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Why go there?

Middle East Many expats still flying in Knoteetingham. Regional issues can be discussed here.

Why go there?

Old 26th Dec 2019, 18:35
  #1 (permalink)  
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Join Date: May 2019
Location: Never home
Posts: 17
Why go there?

Just wondering about this subject tbh.

This forum is full of information regarding all the ME airlines. Some reviews may be a little bit too negative from people that have been too long in these companies, but even the most neutral and honest opinions are mostly negative. Even the most nuanced of opinions on this forum show clear negatives. Still, many people in Europa want to go there. In my previous company (decent European non-lowcost company, but no real longhaul/captaincy promises) many young guys still wanted to go there, even after they read through all the threads on this forum...

Why do people still go there if it is really that bad, and why do people from the large West-European countries not come back now that KLM/AF/British need people?
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Old 27th Dec 2019, 07:23
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Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Dubai
Age: 52
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People come here for the quick long haul commands and nice big shiny jets. There are some issues but at the end of the day, it's a job. You do the work and they pay you. Everything else boils down to individual perspective.......make of that what you wish.

Why do people still go there if it is really that bad, and why do people from the large West-European countries not come back now that KLM/AF/British need people?
When you are a long haul wide body captain netting $20k per month, you don't simply take a job as an f/o pulling in $5000 per month.
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Old 27th Dec 2019, 11:16
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Join Date: Mar 2007
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Originally Posted by Kennytheking View Post
When you are a long haul wide body captain netting $20k per month, you don't simply take a job as an f/o pulling in $5000 per month.
A very real perspective, but I wish it was $20k a month. Enough though to make the move back hard.
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Old 28th Dec 2019, 00:56
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Join Date: Apr 2011
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[QUOTEWhen you are a long haul wide body captain netting $20k per month, you don't simply take a job as an f/o pulling in $5000 per month.[/QUOTE]

Which airline is this and are you including the living accommodation payment in the figure as well ?
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Old 28th Dec 2019, 01:31
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Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Dubai
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It's EK and, yes the accommodation allowance of $4380 is included.
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Old 28th Dec 2019, 06:02
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Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: europe
Age: 31
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Smart people learn from their own mistakes, but even smarter people learn from the mistake of others.
I more or less knew what I was getting into when I left for the middle east but I just wanted to see it for myself and take some tax free money. I ended up staying almost four years before I quit. Initially it felt better than I expected but the pay and conditions progressively worsened in terms of bonus, overtime, roster etc and generally I would never feel at home in the country. It was hard work in an inhumane and culturally different environment with terrifying rosters, at least in my experience. You know, there always seem to be a few people that can make it work in some situations, for a defined period of time, for whatever reasons they come up with.
I'm back in Europe for less money but I see my kids growing up in a country where I am a citizen again and not a disposable foreign worker. A country that has given me education, healthcare and everything else that is important to me and where I want to be now and not after I have maybe saved enough cash to retire later. I'm no longer a mercenary in this middle east foreign legion but I came back as a better person. For this im thankful.
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Old 28th Dec 2019, 22:54
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Join Date: Jul 2013
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They come for the money and they leave for their health!
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Old 29th Dec 2019, 20:32
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Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Dubai
Age: 43
Posts: 122
Originally Posted by Yorkshire_Pudding View Post
They come for the money and they leave for their health!
Bravo... this is so far the most accurate answer. A little over 5 years working there was enough for me to save enough to retire and never have to fly again plus just enough to damage my health (maybe for good), it's been one year since I shut down the engines for the last time and I absolutely see now how hazardous those 5 years were to my physical and mental health. But at the end a totally worthy experience... went there, grabbed the money and left. Mission accomplished!
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Old 29th Dec 2019, 20:45
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Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: sierra village
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Left the Middle East in 2011 after 20 years. We still look back at it as the best years of our lives. Yes, the money was good but you had to work hard at keeping socially active to get the most out of life to enjoy your time there.

I guess either things have changed for the worse now or only the disgruntled minority are active posters. I suspect it’s the latter
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Old 29th Dec 2019, 23:06
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Join Date: Mar 2007
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Originally Posted by lucille View Post

I guess either things have changed for the worse now or only the disgruntled minority are active posters. I suspect itís the latter
Unfortunately the former
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Old 30th Dec 2019, 00:24
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Join Date: Jun 2002
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Good post by level change.. but I think there is alot more as to why pilots come to the middle east aka the sand pit.
Some are desperate to get out of their home country.
Some are desperate for a job
Some are like LC
But whoever they are to get here they will have done some homework and come with eyes wide open. Sure the big shiny long haul jet pilot status puts a layer of icing on a rather crappy $ infused cake.
The trick, I'm convinced, is taking the plunge to get out. LC did 4 years, which really is the blink of an eye. I got more than a few friends who are cracking their Silver anniversary of time in ME! Its what you make of it and how easy it hard it is to cut the golden handcuffs.
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Old 30th Dec 2019, 09:23
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Join Date: Mar 2006
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Cohesion (or lack there of)

Pilots are their own worst enemies! Everyone of us is on a different agenda and Airlines (not just Emirates) play to this. If we were all working on the GM production line we might all pull together, but we don't. Some like an expat lifestyle, some avoiding commitments at home, some filling the pot before retirement or just shiny jet syndrome. Airlines know this and know they can keep pushing back because Pilots will not unite for the greater good. If it were the case, LCC would have been a long distant memory. Pilots won't come together for a cause, collectively we could make a huge stand! Imagine a shutdown of aviation for a day? However it is just not feasible.
Airlines know this and will always have the upper hand. Remember also many Airline CEO's rose up from check-in assistant, hate Pilots or are possibly failed Pilots. Either way, make a judgement on what you want out of it because that is precisely what everyone else has done and will continue to do.
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Old 30th Dec 2019, 10:22
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Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: UK
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A lot of people come here because their previous companies or countries failed.
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