DXB Flow Control.
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DXB Flow Control.
Just a quick "Heads Up" as i`m sure you`ve all read your latest Notams.
In case you haven`t we are trying to stop AUH stealing all the slots before flow control even starts by getting you guys to give us your off blocks time as early as you can and then we`ll get you a slot.
It probably won`t make a lot of difference as we still have to get the slots from Abu Dhabi and i`m pretty sure they`ll block off times for there own traffic regardless if they are ready or not but at least we are now trying to play them at their own game so give us an accurate time and we`ll throw the dice!!
In case you haven`t we are trying to stop AUH stealing all the slots before flow control even starts by getting you guys to give us your off blocks time as early as you can and then we`ll get you a slot.
It probably won`t make a lot of difference as we still have to get the slots from Abu Dhabi and i`m pretty sure they`ll block off times for there own traffic regardless if they are ready or not but at least we are now trying to play them at their own game so give us an accurate time and we`ll throw the dice!!
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Thanks for your efforts on this TR, not wanting to rain on your parade, but an accurate off blocks estimate is a bit of an oxymoron, as we never know until the doors are closed. Every time we make a guess at that, some random spanner gets thrown in the works 
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Tower Ranger, three things:
1. UAE ACC flow DO NOT block slots for anybody. The flow is handled by the assistants who uses an automated program and they run it on a first come, first served basis. This program can not be manipulated.
2. I suggest you get of your chair in front of PPRuNe and speak to your management about this. No point in harping about it on a website when you can actually do something concrete about it by talking to the right people.
3. Now that you have mentioned your plan on an open forum the powers-that-be will be looking out for this.
There is no medication........
1. UAE ACC flow DO NOT block slots for anybody. The flow is handled by the assistants who uses an automated program and they run it on a first come, first served basis. This program can not be manipulated.
2. I suggest you get of your chair in front of PPRuNe and speak to your management about this. No point in harping about it on a website when you can actually do something concrete about it by talking to the right people.
3. Now that you have mentioned your plan on an open forum the powers-that-be will be looking out for this.
There is no medication........
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So BS are you saying that it is purely by chance that practically the first hour of slots every night is already gone as soon as flow control starts?
It is not my plan it is our new procedure and you`ll find it is already notamed in the same manner as the procedure for Abu Dhabi Tower has been for quite sometime, guess you don`t work in twr much.
It is not my plan it is our new procedure and you`ll find it is already notamed in the same manner as the procedure for Abu Dhabi Tower has been for quite sometime, guess you don`t work in twr much.
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Whether it's by chance, cheating from AUH or divine intervention is not the issue. You obviously feel strong enough about it to post on this here forum. So why not put pen to paper and write to your SATCO, let him contact ours and find a solution. But I guess like 99,9% of people on this forum you won't take it any further.
UAE ACC ATCOs tend not to work in the tower, but I guess you didn't know that.
UAE ACC ATCOs tend not to work in the tower, but I guess you didn't know that.
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where is the notam...PLEASE
Not at Apt for few days, and can not see it on gcaa website...
PLEASE PROVIDE DEFINITIVE NOTAM THAT STATES THAT DXB IS SLOT DRIVEN AIRPORT and not just occn departure regulation.
URL please.
glf
PLEASE PROVIDE DEFINITIVE NOTAM THAT STATES THAT DXB IS SLOT DRIVEN AIRPORT and not just occn departure regulation.
URL please.
glf
Last edited by Gulfstreamaviator; 1st Mar 2011 at 05:30. Reason: expansion of needs
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Bs, i`m not really sure if you are being deliberately dim for comic effect but DXB not getting slots for most of the first hour is the issue and one of the reasons that this procedure is being brought in.
Wouldn`t it be ironic if had come about because some people had put something in writing.
Wouldn`t it be ironic if had come about because some people had put something in writing.
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Maybe the AUH guys unplug the phone lead from DXB when flow control starts???
I can see some money to be made here selling slot$, like aircraft orders years ahead.
I can see some money to be made here selling slot$, like aircraft orders years ahead.
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Ok, let me fetch my crayons and draw a picture for those who are unfamiliar with this flow thing. I'll stick to individual points to make it easier.
1. Muscat ACC gets exceptionally busy during the EK/EY/QR departure rush to the east every night. Couple that with the fact that they share an FIR boundary with Mumbai (procedural), crappy equipment and lack of staff and things get messy.
2. For Muscat to regulate EK/EY/QR departure times involves diplomatic channels because three different sovereign states are involved.
3. Muscat takes the easiest option and regulate flow through TARDI/LABRI (deemed a common point) and LALDO by issuing a NOTAM regulating the flow through these points.
3. These points are on the FIR boundary between UAE and MCT FIRs. This automatically makes it the UAE ACC's problem, even though they don't have a dog in this fight.
4. To put "hold for release" on all DB/AA departures through these points and release them one-by-one to meet the Muscat flow requirements, will create in infinite amount of extra work and suck up manpower.
5. UAE ACC therefor created a flow system by which the respective towers call the ACC to obtain a departure slot for each acft that is regulated by the MCT NOTAM. They also wrote a small computer program to assist the ATCAs in doing this. Note ATCAs because the ATCOs, or supervisor, has neither the time nor the inclination to man this flow system.
6. Because of the nature of EK/EY business models they all want to depart at the same time. Exactly what the MCT NOTAM tries to curtail. The respective towers now feel aggrieved because the other tower is stealing its slots and start to devise cunning little plans to usurp one another.
7. In the middle of this sits the UAE ACC (still without a dog) and gets the flak from MCT, Dubai, Abu Dhabi, EK/EY et al because things are not flowing according to plan. Excuse the pun.
That about sums it up as short as I can make it.
Apologies for the VLP.
1. Muscat ACC gets exceptionally busy during the EK/EY/QR departure rush to the east every night. Couple that with the fact that they share an FIR boundary with Mumbai (procedural), crappy equipment and lack of staff and things get messy.
2. For Muscat to regulate EK/EY/QR departure times involves diplomatic channels because three different sovereign states are involved.
3. Muscat takes the easiest option and regulate flow through TARDI/LABRI (deemed a common point) and LALDO by issuing a NOTAM regulating the flow through these points.
3. These points are on the FIR boundary between UAE and MCT FIRs. This automatically makes it the UAE ACC's problem, even though they don't have a dog in this fight.
4. To put "hold for release" on all DB/AA departures through these points and release them one-by-one to meet the Muscat flow requirements, will create in infinite amount of extra work and suck up manpower.
5. UAE ACC therefor created a flow system by which the respective towers call the ACC to obtain a departure slot for each acft that is regulated by the MCT NOTAM. They also wrote a small computer program to assist the ATCAs in doing this. Note ATCAs because the ATCOs, or supervisor, has neither the time nor the inclination to man this flow system.
6. Because of the nature of EK/EY business models they all want to depart at the same time. Exactly what the MCT NOTAM tries to curtail. The respective towers now feel aggrieved because the other tower is stealing its slots and start to devise cunning little plans to usurp one another.
7. In the middle of this sits the UAE ACC (still without a dog) and gets the flak from MCT, Dubai, Abu Dhabi, EK/EY et al because things are not flowing according to plan. Excuse the pun.
That about sums it up as short as I can make it.
Apologies for the VLP.
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Nice explanation BlueSkye, but somehow it seems to be falling on deaf ears.
Tower Ranger, you can try and block slots for your precious aircraft ahead of time and you can accuse UH of doing the same but I can assure you that it cant happen. You wont be given a slot until about 15mins before the slot allocation period starts. It only affects TARDI/LABRI.
As has been said, go through the proper channels and things might be improved.
Tower Ranger, you can try and block slots for your precious aircraft ahead of time and you can accuse UH of doing the same but I can assure you that it cant happen. You wont be given a slot until about 15mins before the slot allocation period starts. It only affects TARDI/LABRI.
As has been said, go through the proper channels and things might be improved.
