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Be aware of Korean air

Middle East Many expats still flying in Knoteetingham. Regional issues can be discussed here.

Be aware of Korean air

Old 27th Feb 2019, 03:25
  #61 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: BC
Posts: 452
On Them...Not!

Originally Posted by tgo15 View Post
May i know what kind of documents they asked for joining korean air ? (Except the one is written)
and im curious , what about the meal, if we order some food at the hotel, is it on them ? Or is it from us (our diem) last one is, at the end.. how many days a month they give you , 9 or 11 or 12? I need to know the exact answer because my family are living on the other part of the world. Thanks
Nothing is for free, I'm afraid. You order food at the hotel...you pay. Actually, the per diems in ICN equal to nearly what you will spend for food while staying at the hotel. The company gives, the company takes. You won't make money on per diems. Days off are 9 blocked + 2 vacation (if you wish to take the vacation days), or you can save vacation days)
777AV8R is offline  
Old 27th Feb 2019, 03:45
  #62 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: i'm in the parking lot
Posts: 239
I have been "on the line" now for over a year, and my per diem contributions have averaged +1000 usd (that's a mix of won and usd)

I easily save 4000 usd a year off the per deim (which in my accounting pays my loss of income policy)

If you just eat at the hotels, as AVR said, maybe a few big nights in Korea, you will break even.

Personal choices, I guess
The Turtle is offline  
Old 27th Feb 2019, 21:26
  #63 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Entoure
Posts: 6
Not too surprisingly the allowances depend somewhat on what fleet you are on and roster but I about break even on the per diem.
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Old 28th Feb 2019, 04:10
  #64 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: BC
Posts: 452
Break Even

Originally Posted by AtoZ View Post
Not too surprisingly the allowances depend somewhat on what fleet you are on and roster but I about break even on the per diem.
The owners have done the math. In ICN you get a per diem, the daily cost of food equals what you received in per diem. You get to eat for free but you will not make money. Same for HNL, LAX. The hotels are owned by KAL.

In in order to be fit to fly, you have to eat. Simple. Perdiems weren’t designed as extra pay incentives.
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Old 6th Mar 2019, 06:38
  #65 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: London
Posts: 20
Morning,

Could someone please elaborate on the intricacies of "Getting Through the training" @ Korean as I'm looking at applying.

Many Thanks

BYO
Byobeer is offline  
Old 6th Mar 2019, 23:38
  #66 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: uae
Posts: 2,366
Lots of OIC!
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Old 7th Mar 2019, 07:22
  #67 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: i'm in the parking lot
Posts: 239
1. Check your ego at the door. If you behave like a skygod then you will have trouble.

2. The training is more emotionally fatiguing than than work or study. It's 4 months away from your family. It can get lonely

3. Don't ask too many questions. You've already demonstrated you're a captain. To ask questions suggest doubt. They don't like that.

4. Even after you're assigned a groundschool, even after you've passed your Airlaw, Molit skills test, ATP ride, you can still cock-up training and go home. Act like a cadet until you pass your final line check

5. Positive attitude is everything. It can overcome small errors here.

6. Don't lose your cool. Lots of minor inconveniences here.... To blow your top shows immaturity and lack of self-control. It is the polar opposite of the middle east.

I'm sure others can elaborate but this is just my thoughts. Good luck
The Turtle is offline  
Old 7th Mar 2019, 08:32
  #68 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: London
Posts: 20
Many Thanks,

I can cope with all of that no problem. Small beans eh.

Appreciate your time.
BYO
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Old 11th Mar 2019, 05:23
  #69 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Planet Earth
Posts: 11
4 months away during training

Originally Posted by The Turtle View Post
1. Check your ego at the door. If you behave like a skygod then you will have trouble.

2. The training is more emotionally fatiguing than than work or study. It's 4 months away from your family. It can get lonely

3. Don't ask too many questions. You've already demonstrated you're a captain. To ask questions suggest doubt. They don't like that.

4. Even after you're assigned a groundschool, even after you've passed your Airlaw, Molit skills test, ATP ride, you can still cock-up training and go home. Act like a cadet until you pass your final line check

5. Positive attitude is everything. It can overcome small errors here.

6. Don't lose your cool. Lots of minor inconveniences here.... To blow your top shows immaturity and lack of self-control. It is the polar opposite of the middle east.

I'm sure others can elaborate but this is just my thoughts. Good luck
So during the 4 months, do you have any chance to see your family at all or are you just stuck in ICN the whole time?

And is the 4 months for non-typerated guys? Is it shorter if you are typerated already?
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Old 24th Mar 2019, 11:26
  #70 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Sandy Surroundings!
Posts: 180
Originally Posted by Vikingfly View Post
So during the 4 months, do you have any chance to see your family at all or are you just stuck in ICN the whole time?

And is the 4 months for non-typerated guys? Is it shorter if you are typerated already?
Type rated means absolutely nothing - B748 mate has been on course for 5 months and have not completed his Koreanization.....
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Old 24th Mar 2019, 12:25
  #71 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Entoure
Posts: 6
Firstly I think everyone has to turn up at KAL type rated.

Secondly the only difference is experience on type, the main difference is experienced on type joiners have four less sectors on OE/‘line training’ to complete.
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Old 24th Mar 2019, 13:36
  #72 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Europe
Posts: 19
Originally Posted by TwinJock View Post
Type rated means absolutely nothing - B748 mate has been on course for 5 months and have not completed his Koreanization.....
I am not sure to understand what you mean, do you mean that even guys already type rated on the aircraft they are supposed to fly, will also do training for 5 months ? What are they doing for all this time ? I probably missed something somewhere !

Anyone have an idea of the 737 roster ? how many 4 sectors day per month ?

Thank you !
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Old 25th Mar 2019, 02:38
  #73 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Sydney
Posts: 5
Originally Posted by DALTA View Post
I am not sure to understand what you mean, do you mean that even guys already type rated on the aircraft they are supposed to fly, will also do training for 5 months ? What are they doing for all this time ? I probably missed something somewhere !

Anyone have an idea of the 737 roster ? how many 4 sectors day per month ?

Thank you !
What he means is you can expect to do a full course if you join KE. The regulator, MOLIT sets the requirements for expat courses and Korean air follow them to the letter, this means full ground course, crm, cbt, performance, dangerous goods, safety and security, fixed base and full motion sims blah blah blah and they will fill up the time, although at present course times on other fleets have been around the four month mark, you will not get home during that time but you can ask for an observation flight to you home city if it’s on there network and you may get lucky, that being said a recent 777 Capt did manage to get a home visit during training but I believe it was due to the fact that no checker was available for the release check for a period of time so permission was granted.
Word is that the requirement for a MOLIT examiner to be in the flight deck for line release check has been lifted and it is now being done in-house, it remains to be seen if that will be a good thing or not with many a candidate being passed by the examiner when the company LCP had wanted to fail them.
KE have just hired some 200 candidates directly from the airforce alone with a bunch of etihad 330 guys on secondment which will certainly increase pressure on the training department so one would expect course time to remain high.
Dogsofwar is offline  
Old 25th Mar 2019, 03:40
  #74 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: i'm in the parking lot
Posts: 239
I second what Dogs said....the time from arrival to line check completion is 4-5 months. It's a grind to be away for so long.

a few points to mention: I knew I was exhausted from the grind that was EK so I welcomed sleeping in the same time zone. After about 6 weeks I felt way better (the short term memory loss is permanent I'm afraid)

many had their family visit them, that's a welcome option. You are assigned the same room during your entire time of ground training so they can easily stay when you're at class or days off

lastly if possible don't do the course in the winter months. The days are sometimes long in class and with the significant loss of daylight hours in the winter it can add to the feeling of depression, at least for me the thought of starting out on the bus in the dark and finishing the day in the dark is something I'd avoid.
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Old 25th Mar 2019, 18:35
  #75 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Europe
Posts: 19
Originally Posted by Dogsofwar View Post


What he means is you can expect to do a full course if you join KE. The regulator, MOLIT sets the requirements for expat courses and Korean air follow them to the letter, this means full ground course, crm, cbt, performance, dangerous goods, safety and security, fixed base and full motion sims blah blah blah and they will fill up the time, although at present course times on other fleets have been around the four month mark, you will not get home during that time but you can ask for an observation flight to you home city if it’s on there network and you may get lucky, that being said a recent 777 Capt did manage to get a home visit during training but I believe it was due to the fact that no checker was available for the release check for a period of time so permission was granted.
Word is that the requirement for a MOLIT examiner to be in the flight deck for line release check has been lifted and it is now being done in-house, it remains to be seen if that will be a good thing or not with many a candidate being passed by the examiner when the company LCP had wanted to fail them.
KE have just hired some 200 candidates directly from the airforce alone with a bunch of etihad 330 guys on secondment which will certainly increase pressure on the training department so one would expect course time to remain high.

Thanks for your replies guys !
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Old 26th Mar 2019, 19:41
  #76 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Europe
Posts: 19
any thought on that ?

I love asia, i am single and no plan to get a wife nor kids. I have 2000 hrs on the 737NG and i am currently flying for Ryanair with 4 sectors days. I am not in a rush to get the upgrade and i can still move after few years in KAL.

How is the atmosphere in the cockpit ?
How is the interview process ? how many guys are successful ?

I would like to get a neutral advice please

Thanks a lot !
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Old 30th Mar 2019, 15:10
  #77 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Europe
Posts: 19
Anyone ?
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Old 30th Mar 2019, 16:43
  #78 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Italy
Posts: 15
Originally Posted by DALTA View Post
Anyone ?
Just go for it , I mean just go for the interview and you probably get a good feel for it how you like it, no need to take the first option you get, a lot of companies hiring all over the place now so go and do a few assessments and then just decide . If you are already type-rated then it´s very little you gamble with if you decide to change later since normally the bond is very low. If you go in May I might join you there for
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Old 30th Mar 2019, 19:45
  #79 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 1999
Location: Here, there, & everywhere
Posts: 55
With regard to the 9 or 11 days off per month, can you place these days anywhere in the month you like as a block, and therefore can you request them back to back, so over a two month period you could have a block of 18/22 days?

My second question to those that are there is, roughly how many days off per working block do you get?

Many thanks,

FBW
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Old 1st Apr 2019, 12:11
  #80 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: i'm in the parking lot
Posts: 239
You can place them where ever you wish. You must submit your request the month prior to your current schedule month....ie, March request submitted by end of Jan

blocks of days off must be approved by your manager and you need a good reason for it

days off in icn depends on the fleet. Some fleets work a lot harder than others
The Turtle is offline  

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