New EK Upgrade Policy
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Europe
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Hi,
I am seriously thinking to move to EK. Although I know it's a difficult question, as we live in uncertain times...
If I join EK now, how long do you think it would take to upgrade to captain at EK?
Do you think that if I join EK now I would have a better chance to upgrade captain in less time, than if I join some time later (say in 2 years time)? Or do you think that EK will continue with the present (unbelievable) expansion rhythm?
I am seriously thinking to move to EK. Although I know it's a difficult question, as we live in uncertain times...
If I join EK now, how long do you think it would take to upgrade to captain at EK?
Do you think that if I join EK now I would have a better chance to upgrade captain in less time, than if I join some time later (say in 2 years time)? Or do you think that EK will continue with the present (unbelievable) expansion rhythm?
it's a difficult question,
Right now there are more than 70 F/Os that have been with Ek for longer than 5 years but less than 6 years, although a few of them may be on upgrade courses at this time.
On the other hand there are Captains who have recently upgraded from F/O positions after not much more than 3 years in the company.
Ironically most of the 5-6 year F/Os joined thinking they would get a chance at upgrade at around 3 years. And some of the 3 year upgraders joined thinking they would be waiting for 5-6 years before maybe moving to the left seat.
It's all to do with moving goalposts, changing requirements and fleet on joining.
At some point in the next couple of years growth is likely to slow, many of the new aircraft are planned as replacements rather than additions. Come expecting 7-10 years for upgrade and you probably won't be disappointed.
Join Date: Feb 2001
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Falcao77
Call me an optimist but I would plan on a 4-5 year upgrade. Emirates has always exceeded expected growth rates. I don't think the majority of guys come here to fly and live in Dubai until retirement age. I would guess that if we ever get through this global economic uncertainty you will see lots of pilots who have been here 10-15 years going home.
If you want to join EK then do it sooner than later. If you wait 2 years then you will have another 1000 FO's senior to you.
Call me an optimist but I would plan on a 4-5 year upgrade. Emirates has always exceeded expected growth rates. I don't think the majority of guys come here to fly and live in Dubai until retirement age. I would guess that if we ever get through this global economic uncertainty you will see lots of pilots who have been here 10-15 years going home.
If you want to join EK then do it sooner than later. If you wait 2 years then you will have another 1000 FO's senior to you.
Join Date: Jul 2011
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UG
Falcao77
roughly 190 more airplanes coming til 2020, plus or might include the new ordered 777s.
im guessing that a pilot who will join EK and be within 3000 to 4000 will see an upgrade earlier than those having 4000 to 5000+ seniority number. By then , aircraft deliveries will slowly stabilise and company would have upgraded the people they need for the current fleets.
attrition rate due retirement, medical grounding , company transfer etc are quite minimal at this stage. If you join now, you might get a chance. If you join later or too late, then everything will just be a matter of waiting....when? no one exactly knows.
my 2c,
DC
roughly 190 more airplanes coming til 2020, plus or might include the new ordered 777s.
im guessing that a pilot who will join EK and be within 3000 to 4000 will see an upgrade earlier than those having 4000 to 5000+ seniority number. By then , aircraft deliveries will slowly stabilise and company would have upgraded the people they need for the current fleets.
attrition rate due retirement, medical grounding , company transfer etc are quite minimal at this stage. If you join now, you might get a chance. If you join later or too late, then everything will just be a matter of waiting....when? no one exactly knows.
my 2c,
DC
Join Date: Mar 2003
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Remember that it is not a increase of 190, the fleet plan was 250 by 2020 , during the the air show TC said its now 280 by 2020 and 30 more 380 (250 to 280 ), @ 75 ( 332/343/345/772/773 and some 773ers )retirements in the same time frame. 150 / 3000 pilots 250/5000 and 280/@6000, 1000 pilots to be hired in the next 2 years that amount per year may continue for a couple more . Attrition , which includes retirement is running at 2.5 to 3 % , @ 100 per year . Plan on 6-7 years and you might be surprized
Three near-catastrophic events in the last ten years from when the airline was a quarter to a half its present size, and with more experienced pilots onboard: the holes are all slowly lining up.
Join Date: Jun 2006
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Notes:
1. Total Time is defined as all flying as P1 and/or P2, excluding single-
and multi-engine piston
What's the general interpretation of this? It was never specified in the original OMA requirements. One way I read it it discounts all piston time. The other, if you put a lot a lot of weight on the backslash, discounts P2 piston time only. Can anyone enlighten me? As someone with nearly 3000 piston command I potentially have a lot to lose!
Thanks
1. Total Time is defined as all flying as P1 and/or P2, excluding single-
and multi-engine piston
What's the general interpretation of this? It was never specified in the original OMA requirements. One way I read it it discounts all piston time. The other, if you put a lot a lot of weight on the backslash, discounts P2 piston time only. Can anyone enlighten me? As someone with nearly 3000 piston command I potentially have a lot to lose!
Thanks
Join Date: Apr 2003
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The 55 tonne rule is a red herring and always has been. If you hire the right people and (this is the important bit) train them properly then after 3 years it should be impossible to tell what they flew before and they should be more than ready for an upgrade. If people choose to spend their time in the right hand seat doing nothing more taxing than reading the Gulf News then that is a completely different matter.
In the past EK has tried to make up for shortfalls in training by introducing arbitrary rules to delay upgrade courses. Fortunately that now seems to be ending.
In the past EK has tried to make up for shortfalls in training by introducing arbitrary rules to delay upgrade courses. Fortunately that now seems to be ending.
Join Date: Jul 2008
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It seems so. I have gone from eligable for upgrade, as I had enough time on jets above 55t, to not eligable as I have too much piston engine time and so don't meet the 6000tt requirement anymore!
I suppose that makes sense to somebody.
I suppose that makes sense to somebody.
(for EK)
Join Date: Sep 2006
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if I had an airline I wouldn't give a 777 into the hands of a guy who's experience is mostly on pistone planes, I actually dont know any airline who does
At the beginning of this week EK had 165 aircraft, a planned fleet of 280 aircraft by 2020 will be 115 additional aircraft, at 9 upgrades per aircraft that will be 1035 new Captains. There are 1600+ F/Os at Ek right now.
Then factor retirements & resignations although historically these come from both ends of the seniority list and are not often on age as EK has a young pilot group. To counter this assume a resurrection of Direct Entry Captains (DECs).
Many of the complainers on this board are the people who joined expecting an upgrade in 3-4 years and are still in the right seat at the far side of 5 years.
Then factor retirements & resignations although historically these come from both ends of the seniority list and are not often on age as EK has a young pilot group. To counter this assume a resurrection of Direct Entry Captains (DECs).
Many of the complainers on this board are the people who joined expecting an upgrade in 3-4 years and are still in the right seat at the far side of 5 years.
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Every command hour should be respected, IMHO. I don't work for EK, but think that, if needed, they might reconsider their opinion anytime.
Safe flights! Blue on top always.
Safe flights! Blue on top always.
