I'm really concerned.

To try to solve the pilot shortage, Emirates is attempting to recruit desperate guys from Venezuela who have a CPL only, poor English, zero experience of LVO/Winter Ops, some with no experience working at an airline, or flying a jet.

Emirates is willing to put them straight into an A380 - operating a 3 man 17hr FDP before disruption, to East Coast US during January Snowstorms, or over the Himalayas through the night to China. And they'll be watched over by a 30 year old ex-cadet Captain who may not have seen more than 1/2 de-icing in his life and has never flown a plane above 500ft.

Sensible decisions replaced by EPT searches. We already have to suffer some of these types - but the majority will be like this is the near future. I already have a list of laughable stories to tell; i'm tired of being 'diplomatic' in the flight deck.

With this workload, complacency has risen dramatically - not a good lesson for future captains. To survive these rosters, we need to be confident in each other's ability, not questioning it.

The total disregard for experience is alarming. They don't value pilots with 10k hours worldwide airline ops, anymore than a teenage crop duster from South America.

They don't even value their current employees anymore than this. You are just a staff number, and the person attached to it is irrelevant. They literally don't care, they'll find someone to keep the seat warm.

We've already come close to catastrophe several times in the last year, and they refuse to see the root cause of these rising incidents. Someone is going to plant an A380 with 600 pax - and it will all get blamed on the pilots expected to work and react flawlessly under these conditions, with no experience to fall back on.

I find it interesting to see that former captains are sent out the door on their upgrade for microscopic small mistakes and the preference is given to young unexpierenced newbies in the left seat
in fact that this company is not willing to train their stuff. Instead they just kicked out a batch of FOs and now they have set the age done again to get another one - just say the age limit should never been in place in the first place - but if a 30 year old was asking it was impossible and now everything is good again
beside that recently most upgrades paid for the incidents (almost accidents in the near past)
it looks like the company is asking for trouble

They are so used to being above the law that they are not giving any thought to the laws of physics or physiology.

EK521 and FZ981 weren't painful enough. In fact they are already making decent profits again. Unfortunately it will take bigger lessons to start their learning process.

As Brian wrote, Risk Management was involved in making the 3 crew long haul decisions. In their analysis there must have been a negligible uptick in the probability for an "event". What these numbers don't tell is the overall situation and how this may become the straw that broke the camel's back. That insight would require human intelligence by a qualified subject matter expert. But listening to their own pilots is out of the question. The organisation is deliberately set up for information to only flow from the top down. Their culture doesn't allow for the key recipe for success of information flow from bottom up.

Are these gonna be 2 cpt and 1 fo ?

Yes, most probably 3 Captains and 1 First Officer, which.......,
given a recent event where there was a “ difference” of opinion on the taxi out, over the “ door arming procedure”, leading to a “possible” breakdown in CRM............., well, ah.........

Nah, it’s ok. Keep on truckin’, we can do it! We’re EK!

It's simple , don't do it. Book off down route! Grow a pair!
typical EK all talk no action!

So, have you done it?

Perhaps that’s the wrong attitude to have, or promote for that matter. It appears that the majority of frequent posters seem to think that the answer to a lot of the issues is to simply call in sick. That won’t solve any issue, in fact all you are doing is now intentionally screwing over one of your colleagues...

Perhaps growing a pair requires actually doing your job.......

Doing our job includes not turning up to work when we’re not fit to fly. Are you suggesting the pilot body operate a flight when they shouldn’t? I would call that irresponsible.

How would calling in sick on a layover screw over a colleague? There simply isn’t enough rested sets of crew on layover to substitute a sick colleague.

You either don’t understand long range flying issues or you’re a management troll. Either way, you don’t seem to grasp the safety issue here. We have been down this 3 pilot route before (although this time around, the proposed pairings are even more demanding), and the majority of posters here are saying when it’s not safe to operate, we have to make the call not to place the flight in unnecessary and unacceptable risk.

I’m not promoting anything that is deemed unsafe, nor the new 3 man crew LRV. What I’m trying to say is that perhaps calling in sick, will not solve the issue. Unfortunately I don’t have any other suggestions, other than what has been posted before regarding filing reports with the relevant authorities......

In my opinion, calling colleagues cowards for not calling in sick is not appropriate.

Point taken.......

Guys the OMA is written in such a way that it helps operator not the pilot , pointless to keep winging about it and discussing the nitty gritty of what it says in the manual. not going to get you anywhere :ugh:.

As your boss told you ...this is how much they pay you in the future, this is how they will operate so get over it stop being cry babies..period!!

For expats there are so many opportunities out there you had a good inning now move on. For locals I don’t know they could go down south or maybe not south ok go north then to LC or the other side of the runway 30R. Nothing is forever , stop living in denial, the sooner the reality sets in and you accept the new world order of airline operations ...the sooner you can move forward. You’ve been playing with there shiny jets long enough now Give them back...playtime is over...take the bitter pill and leave.

Remember the old days when other poster on here told you not to come in the first place to the sand pit....hello you did not listen then so..let’s try again a second time you should not have come.....ok? So now go and make a strong coffee and sit on your desk and polish the cv..believe me when you have done that you will feel soooo...much better. Believe me I tried it it’s great feeling Cofffee and CV writing I mean.

Well well well - there you go the position is out:

FLIGHT OPERATIONS RISK MANAGER - 180000T3

Let’s talk about the salary after tax?

Let’s talk about long term health as the motivation to leave. All the tax free dollars in the world can’t buy back ill health, which is a possible and potential outcome of the rosters that are being flown.

Let’s talk about the cost to your family of you dying young, or ahead of your “time” anyway.
Not one medical professional has a good word to say about these rosters.

Turtle just got in front of me. What EK pilots are, are a part of a large experiment, the likes of which has never been attempted before in aviation.

No other group of pilots have ever flown the hours and/or the rosters under the conditions that EK pilots have been suffering for several years now.

And every time you think they can’t make it worse, they do.

Nobody has an idea what it is doing to your health.

Nio amount of $$$ can make up for that.

Stay safe out there.

Same as everywhere else, you think anybody who’s 65 now ever tried LCC 4 sectors 12 hours days with almost minimum rest, for 4/5 days in a row before?
That’s what April to November looks like in most companies in Europe.

GMW... was just about to say the same thing.

Ok so let me ask you, why isn’t every single European EK pilot applying for a DEC slot at one of the many LCCs which are all hiring right now?