Alternate callsign?
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Alternate callsign?
There have been some dumb things here in the past 7 years but are you kidding me? If you can't pay attention to a call sign, you shouldn't be flying!
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I actually think its a good start, not sure why the resistance if any to roll it out as it works elsewhere just fine.
Regarding missing calls etc, well I've missed them, got confused, taken the wrong one, all because the call-sign was similar and I was tired, or some halfwit transmitted over the controller, or half a dozen other reasons.
As long as we have similar call-signs at similar times e.g. 16/161 50/501 then its going to cause problems.
Like I said, its a good start from my perspective.
Regarding missing calls etc, well I've missed them, got confused, taken the wrong one, all because the call-sign was similar and I was tired, or some halfwit transmitted over the controller, or half a dozen other reasons.
As long as we have similar call-signs at similar times e.g. 16/161 50/501 then its going to cause problems.
Like I said, its a good start from my perspective.
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If you can't pay attention to a call sign, you shouldn't be flying!
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Another though..
After an 8 hour flight and using a call sign for that amount of time, this is exactly what I want to do....change my call sign? If the flight is going to use a new call sign why not use it from the beginning of the flight?
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Sorry..
I am not trying to start a big debate, but when did 2 or 3 or even 4 digits numbers get confusing? We all have been doing this for years, is it really that complicated. Or it it because we are all tired? Just my thoughts. Thanks
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There have been some dumb things here in the past 7 years but are you kidding me? If you can't pay attention to a call sign, you shouldn't be flying!
Last edited by 10 DME ARC; 29th Sep 2013 at 16:12.
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They would love to introduce random alpha numeric callsigns full stop, unfortunately the diplomatic clearance issues worldwide (with the exception of Europe) puts a stop to that! Good start but they should have introduced at flydubai as well, its only a trial involving EK I think.
I am not trying to start a big debate, but when did 2 or 3 or even 4 digits numbers get confusing? We all have been doing this for years, is it really that complicated. Or it it because we are all tired? Just my thoughts. Thanks
Well, excuse our low standards, but we employed the last three superheroes some years ago, and have had to settle for fallible Human Beings both in the Aircraft and at ATC stations since then....
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Sorry,
What I should have said is hard enough at that time of morning, so adding a couple of more letters to the call sign, and our registration letters may also sound a little alike, I don't believe will help, but let's see.
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My view is just that, my view, so don't take this any other way. I think it's completely ridiculous. We work with electronic strips, are we now gonna have to grab a pen and paper to write down the last two letters of your callsign. This may have been a good idea ten years ago but I'm not convinced.
In the Tower environment it makes no sense as no matter what I call you Iran Air is still gonna read it back!!
In the Tower environment it makes no sense as no matter what I call you Iran Air is still gonna read it back!!
, I obviously didn't make my meaning clear enough. Thanks Tower...
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So, you're saying that in a busy, congested ATC environment, having EK 927, EK 97, and EK 9927 on frequency at the same time could not POSSIBLY lead to confusion and mistakes unless someone was being unprofessional?
Actually in America that is quite easy, " Emirates Nine Twenty Seven, Emirates Ninety Seven, and Emirates Ninety Nine Twenty Seven". This fixation with reading call signs as single digits is half the problem.
If I am EK 151 right behind EK 15 I sure as heck don't say "Emirates One Five One", I would instantly become "Emirates One fifty one" if he is transmitting as Emirates one five. The uptight people who insist on standardized phraseology at times like that need to loosen up a little.
TP
What about when ATC gives you a heads up about similar calls signs on frequency.."Un mentioned Abu Dhabi Airline be advised there are flights 131,151, 101 and 141 on frequency".
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Agree Typhoon. The Aussies actually have it written in their AIP's/LIDO CAR's and call it "Groupform". ABC 1220 = ABC Twelve Twenty, ABC 021=ABC Zero Twenty One, and so on.
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Er, hang on a minute.
Ninety - Nine Twenty Seven and Nine Twenty Seven. Anyone see a problem with that? Not having a go at you but Murphy says it will happen!
Alpha numeric is IMHO the right way to do it. Even having flights to/from Europe using them permanently would cut out some of the problem.
Ninety - Nine Twenty Seven and Nine Twenty Seven. Anyone see a problem with that? Not having a go at you but Murphy says it will happen!
Alpha numeric is IMHO the right way to do it. Even having flights to/from Europe using them permanently would cut out some of the problem.
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Actually in America that is quite easy, " Emirates Nine Twenty Seven, Emirates Ninety Seven, and Emirates Ninety Nine Twenty Seven". This fixation with reading call signs as single digits is half the problem.
If I am EK 151 right behind EK 15 I sure as heck don't say "Emirates One Five One", I would instantly become "Emirates One fifty one" if he is transmitting as Emirates one five. The uptight people who insist on standardized phraseology at times like that need to loosen up a little.
If I am EK 151 right behind EK 15 I sure as heck don't say "Emirates One Five One", I would instantly become "Emirates One fifty one" if he is transmitting as Emirates one five. The uptight people who insist on standardized phraseology at times like that need to loosen up a little.
I'm not sure how anyone can argue that there is no chance of confusion between 'Emirates one fifty one' and 'Emirates fifty one'..........And I second what Helen said.
Just because there hasn't been a major incident in this airspace yet due callsign confusion, doesn't mean it's not going to happen. Surely it's a good idea to try and negate any potential future incident as much as possible.
That's what Swiss cheese models are all about.
Our industry that we all work in has an unfortunate habit of only fixing things AFTER an event. I agree that alphanumerics are definately a step in the right direction.
And anyway, isn't the registration of the aircraft you're flying on a little plaque on the dashboard? How hard is it to read the last 2 letters of that on the rare instructions you're going to be asked to do so?
Last edited by mhk77; 30th Sep 2013 at 17:37.
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I have to agree with Taylor 01...
I think this new procedure being implemented is a knee jerk reaction to a bunch of ASR's and possibly not vey well thought out. Switching call sign's, or should i say "tweaking" call signs at midnight is not, in my opinion a wise choice. I don't think we'll be any better off. Call signs will be missed and confusion will still exist.
Fatigue will play a part no matter what you want to call yourself. A tired pilot is a tired pilot.
I'm not sure what the solution should be.... But I can't say I'm convinced this is one of them.
Just my 2 cents...
I think this new procedure being implemented is a knee jerk reaction to a bunch of ASR's and possibly not vey well thought out. Switching call sign's, or should i say "tweaking" call signs at midnight is not, in my opinion a wise choice. I don't think we'll be any better off. Call signs will be missed and confusion will still exist.
Fatigue will play a part no matter what you want to call yourself. A tired pilot is a tired pilot.
I'm not sure what the solution should be.... But I can't say I'm convinced this is one of them.
Just my 2 cents...