Emirates specific questions....
 

Im a Regional FO here in the United States, looking to possibly move on to Emirates. I have a lot of questions, and have read many threads on this forum and others. For time expediency as most threads drift and it takes hours to glean specific information you are looking for, I have a few questions for anyone in the know. Thanks in advance. (and yes I am aware of the search function,)

What could you realistically expect to save per month? From Emirates web page starting pay is aprox 8000 us per month. I would have a goal of saving 5k (US) per month, with my expenses from home at 1k, and a 2k (US) budget living in Dubai. We have two children ages 3, and 6 months. As I understand the education allowance does not cover American schools and you will spend a bit more for education than the allowance. If I was to pay for American style school what could I expect to pay? What percent of utilities do they cover? How are you taxed on your housing allowance etc., if at all? Would you recommend taking the housing allowance or live in the provided villas? Is the 3 year training bond pro-rated?

You will not save anything for a couple of years , longer depending on how many kids you have in the ASD/DAA.

Live with wife and two children in Dubai on 2000 US a month? Then don't worry about the school fees. Your wife will have left Dubai long before they reach that age.

Plan on saving 2000 and have a decent life instead.

Hmmm, this will certainly bring out some of the loonies......

That strikes me as, shall we say, a bit pessimistic. However, your stated goal of saving over 60% of your pay is pretty optimistic. You, your wife and kids will have to live like hermits. American schools are out of the question. Likewise eating out, most after school activities etc. You would probably need to take the allowance and rent a small apartment in a less desirable area. Doesn't sound like a great life to me.

3 year bond is pro-rata.

Thanks for the responses..
What exactly will the housing allowance provide in a decent area? A 2,000 sqft 3 bdrm, villia or a 1500 sqft 2 bdrm apt? I read that the provided housing is a crapshoot as to what you will get.
I did some searches online and it looked like you could get a decent villa for the monthly allotment, although I have no Idea if the areas are considered safe.
I read that Emirates holds your passport onsite, is this true?
What is a realistic amount to save 2-3k or is that still a pretty shi%&y lifestyle?

We save 3K a month and have a decent lifestyle. I don't wear a Rolex and don't drive a BMW but I did put 51K USD in my retirement last year...as an FO (3K per month + 15K profit share = 51K in 2011 into my provident fund).

US expat, 3 kids, wife and kids are very happy with life out here. We still go out and enjoy a quality of life better than we ever had at xxx holdings. I'm an ex rj capt... not going back to the US any time soon... pm me if you want to know more.

FP

Villa assignment is definitely a crap-shoot. You could get something nice with the allowance. Might be a good idea to take what you're given for six months and then move to something else. That will also give you an idea about what area you want to live in as well as where your preferred school is.

Passport rumour is rubbish.

Make 2k a month your goal and adjust once you get an idea of what things cost and how you want to spend your $$$. IMHO that is achievable without living like a hermit. Good luck

family budget
 

Some say cant save a cent, some saving 3k a month????

Based on minimum pay which I budget at 8000usd a month and given the following assumptions, just where does the money go/not go???

Villa- company supplied ie. nil expense
Utilities- is this 27000aed a cash payment or rebate from actual billings ?
Medical- pilot paid for but family requires supplement. How much is that and what if any actual medical cost occur?

Furniture Amortising- if you move out of supplied accomm., and into your own choice, is this forgiven?

Education- I'm not american so the english schools seem pretty much covered by the allowance with maybe a few thousand a year for extras????

So house,health,utilities and school are pretty much covered. Where does 8000 go?

Yes

The Company pays utilities. Stay below the cap and you never see a bill. AFAIK noone has actually been billed for Utilities, but I stand to be correccted. We are by no means frugal users and have never been billed.

No much. My BL008Y computer won't load my payslip, but I think I pay around 350DHs a month for wife and two kids. That covers all non-preexisting Medical treatments (a few exceptions- the Orthodontic allowence won't be enough for kids braces for example) though you do pay for non-prescription medications.

No, but you get to take the stylish, high quality furniture (sigh, that was SARCASM before anyone asks!!) with you.

I was out 11 000 for the year with two kids. Actually helps me that the travel allowence is now lumped in (we car-pool) but the British Schools are certainly more reasonable.

Good question- but go it does!!

Everything in Dubai is designed to suck money out of you.

Grocery is the biggest part of your expenses. Things are not cheap in Dubai and it is getting worse with inflation.

DEWA (electricity and water if you move out of co. accommodation) - there is a hidden tax on top of utilities in there somewhere - I can't remember what it is called as I am in co. accommodation.

Etisalat - Telecommunications & Internet is the most expensive I have ever seen in the world for what you get in return.

just a few of the obvious ones.

medical insurance
 

Consider acquiring some supplemental medical insurance for your family, I think. Emirates has a long-established tradition of taking very good care of pilots with lengthy illnesses but I don't know if that has a counterpart with family members.

Your family's coverage is limited to a certain maximum cash amount of treatment every financial year. I am too lazy to look it up but I think you could easily run through the mentioned amount in about six weeks if they were unlucky enough to be hospitalized whilst visiting the USA.

You can buy 2.5 million dollars a year coverage online via BUPA for a token amount and you will have peace of mind for any lengthy health battle which (God forbid) your near and dear may experience. If memory serves it was about $300 for the kids and about $1800 for the wife per annum.

Varmint,

Cheers!:ok:

Vacations.....
After a while you will get sick of a holiday in Sharjah, nice as it's reputed to be.
So that means plane tickets, even stby start to add up, hotels etc. It's not like a weekend in Kansas, as nice as that is also reputed to be.
Your annual holiday will be an international trip, even if just going home, it costs.

How does personal travel work on EK? Can you list standby, or is it all ID90 type stuff? As far as vacation goes, I understand you get 43 vacation days per year, how hard is it to get the time off that you want, and what blocks of time do they usually grant? How much is paid if any?

From a cursory look so far, to move my family across the world they may need to up this package a bit.

It may not be popular to say, but Regional FOs from America don't have the best reputation here. That's probably unfair in a lot of cases but it is the reality. Therefore:

The chances of this happening in the near to medium term are something approaching and very, very near to zero.

Good luck.

Assuming there is still room at Cedre Villas, is the family accomodation the ones on the DSO website as the 'executive' or the twinvillas that share a common wall. I know someone who recently started and chose Semmer and got one that was recently vacated. Would you choose semmer over cedre or vice versa?

I am thinking of having the villa unfurnished. Anyone done that then moved to own accom later and at least chose their own furniture etc. Does the allowance cover filling the villa for family of four?

Have a look, make up your own conclusions. It does really depend where your coming from!

Cost of Living Comparison Between Dubai, United Arab Emirates And London, United Kingdom

Kempis, a quick scan through your list shows booze and the Internet are more expensive in Dubai.

I propose that most of the 8k goes on cans of lager and porn?

It's why none of us BUY our booze in Dubai.

A nice little run down to Um Al Qwain and prices are evelent to Duty free- I buy Aussie beer there substantially cheaper than it is available for in Australia.

Lord spandex,

Better make that a round 10k!!

Do you guys think it's reasonable for a single FO, not a big spender (won't go and blow 40k on a new car etc), likes a few beers on off nights a few times a month and eating out a few times a month, apart from that no major expenses, be able to save around 60% of salary year one?

Considering people in this country survive on salaries around 2500 dhs I´m pretty sure you can save around 90% of your salary. That said Dubai becomes a pretty boring place if you won´t spend your money but if you want to save just buy your groceries where the Indians do and take noodles to your layovers to save your allowance;)

McNulty,

Quite easily, especially if you take the live out allowance. I have a 1 bedroom flat in a mid level neighbourhood which is quite nice and I make a profit of around $25 000 pa on the housing allowance alone.

Of course it is a remarkably small step from being a tight fist to being a big spender in this place. If you are earning a fat salary it is not unreasonable to spend $40k on a new 4x4 when you start justifying it to yourself(resale value, need transport anyway, safety on the roads, money just lying in the bank not earning interest, interest free company car loan, the Jones's, etc, etc).

I know single FO's who save £3.5k and FO's with families who save £1.5k a month. Then I know other FO's who want to enjoy life and buy and do the things they normally wouldnt be able to afford and save next to nothing.

You can either go and enjoy the fact your stuck in the desert or countdown the days until you leave with a lump of cash.

Or a bit of both.

What about medical in EMIRATES, it's hard, It's complicates to pass it, Vision, listening, bloody test......:ok:

Huh? :confused:

Maybe if you study a bit harder it will take the complications away.

halas

Got to love this one. EK pilots have been crying their eyes out over the DEWA cap, and it turns out it doesn't mean anything.

Actually Mad, I made that post and I HAVE been corrected.

It's looking like I will be out a couple of thousand, and this is a breach of my contract.

Not much I can do except sue and lose or leave.

Just going to have to suck it up, but it doesn't go down well.

You just went from paying nothing to having to pay a couple of thousand????? Per month, quarter or year?

I thought you have spent a few years in the sand pit?

For the year.

We didn't realize the gardener was putting the water on four times a day.

It's not going to be a fortune, but it is still annoying.

regional FO's frowned upon??
 

Hello-
Someone said that regional fo's are frowned upon. Does anyone know any pilots that came from an american regional?
Thanks!
(Wife of flyer27)

It's not the A/C size as much as attitude, a lot of the RJ pilots were RJ Capt's and think they know everything. Those that are 320/73 NG were FO's(mostly) and don't come with the attitude.

Oh yeah...because EK is the depositary of knowledege...right?
You know everything there in the desert You are all scientist and rocket engineer. UAE has invented aviation and aussies have perfected it?
Mhh...looks to me UAE never invented anything and aussie became so anal in time as they are just trying to compensated for their origins...

Jetaim,
you are more than likely the type I was referring to and I said nothing about knowledge it was all about attitude.
PS, the stats speak for themselves

Thanks fatbus!
Do u know if they are interviewing people w/o an ATPL but heave he ATP written? I really appriciate all the feedback!

S&M,

I dont know if you received an answer regarding how much you can save but i used to be in the same boat as you. To be honest, it depends on how well you manage your money. Some people save and others live paycheck to paycheck. As a background, i used to be a regional pilot and own two homes in the states that are completely paid off and make residual income on my rentals. We travel alot (atleast once every two months) and live within our means. Nothing fancy except for our car but wanted a safe car to protect my loved ones. We eat out twice a week and maximize the discounts using the EPC and Platinum cards which gives discounts up to 20% on food. Not really a drinker so i guess i save money there but sometimes i wish i drank to drive away the frustrations of some local affairs:)

I put away $1500 a months for my retirement fund and send $1500 a month to my US savings account. There is also a Provident Fund set up by the company which is approximately $1000 per month (4% by you and 14% (??) by the company. You do not get your full entitlement to the fund till 7 years in the company.

Basically, $2500 goes to my retirement and $1500 to my savings per month. The rest is spent by my wife and child:) This place is not perfect but we are very happy we made the move.

Remember, its not how much you make but how well you manage your money.

snookie

Therefore presuming kids education looked after, and housing looked after. What could a guy joining up as captain on 777 expect to take home in usd. Say for 75 hours a month and average layover allowance. Just for comparison purposes.
Presuming that housing and education is 'completely' taken of. And what is this profit share. Include that too.
Am currently taking home about 18k Usd( 75 hrs ) with kids education and decent house looked after.
Cheers

11,237USD basic 1st Year Captain.
+
1,226USD for 75 hours.

Deduct 5% of basic as your contribution to your Provident Fund.
Deduct a few other bits and pieces like medical insurance and phone charges and you won't quite take home 12,000USD . Schooling may not be completely covered by the company and that could bring you closer to 11,000USD.

The good news is that you might be doing a lot more than 75 hours, unless you have some leave or Training/Check events. Although the company will try to but not always succeed in keeping you at or just slightly under 92 hours as this is where the overtime threshold cuts in.

Layover allowances are in the range 50-90USD/24 hours.

I doubt there will be a profit share this year although I would like to be wrong. It once hit 14 weeks but that was back in the good times.

Excellent info whossorrynow! Very informative indeed.
So take home SALARY in the range of say 11.5 k Usd PM.
And what would be the average, just average layover allowances for the same flight hours PM. Just a reasonable ball park. So that i can do the math. And what was the profit share you got this year and last.
Sorry or the barrage of Q's, but its a big move.
Thanks again. Great info earlier ..