EK - EFB class II what ya think?
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EK - EFB class II what ya think?
what do you think of our new EFB class II?
I think it is not an improvement at all...
It"s a heads down machine and so when you are in a hurry, it takes too long to find stuff...
It happened to me 5 times, that the touchscreen froze....
What's your experience?
Do you like it or not?
I think it is not an improvement at all...
It"s a heads down machine and so when you are in a hurry, it takes too long to find stuff...
It happened to me 5 times, that the touchscreen froze....
What's your experience?
Do you like it or not?
short flights long nights
I hope it will improve in time..meanwhile give me a book
With a link to the FMS to give real-time position, the e-route manual will be quite good.
They MUST improve the interface with the other manuals, though, or leave us te paper- no way the C2 as it is could be considered a realistic in-flight reference for company documents.
Not convinced the whole thing couldn't be done better and cheaper by just buying every pilot an iPad, though!!
They MUST improve the interface with the other manuals, though, or leave us te paper- no way the C2 as it is could be considered a realistic in-flight reference for company documents.
Not convinced the whole thing couldn't be done better and cheaper by just buying every pilot an iPad, though!!
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I thought the comment made the other day on one of my flights brilliantly described the nonsence over these mickey mouse EFBs.
The guy I flew with likened them to a person going in and purchasing a top of the range Mercedes and then taking the car to his local garage and getting them to remove the engine and replace it with a Toyota Corolla engine because he'd been told it might be cheaper to run!
If we have an accident or serious incident and these units are even remotely involved, bet your bottom dollar Boeing will wipe their hands of any liability.
The guy I flew with likened them to a person going in and purchasing a top of the range Mercedes and then taking the car to his local garage and getting them to remove the engine and replace it with a Toyota Corolla engine because he'd been told it might be cheaper to run!
If we have an accident or serious incident and these units are even remotely involved, bet your bottom dollar Boeing will wipe their hands of any liability.
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Oh.....
And there was me thinking that we're discussing the 'Bus
Originally Posted by kiwi
bet your bottom dollar Boeing will wipe their hands of any liability.
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I don't pay a lot of attention to the updates on this EFB but I gather these devices are intended for functionality with the Lido documentation.
Lido - the cheap alternative to Jeppesen, which is the documentation of choice of airlines which don't operate with a "Lowest Bidder" mentality.
So they pull out the built-in devices and replace them with these ridiculous laptops which they install in a homemade steel box, where the documents case would normally be. But you still need the documents because years later, this device isn't finished yet. Unfortunately, the documents are now located in the coat closet - handy.
All this to save a few bucks but I bet it's cost them more than that with this silly process. And of course it's the user (you) who suffers.
Other airlines use the proper kit which does everything you need but in this cheap outfit, we get a laptop connected to a cheap screen/interface and a two-page FCI to explain how to switch it on and off.
Anything to save some money. ANYTHING.
Can you imagine what life would be like if Emirates weren't making billions?
Remember when they replaced those oh-so-expensive Jeppesen cases with those stupid homemade bags they had stitched together down at Lobos in Satwa? Just to save a few fils... jesus christ.
Whose idea was this so-called EFB? And what sort of bonus did he claim for it?
The proper gear would be even better. But hey, so would proper f-ing crew rest facilities.
Lido - the cheap alternative to Jeppesen, which is the documentation of choice of airlines which don't operate with a "Lowest Bidder" mentality.
So they pull out the built-in devices and replace them with these ridiculous laptops which they install in a homemade steel box, where the documents case would normally be. But you still need the documents because years later, this device isn't finished yet. Unfortunately, the documents are now located in the coat closet - handy.
All this to save a few bucks but I bet it's cost them more than that with this silly process. And of course it's the user (you) who suffers.
Other airlines use the proper kit which does everything you need but in this cheap outfit, we get a laptop connected to a cheap screen/interface and a two-page FCI to explain how to switch it on and off.
Anything to save some money. ANYTHING.
Can you imagine what life would be like if Emirates weren't making billions?
Remember when they replaced those oh-so-expensive Jeppesen cases with those stupid homemade bags they had stitched together down at Lobos in Satwa? Just to save a few fils... jesus christ.
Whose idea was this so-called EFB? And what sort of bonus did he claim for it?
With a link to the FMS to give real-time position, the e-route manual will be quite good.
Last edited by Sataybox; 10th Oct 2010 at 20:07.
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EFB class II
- Laptop confined in an aluminum frame that is four times too big and takes away scarce space in the cockpit (with 4 crew there's not enough space for bags).
- Laptop with a processor speed that would make a Commodere 64 proud, but must blush in front of a three year old smartphone.
- Laptop with a touchscreen interface that is as responsive as an Etisalat frontdesk local employee.
- Laptop with a touchscreen interface that is illegible after several fingerings, due to grease residue.
- Laptop that (for the moment) does not interact with the aircraft, datalink and very badly with the pilot.
- Laptop with PDF capability, but no bookmarks.
- Laptop that hangs up faster than a Vista/virus infected cheap Microsoft BS.
Any 999AED netbook (or IPad) is more stable, faster, more legible and a lot smalle AND CHEAPER.
EK would have kept Jeps, given every pilot his notebook and simply made an interface to update at the EGHQ, they would have saved millions and had a system that actually worked and was uniform and usable for us (because it would be usable at home and down the road).
But wait, isn't that what Etihad has? Now we understand why it will never happen at EK.
Be prepared to work with a system compatible with their middle aged attitude.
I am mad because it could be implemented so fast, with such an improvement impact, and even cheaper. Go figure ....
- Laptop confined in an aluminum frame that is four times too big and takes away scarce space in the cockpit (with 4 crew there's not enough space for bags).
- Laptop with a processor speed that would make a Commodere 64 proud, but must blush in front of a three year old smartphone.
- Laptop with a touchscreen interface that is as responsive as an Etisalat frontdesk local employee.
- Laptop with a touchscreen interface that is illegible after several fingerings, due to grease residue.
- Laptop that (for the moment) does not interact with the aircraft, datalink and very badly with the pilot.
- Laptop with PDF capability, but no bookmarks.
- Laptop that hangs up faster than a Vista/virus infected cheap Microsoft BS.
Any 999AED netbook (or IPad) is more stable, faster, more legible and a lot smalle AND CHEAPER.
EK would have kept Jeps, given every pilot his notebook and simply made an interface to update at the EGHQ, they would have saved millions and had a system that actually worked and was uniform and usable for us (because it would be usable at home and down the road).
But wait, isn't that what Etihad has? Now we understand why it will never happen at EK.
Be prepared to work with a system compatible with their middle aged attitude.
I am mad because it could be implemented so fast, with such an improvement impact, and even cheaper. Go figure ....
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If you look at what is avbl on the market and what we are using it way far behind. They pay millions for hi-tech aircraft and put paraffin driven computers to use, does not make sense.
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I doubt very much indeed that Mr Jobs will be spending the $$millions to have the iPAD hardware certified for use as an EFB. Further more, doesn't Type-C software have to run on a LINUX partition? I believe so and thus I doubt, again, that Apple would allow partitioning of this device in that manner.
No matter how great the iPAD is for personal use and will be in some public domains (kiosks etc.) I'll bet my 'bottom dollar' that you will never see a Class-II EFB solution using the iPAD.
Class-I is a possibility and of course with only Type-A software!
No matter how great the iPAD is for personal use and will be in some public domains (kiosks etc.) I'll bet my 'bottom dollar' that you will never see a Class-II EFB solution using the iPAD.
Class-I is a possibility and of course with only Type-A software!
Icarus,
The EFBs being discussed are approved, installed, Class2 devices, and they run on a Windows XP platform.
So, thankyou for you input- though it happens to be incorrect.
The EFBs being discussed are approved, installed, Class2 devices, and they run on a Windows XP platform.
So, thankyou for you input- though it happens to be incorrect.
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Its a poorly thoughtout, poorly implemented, and poorly designed bodge job.
My previous beast had two independant Class 3 EFB's retrospectively installed, totally intergrated, even to the point where you could nominate (based on your own set of parameters) suitable divert airfields..and the thing would give you a visual display and vertical profile with the push of 1 button. Of course it did have its downside...they cost 10K per unit..and ran on a windows XP platform.
Oh for some common sense
My previous beast had two independant Class 3 EFB's retrospectively installed, totally intergrated, even to the point where you could nominate (based on your own set of parameters) suitable divert airfields..and the thing would give you a visual display and vertical profile with the push of 1 button. Of course it did have its downside...they cost 10K per unit..and ran on a windows XP platform.
Oh for some common sense
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Wizofoz - I would be very interested know where you believe my remarks are 'incorrect'. My post was directed at those who seem to think an iPad may be a good answer - I sought to open some eyes in that area.
The iPad would have to be certified if used as a class-ii EFB as any other piece of kit used as class- ii; that certification process is very expensive! However as class I does not require certification you could use an iPad as an EFB in that manner assuming you could get relevant software.
Furthermore there are software restrictions on class two, some of which entail the use of a Linux OS partition.
You may have installed certified hardware running WINXP - i don't know where i contested that?
The iPad would have to be certified if used as a class-ii EFB as any other piece of kit used as class- ii; that certification process is very expensive! However as class I does not require certification you could use an iPad as an EFB in that manner assuming you could get relevant software.
Furthermore there are software restrictions on class two, some of which entail the use of a Linux OS partition.
You may have installed certified hardware running WINXP - i don't know where i contested that?
Icarus
Becaus, AFAIK (and appologies insue if I'm wrong) we have classIIs that do NOT have a Linux OS partition.
Besides, I'd rather have an iPad running as a ClassI than what we've got as a Class II.
Becaus, AFAIK (and appologies insue if I'm wrong) we have classIIs that do NOT have a Linux OS partition.
Besides, I'd rather have an iPad running as a ClassI than what we've got as a Class II.
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And with the recent UPS crash having been rumoured that the source of fire was lithiumion batteries......we have batteries being charged almost 24 hours a day. How long before a cockpit fire with one of these toys.
Secondly if they get wrapped around the flag pole about going heads down with the CDU, how does that reconcile with massive heads time with this toy.
Thirdly, us complaining here will do NOTHING about this toy. ASR, CSR, VR......send them in no matter how trivial. Send in the critique form that comes in some of the briefing packages.
If it's working on the 380, it's because it is fully integrated, I believe, not an add on. So far, this does nothing, IMHO, to enhance any aspect of the Boeing operation.
Secondly if they get wrapped around the flag pole about going heads down with the CDU, how does that reconcile with massive heads time with this toy.
Thirdly, us complaining here will do NOTHING about this toy. ASR, CSR, VR......send them in no matter how trivial. Send in the critique form that comes in some of the briefing packages.
If it's working on the 380, it's because it is fully integrated, I believe, not an add on. So far, this does nothing, IMHO, to enhance any aspect of the Boeing operation.
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A380/ Class 3
A380 Driver
Are the EFB's on the 380 class 2? I could be wrong but I thought they are Class 3 EFB's.
We have integrated (Moving Map) class 3 on some of the 200LR's (5 I think) and they work well.
Agreed the Class 2 (Boeing) is a cheap option and not really fit for purpose.
Are the EFB's on the 380 class 2? I could be wrong but I thought they are Class 3 EFB's.
We have integrated (Moving Map) class 3 on some of the 200LR's (5 I think) and they work well.
Agreed the Class 2 (Boeing) is a cheap option and not really fit for purpose.
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I have used the Class 2 a few times and think it is nasty. Too much time required to get it to work let alone show usefull info.
Try using it in tubulence and see if you can make sense of it!
My vote is get rid of iy before it causes an incident.
Try using it in tubulence and see if you can make sense of it!
My vote is get rid of iy before it causes an incident.
When the current crew portal was launched, they decided to fill the home page with our illustrious leaders mug shots along with their "achievements"
AAR, being the first one on the list, was awarded "the big gong" for introducing EFB's to Emirates. Initially Class I, then Class III and now the EKIT centric Class II.
What an achievement. If my PPC's were as successful as the EFB introduction on the Boeing, l would be getting straight 1's or may be the odd 2!
halas
AAR, being the first one on the list, was awarded "the big gong" for introducing EFB's to Emirates. Initially Class I, then Class III and now the EKIT centric Class II.
What an achievement. If my PPC's were as successful as the EFB introduction on the Boeing, l would be getting straight 1's or may be the odd 2!
halas