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Managing expectations

Middle East Many expats still flying in Knoteetingham. Regional issues can be discussed here.

Managing expectations

Old 8th May 2018, 15:32
  #41 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: MIDDLE EAST
Posts: 1,040
MM

Fundamentally, this is where we disagree. I AM realistic to know that my time here is only as good as my last landing. That though is true of many airlines to be honest. However, the big difference here is that it involves moving house, school and family very quickly. The effect on immediate family and friends will be stressful and profound but, we all knew that anyway before we came, right? Yet we still made that all important first move abroad. In that time, things change. Factually, overall T&C's have declined along with wages relative to the ever increasing cost of living.

So, we now have a choice. Do what you do, commit as little as possible financially and emotionally, do your job professional to the best of your ability and take the cash each month. Fine, many do that and it may work for you. But, and here's the rub, your family is invested here too, especially children. They settle at school, make friends and your wife too develops a social network of friends. Damn, I'm sure even you have a few chums to drink beer with! So, when you detach yourself fully, you send a subliminal message to the family that this is not a long term proposition. That in itself creates uncertainty and I know of many wives who've left because they never took the time to engage with Dubai or make friends here. Why would they, they would not be staying long after all? Further, their pilot husbands spent hours at home and at parties whinging and moaning about their jobs and the Company. After a while, even the most loyal spouse will find this tedious and depressing. Why stay in a place you're not happy?

Personally, if you can't ever accept the things that can't be changed, life will become unbearable, for you and your family. If, or when it reaches a point where the lifestyle is not providing what you be attained elsewhere, you leave. Embracing the positives will always make your life and those around you better. Focusing on the negatives achieves little. Because of that, I look at all the good that Dubai and EK can provide, both for me and my family. On the whole, it's much better that I was able to achieve elsewhere. That doesn't make me a kool aid drinker or management troll.

My only concern is where this Company is now heading, especially with the dire results from our colleagues South of here. The style of leadership is not conducive to open feedback within management. Senior management meetings with STC are one way. There are too many filters and management do not like being realistic if it involves bad news. An environment that encourages open dialogue is the only way forward and while it's starting to work at the CiF courses and fleet briefings during RTGS, that same philosophy must be applied at the very top. Then, and only then, will we see a positive move to improve conditions, particularly for pilots. If nothing changes, which is likely, I see the problem only getting worse. Historically, change here is slow. The analogy of the lumbering tanker changing course is often used. However, STC has previously dictated some policy changes overnight, the 2 in a the cockpit being just one example. He needs to grasp the gravitas of the current situation and act accordingly and without delay.

Failure to do so makes him complicit in the current debacle of parked planes and insufficient pilots.

Harry
harry the cod is offline  
Old 8th May 2018, 16:06
  #42 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: In the back of a bus
Posts: 954
He needs to grasp the gravitas of the current situation and act accordingly and without delay.
The main question is, does he care?

Past performance says... no he does not. He's on the way out isn't he? it's the next guy's problem now...

He's already complicit. This situation didn't suddenly happen overnight... or even over a year. He's had how many opportunities to do something over the last 3-5 years?
givemewings is offline  
Old 8th May 2018, 17:08
  #43 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 645
Originally Posted by harry the cod View Post
MM

Fundamentally, this is where we disagree. I AM realistic to know that my time here is only as good as my last landing. That though is true of many airlines to be honest. However, the big difference here is that it involves moving house, school and family very quickly. The effect on immediate family and friends will be stressful and profound but, we all knew that anyway before we came, right? Yet we still made that all important first move abroad. In that time, things change. Factually, overall T&C's have declined along with wages relative to the ever increasing cost of living.

So, we now have a choice. Do what you do, commit as little as possible financially and emotionally, do your job professional to the best of your ability and take the cash each month. Fine, many do that and it may work for you. But, and here's the rub, your family is invested here too, especially children. They settle at school, make friends and your wife too develops a social network of friends. Damn, I'm sure even you have a few chums to drink beer with! So, when you detach yourself fully, you send a subliminal message to the family that this is not a long term proposition. That in itself creates uncertainty and I know of many wives who've left because they never took the time to engage with Dubai or make friends here. Why would they, they would not be staying long after all? Further, their pilot husbands spent hours at home and at parties whinging and moaning about their jobs and the Company. After a while, even the most loyal spouse will find this tedious and depressing. Why stay in a place you're not happy?

Personally, if you can't ever accept the things that can't be changed, life will become unbearable, for you and your family. If, or when it reaches a point where the lifestyle is not providing what you be attained elsewhere, you leave. Embracing the positives will always make your life and those around you better. Focusing on the negatives achieves little. Because of that, I look at all the good that Dubai and EK can provide, both for me and my family. On the whole, it's much better that I was able to achieve elsewhere. That doesn't make me a kool aid drinker or management troll.

My only concern is where this Company is now heading, especially with the dire results from our colleagues South of here. The style of leadership is not conducive to open feedback within management. Senior management meetings with STC are one way. There are too many filters and management do not like being realistic if it involves bad news. An environment that encourages open dialogue is the only way forward and while it's starting to work at the CiF courses and fleet briefings during RTGS, that same philosophy must be applied at the very top. Then, and only then, will we see a positive move to improve conditions, particularly for pilots. If nothing changes, which is likely, I see the problem only getting worse. Historically, change here is slow. The analogy of the lumbering tanker changing course is often used. However, STC has previously dictated some policy changes overnight, the 2 in a the cockpit being just one example. He needs to grasp the gravitas of the current situation and act accordingly and without delay.

Failure to do so makes him complicit in the current debacle of parked planes and insufficient pilots.

Harry
Harold, where to start? Perhaps its more succinct and pragmatic to say, ostensibly that I find my thoughts in alignment with your post, the real difference is a philosophical one rather than a simple perspective or outlook.
Most of us have family or kids in school, most of us also loathe the idea of having to uproot and disrupt merely for the sake of a bit of personal self satisfaction. Notwithstanding all of that, my disengagement from Dubai is nothing to do with the individuals and persons that I and my family socialise and interact with, the disengagement manifests itself in terms of being beholden or tied to the place in a financial or emotional sense. Ask yourself Harold how many of your friends or fellow expats once they leave maintain anything other than a cursory level of contact with the region or the people in it? In my experience the very reason for being here is the very reason that when most leave they seldom look back.
Now whilst you may disagree with my outlook, I’m fairly certain based on past experience and a healthy level of cynicism that those above us couldn’t give the foggiest as to our welfare, our aspirations, our families, our health or our opinions, they are for the most part bound by their sociopathic tendencies or worse, so why should I or more to the point why should we give them the benefit of our emotional intelligence, its far better in my view to base your decision making process on remuneration, just like them.
ATC can do what he likes, and he will continue to do so, like it or lump it, but make sure you laugh all the way to the bank first.
Monarch Man is offline  
Old 9th May 2018, 04:24
  #44 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: earth
Posts: 1,042
Originally Posted by harry the cod View Post
He's in a month or two and you expect change already? FFS, give the guy a chance. Work with him, not against him and lets see collectively if there are positives to come out of it. Write to him. He can only ever stand a chance of changing things if he's armed with the data and evidence. It's not him who's ultimately controlling the policies but it is him who can influence those that do.
Harry
Harry, every time some newbie starts complaining on here, he is quickly put in place with the usual "....then you didn't do your homework before joining".
You should therefore, in all fairness, apply the same to managers!
If BBJ had effectively done his homework before joining, he would not have boasted what all he intends to do here, knowing fully well that it is unachievable with the actual Führership.
By still doing so, he either hasn't done his homework, or he repeated very intentionally the same drivel his predecessors did.

Either way it shows there's no increased hope with him.
glofish is offline  
Old 9th May 2018, 07:14
  #45 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: In the desert
Posts: 122
I guess they hope the 5 weeks will keep us quiet..
DuneMentat is offline  
Old 9th May 2018, 07:36
  #46 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Earth
Posts: 324
Does 5 weeks exceed the expectations of the pilot group?
TurningFinalRWY36 is offline  
Old 9th May 2018, 08:04
  #47 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Kingston upon Thames
Posts: 80
Yes, it does exceed the expectations.
as long as it is accompanied with a robust pay raise, 10% being the absolute minimum.
KL
KippaLippa is offline  
Old 9th May 2018, 08:32
  #48 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Dusty West
Age: 49
Posts: 595
It doesn't exceed nor does it fall short of the mark, its exactly what I expected but I have been known to be realistic. I do believe that there will be some rough seas ahead in the coming few years and this is where the real indication for future success lie.

As for a pay increase, I'm not so sure. I would expect the 3% step to be sure, a raise is a different story.

However I think most people will agree that where they give with one hand, they will take with the other.
The Outlaw is offline  
Old 9th May 2018, 09:16
  #49 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Dubai
Posts: 1
I know it’s asked every year, but what’s the formula for working out profit share?
Base×12÷365×25
OR
5xBasex12÷52
Flying Rabbits is offline  
Old 9th May 2018, 11:11
  #50 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: UAE
Posts: 274
I guess they hope the 5 weeks will keep us quiet..
If you were the business, you would hope that too!

5 weeks will go a long way because more than half the pilot body (and cabin crew) were expecting nothing! The issue will be whats announced tomorrow, thats where the longterm issues will or will not be sorted. The profit share announced today will not attract pilots like a pay rise, increase in flight pay, and a lowering of productivity threshold could.
777-200LR is offline  
Old 9th May 2018, 12:31
  #51 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: usa
Posts: 1,007
Originally Posted by Flying Rabbits View Post
I know it’s asked every year, but what’s the formula for working out profit share?
Base×12÷365×25
OR
5xBasex12÷52
base*12 / 52 * 5
fliion is offline  
Old 9th May 2018, 12:46
  #52 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Dubai
Posts: 67
I think 5 weeks is fair so I am happy with this result. Having said that the pay rise is a serious issue given the rapidly rising cost of living in Dubai and if EK wants to remain "competitive" as they like to say, then they need to address this seriously otherwise there is little reason to remain in Dubai much longer
dustyflightdeck is offline  
Old 9th May 2018, 12:48
  #53 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: South Africa
Posts: 224
Originally Posted by 777-200LR View Post
If you were the business, you would hope that too!

5 weeks will go a long way because more than half the pilot body (and cabin crew) were expecting nothing! The issue will be whats announced tomorrow, thats where the longterm issues will or will not be sorted. The profit share announced today will not attract pilots like a pay rise, increase in flight pay, and a lowering of productivity threshold could.
I am one of people who expected nothing and I can say I am happy. It will go towards my resignation fund.
Joker11 is offline  
Old 9th May 2018, 13:24
  #54 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Mars
Posts: 521
Shame the owners 2 billion cut goes out before the profit share is paid. Seems the cut has kept pace with inflation😂
Schnowzer is offline  
Old 10th May 2018, 10:35
  #55 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Desert
Posts: 2
Well. It’s out.....
Desert snake is offline  

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