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Maintaining EASA Licence whilst in the Middle East

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Maintaining EASA Licence whilst in the Middle East

Old 29th Nov 2018, 07:47
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: england
Age: 39
Posts: 9
Question Maintaining EASA Licence whilst in the Middle East

Dear Colleagues,

Can anyone please give me a hint on the best way to keep an EASA ATPL and IR current whilst working in the Middle East on a non European Middle East Licence.

I understand that after 7 years of not having a valid EASA TR or valid IR you loose the IR ground school exams and must resit them.

It would appear the UK CAA don’t recognise Ratings and IR’s on foreign licences nor do they allow Ratings with a ristriction of ‘Middle East Reg Only’ for instance.

I assume one option is to privately hire a Sim in Europe for a skills test on your current type. If you can find an operator who does stand alone sims and not selling you a full recurrent £££.

Or...Do the Irish CAA give any approvals for foreign Ratings to be brought back to EASA and is it easy to change from UK to Irish and in time maybe back again.

I mainly want to keep my UK licence from expiring for when I return to the UK. If I can also get a Type Rating on there that’s even better.

Any advice would be amazing thank you.

I did look for similar topics but couldn’t see any.

Happy Landings 👍
flymetothe moon is offline  
Old 29th Nov 2018, 18:38
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Cool

You didn't say what type your're on, but Cockpit4U (division of LH flight training) in Berlin does recurrents for some ME pilots for precisely this reason - I did my own B777 renewal there, with another ME pilot who goes every year to keep his EASA license valid. Don't have to do a full type rating at all, just a 2 hour sim check. Can also do a LST to put just the rating on, if you want. Better do that soon though, while the UK is still EASA. And yes, your rating will then transfer over to an IAA license but you better get on that soon!

Not cheap, but the Germans are absolutely top-notch at taking care of all the regulatory paperwork nonsense. Worth every penny IMO.

And Berlin is a fun weekend, as well!
nolimitholdem is offline  
Old 29th Nov 2018, 20:16
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You must initiate State of Licence Issue transfer from UK to other EASA Authority before 29 March 19, if it is a hard BREXIT without any derogation or extended transition period. See UK CAA website. IMHO still unlikely but definitely possible. It is arse covering just in case. If you want to have a new licence issued before 29 March UK advice is to initiate this year.
Arthur1815 is offline  
Old 30th Nov 2018, 06:36
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Call GAA in Bahrain and see what options they give you. I know of a pilot who keeps his 320 rating current from there.
Airmann is offline  
Old 30th Nov 2018, 13:51
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Further to what Arthur1815 has written about SOLI transfer. The UK CAA have just issued this advice as well,The CAA advises individuals who are considering transferring their licence to another Member State to contact the National Aviation Authority (NAA) of the Member State that they are transferring to, to discuss the transfer process and timescales. To enable the CAA to process the expected numbers of applications received by Member States in time for the March 29th deadline date, applications from Member States NAAs need to be received in the CAA by 1st January 2019.
kwaiyai is offline  
Old 30th Nov 2018, 17:46
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Join Date: Dec 2006
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Go Irish.

Here is what I did.
1. I transfered my UK EASA ATPL License to Irish EASA ATPL License.
2. I got my Irish license with my current type in Middle East restricted to local registration only plus Instrumental Rating. A380/IR (No sim required. As is your current type. But restricted , cannot be used in Europe. Its only to keep your license valid.)
3. After every LPC done in Middle East I send all records to IAA and they automatically renew my EASA IR + Restricted Type Rating and send the new license free of charge to my home country in Europe.

simple, smooth, cheap and works.

my two cents.

rgds.
340-co is offline  
Old 1st Dec 2018, 05:15
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Originally Posted by 340-co View Post
Here is what I did.
1. I transfered my UK EASA ATPL License to Irish EASA ATPL License.
2. I got my Irish license with my current type in Middle East restricted to local registration only plus Instrumental Rating. A380/IR (No sim required. As is your current type. But restricted , cannot be used in Europe. Its only to keep your license valid.)
3. After every LPC done in Middle East I send all records to IAA and they automatically renew my EASA IR + Restricted Type Rating and send the new license free of charge to my home country in Europe.

simple, smooth, cheap and works.

my two cents.

rgds.
I did exactly the same pattern with ENAC in Italy
Ramones is offline  
Old 1st Dec 2018, 08:43
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Join Date: Mar 2016
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Originally Posted by 340-co View Post
Here is what I did.
1. I transfered my UK EASA ATPL License to Irish EASA ATPL License.
2. I got my Irish license with my current type in Middle East restricted to local registration only plus Instrumental Rating. A380/IR (No sim required. As is your current type. But restricted , cannot be used in Europe. Its only to keep your license valid.)
3. After every LPC done in Middle East I send all records to IAA and they automatically renew my EASA IR + Restricted Type Rating and send the new license free of charge to my home country in Europe.

simple, smooth, cheap and works.

my two cents.

rgds.
There's no longer any requirement to have a valid typerating to keep your license valid. That was a JAR requirement. Under EASA, all that's required is a valid medical.
Big Enos Burdette is offline  
Old 1st Dec 2018, 11:58
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Thank you guys so much for your responses.

I will look into the Irish Option right now to see if it’s still viable under the current time scale.
The ‘restricted rating’ option it appears they offer is a strong possibility to keep something on my EASA licence.

I will also check out some TRTO’s.

Originally Posted by Big Enos Burdette View Post
There's no longer any requirement to have a valid typerating to keep your license valid. That was a JAR requirement. Under EASA, all that's required is a valid medical.
......

WOW is this for real, I’m really focused on this hard 7 year limit to keep a home ATPL ( or IR exams credit) alive for my return.....
Big Enos Burdette do you have a reference for this you could share please, finding these loopholes are almost impossible.

Thanks again guys, amazing responses.

If anyone else has any ideas, please feel free to share.

Happy Landings.

Last edited by flymetothe moon; 1st Dec 2018 at 12:33. Reason: Grammar
flymetothe moon is offline  
Old 1st Dec 2018, 16:49
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https://www.easa.europa.eu/sites/def...u/Part-FCL.pdf

1)
FCL.070 Revocation, suspension and limitation of licences, ratings and certificates
(a) Licences, ratings and certificates issued in accordance with this Part may be limited, suspended or revoked by the competent authority when the pilot does not comply with the requirements of this Part, Part-Medical or the applicable operational requirements, in accordance with the conditions and procedures laid down in Part-ARA.

2)
[nothing noteworthy found in SUBPART F - AIRLINE TRANSPORT PILOT LICENCE — ATPL]

3)
FCL.625 IR — Validity, revalidation and renewal
(d) If the IR has not been revalidated or renewed within the preceding 7 years, the holder will be required to pass again the IR theoretical knowledge examination and skill test.
FlightDetent is offline  
Old 1st Dec 2018, 18:33
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FMTTM, check you PM's
eagleflight is offline  
Old 2nd Dec 2018, 03:14
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From cap804 downloaded from publicapps.caa.co.uk.

FCL.625(d): IR Renewal requirement for pilots who hold or have held an IR on
another licence or a UK Military Green Rating
The UK CAA has adopted a derogation such that where a pilot holds or has held an
Instrument Rating issued by a third country and that rating is compliant with Annex I to
the Convention on International Civil Aviation, the applicability of FCL.625 IR(c) and (d)
may be based on the validity dates of the Instrument Rating of that other country. The
effect of this exemption is that to renew the IR on a UK issued licence:
(i) a pilot with a current and valid 3rd country IR shall complete the revalidation
requirements of FCL.625(b) and the aircraft category specific requirements for
revalidation of the Part-FCL IR; meaning that he must pass the proficiency check,
but is not required to undergo training or to re-take the theoretical knowledge
examinations; or
(ii) a pilot who held a 3rd country IR that is no longer valid but had been revalidated
or renewed within the preceding 7 years shall comply with the renewal
requirements of FCL.625 IR(c), but is not required to re-take the theoretical
knowledge examination
CautionShortRunway is offline  
Old 2nd Dec 2018, 10:59
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If you hold a UK issued EASA ATPL, then you are exempt from the seven-year time window, providing a valid IR rating has been held within the past seven years in a non-EASA licence. As far as I am aware, the UK is the only country to seek this exemption and it apparently was driven by British expat pilots in Cathay and Dragonair. I migrated from a UK issued EASA ATPL, to an IAA issued licence a couple of years ago. The IAA confirmed last year in writing to me, that the seven year window does apply but a restricted (A6 only) rating will restart the clock for another seven years.

On a personal note, I can confirm that the IAA are a joy to deal with and correspondence is replied to normally within 24 hours. I have always found them to be very helpful and friendly.

The letter below from the UK CAA in 2013, might be helpful to clarify the above.

Emma Royds is offline  
Old 2nd Dec 2018, 21:37
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My advise, run to Irish CAA
gsavopoulos is offline  
Old 4th Dec 2018, 20:12
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Thanks People...what detailed knowledge of FCL regs.

Lots of good info here. I just need to check if all these options are unchanged in the last few years or if Brexit will change stuff again.

Now waiting on the final say from Irish and UK Authorities.

Thanks again for posting fellow aviators
flymetothe moon is offline  
Old 5th Dec 2018, 17:56
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I hope I'm wrong, but my understanding was that as the multi-crew instrument rating is type specific you have to be maintaining it on a type which is held on your UK issued licence. So if you have come to the ME as a non-type rated pilot the seven year rule may still apply.
excrab is offline  
Old 7th Dec 2018, 06:45
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Join Date: Jun 2011
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Guys please could you advise on where is a good and possibly cheap enough sim centre in Europe to renew an EASA A320 rating/IR?

Thank you
bringbackthe80s is online now  
Old 7th Dec 2018, 08:01
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Join Date: Feb 2009
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They are all relatively cheap.
Best to find a TRE who has some connections and will get a cheaper rate for you.

I paid less than 700€ net for 2hrs in Frankfurt earlier this year...
McMax is offline  
Old 7th Dec 2018, 08:03
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Oh ok thank you very much, what is the training centre if you can say?
bringbackthe80s is online now  
Old 8th Dec 2018, 08:10
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Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Europe
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That was at Lufthansa Flight Training.
Booked through a TRE who works part time for them.
Paid a similiar price a couple of years ago without any connection at TFC Kauefer, DUS area...

Just ring any TRO in Europe and compare prices.
McMax is offline  

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