Nimrod MRA4
Join Date: Dec 2004
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Quote from Caledonian - "am l missing something, first flight, l thought these were old frames refitted not totally new???"
This is a popular misconception. There is very little left of the doner aircraft by the time they become an MRA4. In fact it is about 95% new build. Inside it is very 21st century with a totally different operating concept.
Personally I think the MRA4 looks the business. The MK2 always looked menacing when compared to the P3 and the new aeroplane looks even more so. Some of the lumps and bumps you see in the photos are for flight test and won't appear on the production aircraft.
This is a popular misconception. There is very little left of the doner aircraft by the time they become an MRA4. In fact it is about 95% new build. Inside it is very 21st century with a totally different operating concept.
Personally I think the MRA4 looks the business. The MK2 always looked menacing when compared to the P3 and the new aeroplane looks even more so. Some of the lumps and bumps you see in the photos are for flight test and won't appear on the production aircraft.
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Australia
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Mr Eff,
Are you planning on opening a kebab shop using one of the leftover aircraft ??? It would look good at the main gate of ISK, and I am sure that it would be a good profitable business.
Merry Christmas one and all.
YG
the doner aircraft
Merry Christmas one and all.
YG
Join Date: Dec 2004
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> Very good - the stupid secure protection ensures that the images won't load properly....
This is a user setting problem affecting those with the latest Microsoft SP upgrades.
Open the above link again and read the text on accessing the larger photos.
MS cocks it up again
IanC - mum's the word
rivetjoint - hear what you say and totally agree, but read the bottom section of the above mentioned 'notes' page for the reason.
Merry Christmas everyone.
This is a user setting problem affecting those with the latest Microsoft SP upgrades.
Open the above link again and read the text on accessing the larger photos.
MS cocks it up again
IanC - mum's the word
rivetjoint - hear what you say and totally agree, but read the bottom section of the above mentioned 'notes' page for the reason.
Merry Christmas everyone.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Aberdeen or Santa Barbara
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Although i can't download them - a couple of questions:
are those vertical strakes just inboard of the Loral pods?
Surprised to see the Arar/Arax antenna housing on the fin...still filled with concrete?
thanks
rich
are those vertical strakes just inboard of the Loral pods?
Surprised to see the Arar/Arax antenna housing on the fin...still filled with concrete?
thanks
rich
Well, I still can't open the larger photos thanks to the daft encryption used. The 'having difficulties' link just goes to some site which appears to be a bitch fight between "I hate Bill Gatres" nerds and others...
Chaps, if the vast majority (apart from geeks) use Windows - and probably WinXPSP2 - doesn't it make sense to make your pictures compatible if you want them to be seen?
Chaps, if the vast majority (apart from geeks) use Windows - and probably WinXPSP2 - doesn't it make sense to make your pictures compatible if you want them to be seen?
Join Date: Apr 2002
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Caledonian
No - to keep the fuselage helped with certification. The existing tubes are only about 1600 hours old and have CAA authority which carry about 32 certificates. A brand new ac requires 50+ and takes longer to get into service. Certification for wings, engines, and ancilliaries require much less; so, NDT the tubes, strap on the bits, pass the test and get flying. Also keeps the costs down. This is what was done and is proven.
The Arax/Arar canoe was never filled with concrete - it was, and still is, retained for aerodynamic purposes. It was intended to house an earlier SatNav, but that's now fitted to the upper rear fuselage because present day aerials are not as clumsy and don't need fairings.
On an engineering point - it's very expensive to modify an ac due to equipement rendundancy, particularly when it affects the external airframe - best heave out the old kit and use the existing space for future developments.
Love many, Trust a few, no cement in my canoe
No - to keep the fuselage helped with certification. The existing tubes are only about 1600 hours old and have CAA authority which carry about 32 certificates. A brand new ac requires 50+ and takes longer to get into service. Certification for wings, engines, and ancilliaries require much less; so, NDT the tubes, strap on the bits, pass the test and get flying. Also keeps the costs down. This is what was done and is proven.
The Arax/Arar canoe was never filled with concrete - it was, and still is, retained for aerodynamic purposes. It was intended to house an earlier SatNav, but that's now fitted to the upper rear fuselage because present day aerials are not as clumsy and don't need fairings.
On an engineering point - it's very expensive to modify an ac due to equipement rendundancy, particularly when it affects the external airframe - best heave out the old kit and use the existing space for future developments.
Love many, Trust a few, no cement in my canoe
Join Date: Sep 2000
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Mr Eff
Quote
"There is very little left of the doner aircraft by the time they become an MRA4. In fact it is about 95% new build ".
That is except the complete Pressure shell (which must surely add up to more than 5%) I have the pictures, and flying controls (more than a couple of a percent), PA01 (ZJ516) had about 14,000 hrs on it in its previous life as XV247 I reckon thats an awful lot of Pressurisations which must surely still have an impact on the remaining metal.
Thinks !!!! I wonder if they have fixed "47,s lousy plain flaps, we never did get them fixed properly when she was at ISK, infact looking at the pictures its not got them anymore.
PA01 had a previous life.................it will time.... count !
BT
Quote
"There is very little left of the doner aircraft by the time they become an MRA4. In fact it is about 95% new build ".
That is except the complete Pressure shell (which must surely add up to more than 5%) I have the pictures, and flying controls (more than a couple of a percent), PA01 (ZJ516) had about 14,000 hrs on it in its previous life as XV247 I reckon thats an awful lot of Pressurisations which must surely still have an impact on the remaining metal.
Thinks !!!! I wonder if they have fixed "47,s lousy plain flaps, we never did get them fixed properly when she was at ISK, infact looking at the pictures its not got them anymore.
PA01 had a previous life.................it will time.... count !
BT
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Just down the road from ISK
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Richlear
Long time no see - ex of 201 days in the late 80's!!
Can't be arsed reading the thread to see if anyone else has said this - MRA4 vs P3/P7 etc - right choice? given the development timescale either way - 50/50. Course the P7 would have been the safer option as the C130-J avionics are proven right?............er.........er..............oh no they're not. Even now after 10 years from first flight the J is only just coming up t scratch. Don't knock the MRA4. A lot has been achieved in a very short time. Of course there will be problems but the other option was no less risky.
Long time no see - ex of 201 days in the late 80's!!
Can't be arsed reading the thread to see if anyone else has said this - MRA4 vs P3/P7 etc - right choice? given the development timescale either way - 50/50. Course the P7 would have been the safer option as the C130-J avionics are proven right?............er.........er..............oh no they're not. Even now after 10 years from first flight the J is only just coming up t scratch. Don't knock the MRA4. A lot has been achieved in a very short time. Of course there will be problems but the other option was no less risky.
Join Date: May 2003
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Beagle; Your are correct sir - in fact two thirds of the Nimrod AEW3 s flew into Abingdon which then sat there for ages, slwly being robbed of spares before most being given the cutters torch!
One i believe re-flew out to Kinloss just before the 89 Airday....
One i believe re-flew out to Kinloss just before the 89 Airday....
Join Date: Sep 2000
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Beagle.........was nearly right
The AEW3 leet were all broken up at Abingdon except XV263 which went to Finningley for baby Flight Engineers to play with, apparently they were even allowed to drive it around occasionally, I certainly know that it was ground run quite alot.
Also XZ282 had the distinction of carrying out the last ever AEW3 flight when it was delivered to Kinloss in 1989,
This aircraft was used as a ground trials aircraft for the remainder of its existance, a none ground runner she was towed all over the place, and eventually ended up outside the MU and was slowly reduced to produce.
When Kinloss finally got bored with her in the mid 90,s Williamson's the local scrappy bought the hulk for a couple of grand and commenced the job, that was until they got to the wings.
They still had fuel in.............
Imagine the site, local scrappy with very big husqvarnar.... chop chop.. spark spark.. whats that funny smell.............err .........fuel.
Sh&t....and off they ran and came back when they got brave. '82 ended her days in Elgin.
£2.000 for £75 Million pound aircraft... (Project binned when it hit £750 Million) good deal that, the scrappy probably got at least £2000 for each of its jet pipes
I did a bit of research on the AEW fleet for an article some years later, I found that of the fleet of 10 built at least 2 had less than 100 Flying Hours, with the lowest about 85
What a waste...............a classic goal posts job
The only bits of AEW3 remaining I know of are as follows
Carlisle Airport Cockpit of XV259
Warton Nose of XV263
RAF Stafford Fuselage of XZ287
BT
BT
The AEW3 leet were all broken up at Abingdon except XV263 which went to Finningley for baby Flight Engineers to play with, apparently they were even allowed to drive it around occasionally, I certainly know that it was ground run quite alot.
Also XZ282 had the distinction of carrying out the last ever AEW3 flight when it was delivered to Kinloss in 1989,
This aircraft was used as a ground trials aircraft for the remainder of its existance, a none ground runner she was towed all over the place, and eventually ended up outside the MU and was slowly reduced to produce.
When Kinloss finally got bored with her in the mid 90,s Williamson's the local scrappy bought the hulk for a couple of grand and commenced the job, that was until they got to the wings.
They still had fuel in.............
Imagine the site, local scrappy with very big husqvarnar.... chop chop.. spark spark.. whats that funny smell.............err .........fuel.
Sh&t....and off they ran and came back when they got brave. '82 ended her days in Elgin.
£2.000 for £75 Million pound aircraft... (Project binned when it hit £750 Million) good deal that, the scrappy probably got at least £2000 for each of its jet pipes
I did a bit of research on the AEW fleet for an article some years later, I found that of the fleet of 10 built at least 2 had less than 100 Flying Hours, with the lowest about 85
What a waste...............a classic goal posts job
The only bits of AEW3 remaining I know of are as follows
Carlisle Airport Cockpit of XV259
Warton Nose of XV263
RAF Stafford Fuselage of XZ287
BT
BT