes to doing them, not always happening... but at least vote for the people who lying in your favour right?
I'm not asking anyone political stance, or who you'll be voting for etc, however can someone slightly more educated and wise give me a wee bit more information?
Thanks
So what am I basing my votes on? Well for me, 3 things... immigration and asylum (where i'm from, lots of 'em), education (off to Uni in September), and the party's stand on Defence (looking to my hopeful future career).
Now I can find the info on asylum and education, but nothing for the Conservatives on Defence, and when it comes to Labour:
"Labour is the party of strong defence. We are providing the strategy and resources necessary for the effective defence of Britain and its interests. We are increasing the defence budget by £3.5 billion by 2005/6 - the largest sustained real increase in defence spending plans for 20 years. This contrasts with Conservative plans to cut defence spending in real terms by £1.5 billion - the equivalent of cutting the armed forces by 40,000 personnel"
(Labour Policies - http://www.labour.org.uk/defence04/)
So what are the stances? Labour just did all those cuts yet claim to be pro-Defence budget? Eh? How does that work?
Even at my age I know that the manifesto's are just what you want to hear, when it comes to doing them, not always happening... but at least vote for the people who lying in your favour right?
I'm not asking anyone political stance, or who you'll be voting for etc, however can someone slightly more educated and wise give me a wee bit more information?
Thanks
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 3,083
Likes: 253
From: London/Oxford/New York
Joe2812,
“Labour just did all those cuts yet claim to be pro-Defence budget?”
Labour increased the defence budget for the third successive year, you won’t find a post Cold War Tory Gov’t ever having done that.
The Tory party will chop an additional £2.7Bn from defence support costs to fund silly things like restoring historic infantry regiments in Scotland that have not been able to maintain recruiting numbers for over 20 years and further privatise and out source key defence activities.
“Labour just did all those cuts yet claim to be pro-Defence budget?”
Labour increased the defence budget for the third successive year, you won’t find a post Cold War Tory Gov’t ever having done that.
The Tory party will chop an additional £2.7Bn from defence support costs to fund silly things like restoring historic infantry regiments in Scotland that have not been able to maintain recruiting numbers for over 20 years and further privatise and out source key defence activities.
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 320
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From: Strasbourg and hotter places
Let's see now. No tax increases ?; Crime obviously falling like Paris Hilton's knickers; Immigration and Asylum seeking issues a "racist" vendetta; Health, well no problem in clean hospitals; Education (2001), Educashion (2003), Educashun (2005); Economy, we did it, we did it, we did it, (say it enough they believe it themselves).
The highest calibre politicians ever ? Liar Blair, Thug Reid, Weak Cook, Dumb Beckett, Dumber Jowell, Thick Prescott, Bland Straw, Arrogant Clarke, Vain Hain etc etc ............. Anything has to be better but it looks like we have to flog the country to death for another four years (if we have them) before the media will expose the deceit and vandalism at the heart of Government and the voting public see the light. As for defence, look at Hoon and decide - I wouldn't let him out without a note from his Mum.
Neocon rant over
The highest calibre politicians ever ? Liar Blair, Thug Reid, Weak Cook, Dumb Beckett, Dumber Jowell, Thick Prescott, Bland Straw, Arrogant Clarke, Vain Hain etc etc ............. Anything has to be better but it looks like we have to flog the country to death for another four years (if we have them) before the media will expose the deceit and vandalism at the heart of Government and the voting public see the light. As for defence, look at Hoon and decide - I wouldn't let him out without a note from his Mum.
Neocon rant over
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 409
Likes: 49
From: The 24th & a Half Century
Radical idea, let us just have a Defence Force then we can get rid of another 25,000 from the RAF, reduce the Army to 50,000 and equip the RN with fast patrol vessels and corvettes.
So when was the last invasion of the UK main land??
So when was the last invasion of the UK main land??
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 591
Likes: 0
From: UK
You'll never find a political party that is completely in harmony with your views. It is a case of voting for the party that most closely reflects your own outlook.
Forget newspaper scare stories, personality politics, selective statistics and base your voting decision on your personal knowledge, the personal knowledge of those you know and other reliable information.
For example, I keep reading about the 'NHS in crisis', but have yet to meet anyone whose personal experience of the NHS is anything other than positive.
I also read about 'all politicians being in it for their own ends', but find my own MP to be hard working and very helpful. Others I know speak similarly of their own experiences with their own MP.
Crime is supposedly 'out of control', but the National Crime Survey (which asks people about their personal experiences of crime) shows that crime is falling.
Do a bit of homework.
Forget newspaper scare stories, personality politics, selective statistics and base your voting decision on your personal knowledge, the personal knowledge of those you know and other reliable information.
For example, I keep reading about the 'NHS in crisis', but have yet to meet anyone whose personal experience of the NHS is anything other than positive.
I also read about 'all politicians being in it for their own ends', but find my own MP to be hard working and very helpful. Others I know speak similarly of their own experiences with their own MP.
Crime is supposedly 'out of control', but the National Crime Survey (which asks people about their personal experiences of crime) shows that crime is falling.
Do a bit of homework.
Last edited by Scud-U-Like; 17th April 2005 at 18:26.
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 51
Likes: 0
From: Aberdeen
"For example, I keep reading about the 'NHS in crisis', but have yet to meet anyone whose personal experience of the NHS is anything other than positive."
Hello Scud-u-like, how do you do? My name is Ben and I am from Aberdeen, nice to meet you!
There you go, you've now met someone who has had a negative experience of the NHS, currently on a 12-15 month waiting list for a knee op!
Hello Scud-u-like, how do you do? My name is Ben and I am from Aberdeen, nice to meet you!
There you go, you've now met someone who has had a negative experience of the NHS, currently on a 12-15 month waiting list for a knee op!
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,395
Likes: 0
From: earth
Most voters polarise towards one or other of the main political parties with barely a moments consideration of the quality or lack of in their local candidate. Perhaps it should be the other way round - find out all one can about the strengths and weaknesses of the local candidates and pick the one you like as long as his party also has a manifesto you can support. At least this approach gives the independants a chance.
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,519
Likes: 2
From: Longton, Lancs, UK
Scud 'n Flyboy
For what it's worth I recently had a major cancer op with the NHS. My views:
Operated on quickly (guess that's the norm for Big C)
Surgeon and the operating team excellent
Food very good
Nice over-bed tele & phone
Dirty ward - floors cleaned, but don't look close elsewhere
Nursing care varied between really awful and very good
On balance, the Tory NHS line in their manifesto would have my vote; but have to side with friend prOOne over Defence.
Might just stay in the pub --------
For what it's worth I recently had a major cancer op with the NHS. My views:
Operated on quickly (guess that's the norm for Big C)
Surgeon and the operating team excellent
Food very good
Nice over-bed tele & phone
Dirty ward - floors cleaned, but don't look close elsewhere
Nursing care varied between really awful and very good
On balance, the Tory NHS line in their manifesto would have my vote; but have to side with friend prOOne over Defence.
Might just stay in the pub --------
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 2,968
Likes: 104
From: Devon
Maybe this link will be of interest:
Defence and the three major parties
Also this thread on politics and the media etc.
Defence and the three major parties
Also this thread on politics and the media etc.
Suspicion breeds confidence
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 2,406
Likes: 15
From: Gibraltar
Labour increased the defence budget for the third successive year, you won’t find a post Cold War Tory Gov’t ever having done that.
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 3,083
Likes: 253
From: London/Oxford/New York
Navaleye,
“Post Cold war” you numpty!
Now get back on your sun lounger and have a good look at what happened to the defence budget post cold war under the Tories, in fact from before the end of the Cold war!.
It fell year on year in real terms from 1987 until 1996, during which period they brought you such wonders as “Front Line First” and the “Defence Costs Study”.
From 1990 to 1997 the UK defence budget fell 30% in real terms. "The defence vote is safe with the Tories", yeah right!
The current defence budget grew 7% in 2003 and 18% in 2004, compare this to Thatchers 3% increase at the height of the cold war.
Engineer (retard)
RAB was a Tory concept, first mooted seriously in 1993 and formally proposed in a White paper in 1995. The whole of UK Govt moved to RAB in 2001, not just the MOD.
“Post Cold war” you numpty!
Now get back on your sun lounger and have a good look at what happened to the defence budget post cold war under the Tories, in fact from before the end of the Cold war!.
It fell year on year in real terms from 1987 until 1996, during which period they brought you such wonders as “Front Line First” and the “Defence Costs Study”.
From 1990 to 1997 the UK defence budget fell 30% in real terms. "The defence vote is safe with the Tories", yeah right!
The current defence budget grew 7% in 2003 and 18% in 2004, compare this to Thatchers 3% increase at the height of the cold war.
Engineer (retard)
RAB was a Tory concept, first mooted seriously in 1993 and formally proposed in a White paper in 1995. The whole of UK Govt moved to RAB in 2001, not just the MOD.
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 675
Likes: 0
From: Racedo blows goats
pr00ne
I do not care if the martians brought RAB in, but quoting % increase figures means little if you are comparing 2 different systems of accounting.
If I was allowed to put the value of my house and car on my bank account, the bottom line of my monthly statement would rise enourmously in real terms.
But if I tried to buy anything of value with this massive increase in spending, the fraud squad would invite me in for some cheap B&B.
Regards
Retard
I do not care if the martians brought RAB in, but quoting % increase figures means little if you are comparing 2 different systems of accounting.
If I was allowed to put the value of my house and car on my bank account, the bottom line of my monthly statement would rise enourmously in real terms.
But if I tried to buy anything of value with this massive increase in spending, the fraud squad would invite me in for some cheap B&B.
Regards
Retard