Can EPIs promises be kept?
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Can EPIs promises be kept?
With yet another message from EPI in our private company emails, and leaflets regularly blocking up our FCs, I wonder publicly whether EPI are in for a very rough time. And why such privileged access our personal company data?
Adverts for 60% still appear but I hear not many new takers willing to part with $50K+ for the ride.
If there is a serious reduction in new investors and with property in Dubai and the rest of the world on the way south, what can their model be based on when no one else seems to have one?
Adverts for 60% still appear but I hear not many new takers willing to part with $50K+ for the ride.
If there is a serious reduction in new investors and with property in Dubai and the rest of the world on the way south, what can their model be based on when no one else seems to have one?
Last edited by Marooned; 24th Nov 2008 at 12:37.
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I agree with you Marooned, EPI will not be able to achieve it's goals in the next round of offers. But in their defence, they never promised anything. I believe the operative word was ''Projected'' returns. There never was a guarantee even though many people viewed it as such, due to EPI's past successes.
Huge interest in the last offerings, and basically zero interest in the latest. That says alot.
Huge interest in the last offerings, and basically zero interest in the latest. That says alot.
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Firstly, I ned to say I'm not an investor (or director or employee) of EPI, so hopefully, my comments to follow could be said to be disinterested (in the real meaning of the word).
So tell me, ruserious, are you as offended drinking and eating the free booze and nibblies (to say nothing of the free venue) that EPI supplys for the EPC STARS/SIDS nights?
So tell me, ruserious, are you as offended drinking and eating the free booze and nibblies (to say nothing of the free venue) that EPI supplys for the EPC STARS/SIDS nights?
Well said Wiley!. If they make an effort to organise and FINANCE such events, then they deserve their airtime! If you have a problem with this then the solution is simple, DON'T GO. All sponsors publicise, that is the point of sponsorship.
Last edited by clear to land; 26th Nov 2008 at 02:52. Reason: No I am not an EPI member.
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Marooned, a few months back you predicted the bubble bursting in Dubai. I was not in total agreement with you at the time, but I must admit, you were spot on.
It remains to be seen how bad things will get here. But I still believe Dubai is the place to be... provided you did not get caught up in the property hype and are still holding investment property. In other words, if a person has not over-extended himself, has little or no debt, then this financial tsunami might in fact be a benefit in the long term.
I suspect you are correct about EPI too. It's a shame though, because I think it is one of the only reputable and well run property investment companies in Dubai. I hope they can ride out the storm and provide some returns for their investors.
It remains to be seen how bad things will get here. But I still believe Dubai is the place to be... provided you did not get caught up in the property hype and are still holding investment property. In other words, if a person has not over-extended himself, has little or no debt, then this financial tsunami might in fact be a benefit in the long term.
I suspect you are correct about EPI too. It's a shame though, because I think it is one of the only reputable and well run property investment companies in Dubai. I hope they can ride out the storm and provide some returns for their investors.
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So tell me, ruserious, are you as offended drinking and eating the free booze and nibblies (to say nothing of the free venue) that EPI supplys for the EPC STARS/SIDS nights?
Well said Wiley!. If they make an effort to organise and FINANCE such events, then they deserve their airtime! If you have a problem with this then the solution is simple, DON'T GO. All sponsors publicise, that is the point of sponsorship.
My problem is that the EPC is by default supporting and advocating EPI's financial services, if it goes tits up, then there is a good case for litigation against the EPC. Not to mention BC's position in the EPC hierarchy, conflict of interest, noooo way.
So be happy, have your free lunches and I will avoid as usual.
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checcker10
When you go on holiday do you also go to the free booze and food evenings given by Timeshare Salesmen? Nothing is free my friend. EPI like the timeshare salesmen entice you with a free evening so they can ram their product down your throat. I too am fed up with the EPI involvement in our club.
I think we should also be concerned that they bought the company that managed the Pilots Club. EPI efectivly manages the EPC and have access to the member database - hence all the spam.
Time to set up the independant DUBAI PILOTS CLUB
When you go on holiday do you also go to the free booze and food evenings given by Timeshare Salesmen? Nothing is free my friend. EPI like the timeshare salesmen entice you with a free evening so they can ram their product down your throat. I too am fed up with the EPI involvement in our club.
I think we should also be concerned that they bought the company that managed the Pilots Club. EPI efectivly manages the EPC and have access to the member database - hence all the spam.
Time to set up the independant DUBAI PILOTS CLUB
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EPI Info
Before all you posters get carried away and start badmouthing EPI and what it can or can not do, you should get your facts straight.
Most if not all real estate companies in Dubai are heavily leveraged and are getting caught up in this credit freeze.
EPI has over 50 million dollars in cash and are now sitting back waiting for the other shoe to drop and will be picking up prime commercial real estate for heavy discounts in Dubai and Abu Dhabi.
Throw in long term renters and you have the makings for a profitable venture.
Give the EPI boys some credit first.
Just my opinion,
H
Most if not all real estate companies in Dubai are heavily leveraged and are getting caught up in this credit freeze.
EPI has over 50 million dollars in cash and are now sitting back waiting for the other shoe to drop and will be picking up prime commercial real estate for heavy discounts in Dubai and Abu Dhabi.
Throw in long term renters and you have the makings for a profitable venture.
Give the EPI boys some credit first.
Just my opinion,
H
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I agree with the above comments regarding the cash pile but as an investor I am starting to have issues with the endless sponsorships etc etc which are essentially draining the pool (boats,schools, EPC etc etc). It is not for me to say how to run their business and I sincerely hope that the summers offering produces a return however it gives me cause for concern. I wonder, since property has not actually been bought, whether there is an out. Doubt it some how. Hard to see why anyone would risk it on the latest offerings. (hint - buy gold instead - check the front page of the Daily Telegraph today)
I suspect some questions will be asked at the next "äppreciate evening"
I also have some issues with the EPC group email. For me its crossing the line a bit. I'm okay with advertising on the web page, okay with sids and stars (i don't have to go if I don't like it) but I kinda feel that my personal email address is off limits or at least I should be able to choose. Now I know we all ge a lot of spam but this is a bit different and I dont remember agreeing to this when I joined EPC. Maybe I forgot and there was a box I ticked. Anyone else feel the same way?
I suspect some questions will be asked at the next "äppreciate evening"
I also have some issues with the EPC group email. For me its crossing the line a bit. I'm okay with advertising on the web page, okay with sids and stars (i don't have to go if I don't like it) but I kinda feel that my personal email address is off limits or at least I should be able to choose. Now I know we all ge a lot of spam but this is a bit different and I dont remember agreeing to this when I joined EPC. Maybe I forgot and there was a box I ticked. Anyone else feel the same way?
Last edited by wizard1; 27th Nov 2008 at 05:08.
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Not badmouthing just posting some concerns about what I believe are exaggerated returns in a very unpredictable market based on our hard earned cash.
Have they actually got $50 million in cash waiting to invest? This is the right time to look very, very carefully at the finances and not the assurances and slick marketing packages presented after you had a few of the 'free' drinks.
If and when we can be certain that all the money is there where will you get a 60% return in 3 years? Even discounted property will have to have realistic values and it will be no where near this figure. The market has slumped and almost stopped... so you buy at a discount and then what?
Any investments have to be viewed in the longer term, greater than 3 years. It takes nearly 2 years to get into recession and 6-8 years to get out.
Have they actually got $50 million in cash waiting to invest? This is the right time to look very, very carefully at the finances and not the assurances and slick marketing packages presented after you had a few of the 'free' drinks.
If and when we can be certain that all the money is there where will you get a 60% return in 3 years? Even discounted property will have to have realistic values and it will be no where near this figure. The market has slumped and almost stopped... so you buy at a discount and then what?
Any investments have to be viewed in the longer term, greater than 3 years. It takes nearly 2 years to get into recession and 6-8 years to get out.
Marooned
Couldn't agree more.
Just to play devils advocate...
What if property is bought at discount prices, and then the discounting continues and then some?
With the retraction of business activity, what's to say the import of expats dries up (or indeed goes into export) and there are not that many "long-term" renters, or not willing to pay the requested level of rent?
I am aware that EPI invest in many regions other than Dubai. But every region in the world is going to feel the full force of what is the "Katrina" of finances.
And now Dubai Inc. is disclosing that it's debt is greater than a 140% of GDP.
That is a lot of levereging!
This also happens to expose the real values of what has been a speculative driven property market. No wonder the big develepers are uniting to bunker-down.
Another problem that l have noticed for quite a few years now, is that this market, in Dubai, does not like second hand products. That includes real estate.
Think about it.
halas
Just to play devils advocate...
What if property is bought at discount prices, and then the discounting continues and then some?
With the retraction of business activity, what's to say the import of expats dries up (or indeed goes into export) and there are not that many "long-term" renters, or not willing to pay the requested level of rent?
I am aware that EPI invest in many regions other than Dubai. But every region in the world is going to feel the full force of what is the "Katrina" of finances.
And now Dubai Inc. is disclosing that it's debt is greater than a 140% of GDP.
That is a lot of levereging!
This also happens to expose the real values of what has been a speculative driven property market. No wonder the big develepers are uniting to bunker-down.
Another problem that l have noticed for quite a few years now, is that this market, in Dubai, does not like second hand products. That includes real estate.
Think about it.
halas
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Out of al the investment groups EPI have to be the most stable.
I feel sorry for the chaps who went into the deal that guaranteed 30% in six months, and gave you a post dated cheque. My guess is that that cheque will bounce higher than you will when you find out that there's nothing there!!
We wait until Feb to see what happens - how can any business guarantee 30% in six months. When it's too good to be true, it normally is!!
I feel sorry for the chaps who went into the deal that guaranteed 30% in six months, and gave you a post dated cheque. My guess is that that cheque will bounce higher than you will when you find out that there's nothing there!!
We wait until Feb to see what happens - how can any business guarantee 30% in six months. When it's too good to be true, it normally is!!
Marooned, Sad to say but you are totally correct. It is going to take a long time to exit this downturn. It may turn out to be the worst ever in history. Investing in anything at present is very very risky.
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The immature rhetoric of this forum remains questionable. This post is not intended to applaud nor impugn EPI, but question your ethics.
1. You castigate people and organizations whether it’s appropriate or not?
2. The oratory is at best childish, at worst insulting and defamatory.
3. Did anyone post that EPI has provided significant donations to the Families of Pilots who were killed in tragic accidents or other charitable donations such as the Cancer Society to name a few?
4. You questions EPI’s ability to return even a modicum of return in spite of past performance. Do you challenge the Managers of your Provident Fund who have barely performed even in buoyant markets? And this is from International multi-billion dollar Fund Managers? Maybe EPI should have a Fund available within the EK Provident Fund. I would suggest EPI couldn’t do any worse than what has been witnessed to date!
5. You complain about Flyers in your Mailbox. Many companies promote via Direct Mail. It’s hardly worth getting distressed about?
6. You complain about Free Food and Booze at a function hosted by EPI for both joining and leaving crew. Man get a life!! You should be proud that EPI has gone to the trouble to host SIDS and STARS Events. I don’t see EK lining up to support the Pilot Community through the EPC?
7. Do you question the unrealistic promises of guaranteed high returns via post dated cheques?
8. The list goes on!
Your general psyche is without a doubt the most superfluous of any professional community. You wonder why you’re consistently challenged by Airline Management?!
1. You castigate people and organizations whether it’s appropriate or not?
2. The oratory is at best childish, at worst insulting and defamatory.
3. Did anyone post that EPI has provided significant donations to the Families of Pilots who were killed in tragic accidents or other charitable donations such as the Cancer Society to name a few?
4. You questions EPI’s ability to return even a modicum of return in spite of past performance. Do you challenge the Managers of your Provident Fund who have barely performed even in buoyant markets? And this is from International multi-billion dollar Fund Managers? Maybe EPI should have a Fund available within the EK Provident Fund. I would suggest EPI couldn’t do any worse than what has been witnessed to date!
5. You complain about Flyers in your Mailbox. Many companies promote via Direct Mail. It’s hardly worth getting distressed about?
6. You complain about Free Food and Booze at a function hosted by EPI for both joining and leaving crew. Man get a life!! You should be proud that EPI has gone to the trouble to host SIDS and STARS Events. I don’t see EK lining up to support the Pilot Community through the EPC?
7. Do you question the unrealistic promises of guaranteed high returns via post dated cheques?
8. The list goes on!
Your general psyche is without a doubt the most superfluous of any professional community. You wonder why you’re consistently challenged by Airline Management?!