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Going from EK widebody Capt to LCC in Europe. Opinions?

Middle East Many expats still flying in Knoteetingham. Regional issues can be discussed here.

Going from EK widebody Capt to LCC in Europe. Opinions?

Old 16th Mar 2018, 13:34
  #1 (permalink)  
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Going from EK widebody Capt to LCC in Europe. Opinions?

Hi Folks,

About to make the move from widebody LHS to an orange LCC back in Europe.
Except the paycut it looks like my life will be better if I go this way.

But I still have some fear regarding the dreaded 4/5 sectors per day versus the 1 sector followed by a 24hrs break at the hotel before coming back.

On the plus side, no more night flying and a bit more time off at home. Union protection, social security.....etc

So I would like to have some feedback from the guys who made the move already and let me know how they feel now? Is the lifestyle that much better? Any regrets?

Thanks a lot
NineInchSnail is offline  
Old 16th Mar 2018, 23:21
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Join Date: Jun 2009
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I’m in a similar situation and same fear...Let’s wait for the feedback.
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Old 17th Mar 2018, 01:39
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Join Date: Apr 2007
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You end up driving a Nissan rather than a BMW
You search a little smarter when buying things because maybe you have less money
You actually enjoy more challenging flying. After all thats what you enjoy
You feel happier
Your soul feels like it is being nourished
You feel more real
You appreciate that home time
LIfestyle is not about glitz and gold
You learn to respect a more honest life
1a sound asleep is offline  
Old 17th Mar 2018, 03:28
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I would agree with what 1a sound asleep says...
I have been in both position ( Europe low cost and Middle East carrier ) and without a doubt I will say that my life was a lot bettter outside of the Middle East but yes , you will have to accept to downgrade a little bit your lifestyle.
No more Mc Laren , Ferrari and the like but feeling a lot better , having real friends , time with the family , stable roster , less flight through the night , less shift between day and night flights etc...
dubaigong is offline  
Old 17th Mar 2018, 04:01
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Join Date: Jul 2000
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If you join the Orange LCC in LGW, one thing you won’t have is a stable roster, EK roster is far more stable especially during the summer months..
.
There’s a lot to be said about being in your own bed every night but the 5 consecutive earlies are a killer.

Driving into work, getting the bus from the car park, operating 4 sectors often with delays due unrealistic block times and turnaround times, slots often results in operating close to or into discretion then driving home and doing it all again the next day and the day after etc, can be really tiring, living more than 20 mins from the airport would only add to your woes.

Having said all of that you will find that your quality of life on your days off will improve dramatically, if you have family and especially kids they will thrive in a “freeer” environment. Your kids will be able to do after school activities without having to take a mortgage to pay for them.

There will most definitely be less night flying and no jet-lag, you will fly mainly with like minded individuals and you won’t live in fear of losing your job every time you go to work like some do.

1a sound asleep sums it up well too but you need to consider the above.

My last point would be, leave EK and return home? Absolutely! You will wish you had done it earlier! But you really need to consider some of the above before putting pen to paper with some airlines. Some love the LCC lifestyle, some hate it, it really is up to the individual.

The only thing I miss from DXB are my mates that are still there!

Good luck!

Last edited by springbok449; 17th Mar 2018 at 15:47.
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Old 17th Mar 2018, 07:28
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Which Orange base?

This is critical.
Craggenmore is offline  
Old 17th Mar 2018, 14:17
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I have done the move this last year.

Leaving EK has been good on my health. Truth be told I liked the job at EK but was tired of years of no leave and the punishing rosters.

The first thing I noticed is the quality of sleep I finally got. I have been working 5/4 rosters with 4 sectors per days at times and have gotten used to it. The 4 days off really do allow you to recover.

Your salary is still reasonable, but yes one has to be a little careful with the budget. All that said we are still managing to save.

Hope that helps.
Noleave is offline  
Old 17th Mar 2018, 15:02
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Join Date: Feb 2006
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Having done both tho at a regional base at the Orange crowd for 13 yrs + there are lots of trade offs. Everyone will have different priorities and each to their own. The crews at Ezy are great and the flying is fun. For me I much prefer our family life in dubai and believe it or not I prefer the fatbus roster than my old fixed pattern. Its a very personal choice and I wish u every success & happiness, if I had to return Ezy would be one of my top choices as long as I could get part time fairly quickly. Njoy and good luck!
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Old 17th Mar 2018, 15:50
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Just to add to my earlier post, as mentioned above which Orange base is crucial, regional bases and some European bases are fine but LGW and others are best avoided. Part-time would be the only way I would consider it.
Good luck
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Old 17th Mar 2018, 19:24
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Iím LGW and I actually enjoy it. Almost every base has a long walk to car park and aircraft. LGW offers the best flying as there is so much route selection, easy to swap and never gets boring. LGW offers unpaid leave in the winter and also more chance of part time. Also LGW offers opportunities of overtime. Pay is good and share scheme can reward well if you are patient. Just learn to live on £5700-6000 a month
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Old 17th Mar 2018, 23:40
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Originally Posted by springbok449 View Post

you will fly mainly with like minded individuals and you wonít live in fear of losing your job every time you go to work like some do.
Love this part
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Old 18th Mar 2018, 05:39
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I like the " just learn to live on 5700£ to 6000£ a month "
Get back down to earth , there is a majority of people living with a lot less than that without any problem...
I have been used to live with 2500 Euros per month and having a nice life , just avoid spending on stupid expensive stuff that you don't really need except to show off
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Old 18th Mar 2018, 09:13
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Originally Posted by dubaigong View Post
I like the " just learn to live on 5700£ to 6000£ a month "
Get back down to earth , there is a majority of people living with a lot less than that without any problem...
I have been used to live with 2500 Euros per month and having a nice life , just avoid spending on stupid expensive stuff that you don't really need except to show off
Couldnít agree more...

That said, when you are used to having a higher disposable income, it DOES require some ďgetting used toĒ and readjustment in instinctive spending habits. The poster is correct in pointing this out as some people just donít like having to actually budget.
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Old 18th Mar 2018, 13:01
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Sorry but if you were a cockpit crew member and being paid Ä2500 per month you were being ripped off and contributing to the continuing erosion of industry conditions. Not your fault of course
Jack D is offline  
Old 18th Mar 2018, 17:39
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Jack D

Don't talk about what you don't know...

I was at that time a first officer for a national air carrier in Europe and this was my salary after tax ( you know what you are so used not to pay here )
I also was benefiting of a good social security system , a good pension scheme and two group insurances paid by the company.
I have been of medical for around 5 month and my full salary was paid while recovering at home.

For your info I am not and have never contributed to the erosion of the industry as I have never paid for any of my training ( not even my basic training as I passed a selection program and all my training has been free from 0 to 220 hours and a Professional multi-engine IFR licence in my Pocket )

After that I had been Lucky enough to be trained for free on 3 different type rating ( Boeing , McDonnell Douglas and finally Airbus.

I was also scheduled for all my ground trainings , simulator sessions etc... and paid during this time while here YOU accept to learn on your off time at home on your computer most of your reccurent course and exams , so please keep your judgement for yourself until you have the correct information.

Have a great day mister Jack D
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Old 18th Mar 2018, 18:40
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Believe me I know ... Iíve been in the business of flying for 40+ years and that salary is a disgrace . The other extras you describe are industry norms in many cases . As I said if you regard this as an adequate salary I was paid more in 1978( in Europe) that is comparing like for like in currency terms . I donít mean to cause offence or denigrate your achievements but you are still being inadequately compensated ... are you in the so called former eastern block by any chance ?
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Old 18th Mar 2018, 19:52
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Originally Posted by dubaigong View Post
Jack D

For your info I am not and have never contributed to the erosion of the industry ...........
You work for FZ/EK. So yes, yes you have.

Last edited by mmmbop; 18th Mar 2018 at 20:46.
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Old 19th Mar 2018, 00:59
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Jack D is correct

I have been in the biz for 38 yrs as well and see my mates operating A320's for some LCC in the western part of Europe, for less net income than I had some 30 yrs ago as F/O ( in a good month ) on a heavy jet
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Old 19th Mar 2018, 03:41
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I have to agree with Jack as well. I just did the sums. In 1976 I was getting paid more as a narrow body FO. And that amount of money had a lot more buying power in 1976! And looking at my log book, I flew around 500 hours a year. Things have certainly gone south.
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Old 19th Mar 2018, 09:25
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Guys I would not concentrate on the salary, in bases outside the UK the salary won' t change much compared to EK (excluding free housing/bills/schools which is no little matter of course).

I' d be focusing more on the lifestyle change, going from a long haul operation to a 4 sectors any weather any type of approach operation. I guess everyone fancies a change every once in a while anyway, so could be interesting for some.

I suspect many of you have an idea of Europe which no longer is, and can't wait to go back..given the state of things I would think twice, even 3 times. But this is my opininon and is probably for another thread (or forum).

All in all many people before you made the change, if this is what you want for you and your kids I' m sure you' ll be fine. Good luck
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