ATPL....??
Thread Starter
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 9
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From: Sydney
ATPL....??
Hey
I am an aspiring pilot. I'll be going off to Australia in a month to train for my CPL.
I already have a Bachelors Degree in Aerospace technology, but since I'm a girl (Indian girl) I may have to stop flying someday so I will always have something to fall back into. Say a job in engineering or so.
And now for my questions?
1. After I get my CPL, how do I proceed?? How do I work towards my ATPL??
2. Most airlines need a type rating say Air Arabia needs at least 800 hrs on A320, so how do I work towards the type rating? Most airlines have some requirements when it comes to flying hours, how do I get those hours if no one hires me? (I know this question sounds odd/stupid but I can't help it I would appreciate if all my questions are answered)
3. Any ideas/helpful pointers on the flying scene in India?
I'll have more questions for sure, will post them as and when I remember them
Please help me. Any kind of information will be highly appreciated..!!
Thanks
I am an aspiring pilot. I'll be going off to Australia in a month to train for my CPL.
I already have a Bachelors Degree in Aerospace technology, but since I'm a girl (Indian girl) I may have to stop flying someday so I will always have something to fall back into. Say a job in engineering or so.
And now for my questions?
1. After I get my CPL, how do I proceed?? How do I work towards my ATPL??
2. Most airlines need a type rating say Air Arabia needs at least 800 hrs on A320, so how do I work towards the type rating? Most airlines have some requirements when it comes to flying hours, how do I get those hours if no one hires me? (I know this question sounds odd/stupid but I can't help it I would appreciate if all my questions are answered)
3. Any ideas/helpful pointers on the flying scene in India?
I'll have more questions for sure, will post them as and when I remember them
Please help me. Any kind of information will be highly appreciated..!!
Thanks
Last edited by sarahvd88; 22nd September 2008 at 17:46. Reason: Bad grammar and spellings
Joined: Mar 1999
Posts: 1,692
Likes: 3
From: Domaine de la Romanee-Conti
By the time you get halfway through flying school, you will have figured out the answers to most of your questions.
At the moment, the most likely scenario is that you will have to find your first flying job outside the M.E. and build up several thousand hours of airline time before you apply to any arabia based airlines. Unless you hold a GCC passport then it's almost impossible to walk out of flying school and into any kind of piloting employment over here.
Hopefully by the time you have completed your licence training, you will have also graduated off txt spk and learned to speak and write english like a professionally qualified adult. You'll be up against quite enough challenges as a minimum hours female pilot looking for a job in the middle east, you really don't want to present yourself as someone who has issues with basic illiteracy and maturity.
At the moment, the most likely scenario is that you will have to find your first flying job outside the M.E. and build up several thousand hours of airline time before you apply to any arabia based airlines. Unless you hold a GCC passport then it's almost impossible to walk out of flying school and into any kind of piloting employment over here.
Hopefully by the time you have completed your licence training, you will have also graduated off txt spk and learned to speak and write english like a professionally qualified adult. You'll be up against quite enough challenges as a minimum hours female pilot looking for a job in the middle east, you really don't want to present yourself as someone who has issues with basic illiteracy and maturity.
Thread Starter
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 9
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From: Sydney
Sorry
Ok I have edited the first post, a lot. I apologise for the language (intense use of IM's I mean) used earlier. I still have to get over the fact that I am not in college anymore and that I am a part of a professional forum. I am so sorry.
Last edited by sarahvd88; 22nd September 2008 at 18:02.
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 25
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From: tama
It is always best to write as concisely and accurately as possible to convey what you want to say, but honestly, there is no reason for people to get worked up about diction and phraseology on a website. I read your post before it was edited, and I do not believe that it elicited the responses that you first received.
I too am a female pilot, have been one for the last 16 years. I have no plans to quit flying, even though US airlines seem to have other plans to not keep us pilots around. Normally, no one has to "quit flying" until they are 65, these days.
If no one hires you, have you ever considered the military? With your degree you could go in as an officer. I received all my initial and intermediate training that way, and it looks good on a resume. You also earn a decent paycheck and there are many other benefits.
You could also look into being an air traffic controller, they seem to be in short supply and never in need of a job.
Think long and hard about your desires and realize that aviation is not a path to riches. It is rife with disappointments and setbacks. Aviation seems to be the only field where you actually go backwards when you advance. You work for many years with one company, to get experience, then move onto another and start at the very bottom of the seniority list (usually on a probationary payscale for a year). Due to no fault of your own, you become furloughed and have to start over again.
But, with a lot of luck you might be hired at the right airline at the right time and your career is set....alas, this is rarely the case these days.
Good luck!
I too am a female pilot, have been one for the last 16 years. I have no plans to quit flying, even though US airlines seem to have other plans to not keep us pilots around. Normally, no one has to "quit flying" until they are 65, these days.
If no one hires you, have you ever considered the military? With your degree you could go in as an officer. I received all my initial and intermediate training that way, and it looks good on a resume. You also earn a decent paycheck and there are many other benefits.
You could also look into being an air traffic controller, they seem to be in short supply and never in need of a job.
Think long and hard about your desires and realize that aviation is not a path to riches. It is rife with disappointments and setbacks. Aviation seems to be the only field where you actually go backwards when you advance. You work for many years with one company, to get experience, then move onto another and start at the very bottom of the seniority list (usually on a probationary payscale for a year). Due to no fault of your own, you become furloughed and have to start over again.
But, with a lot of luck you might be hired at the right airline at the right time and your career is set....alas, this is rarely the case these days.
Good luck!
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 19
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From: Earth
I too am a female pilot, have been one for the last 16 years.
...I'm sorry i couldn't resist...Back on topic, I would call around to all the companies within your country of residence (being India im guessing) and check what they require in terms of qualifications, licenses and ratings, and medical, to hold a license you don't need to be a certain height but for safety reasons you wont see shorter then 5 ft pilots around.. because the flight decks are usually designed for a minimum height of 160cm.. check these things so that you are covered and dont get the reality check when it comes time to look for a job.. Its a good thing that you already hold an academic degree, that's always a bonus and something to fall back on, If you can't get a job in your home country don't expect it to be easier anywhere else.. Forget Europe if you dont hold a European passport of some sort and a JAR license, Forget the Middle east unless you have either a GCC passport of a couple of 1000 hours on an airliner...
.
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 242
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From: here and there
Indian scene
Hi sarah..
first off , if you're considering the CPL requirements/job prospects etc. for Indian companies, the best place to post is the South Asian forum.
Currently we're going through some tough times here in India as airlines are planning to layoff , send aircraft back etc. etc. However, many are optimistic that things will change for the better after a few years.
Post your queries out there(South Asian Forum) and see what they have to say.All the best.
masalama.
first off , if you're considering the CPL requirements/job prospects etc. for Indian companies, the best place to post is the South Asian forum.
Currently we're going through some tough times here in India as airlines are planning to layoff , send aircraft back etc. etc. However, many are optimistic that things will change for the better after a few years.
Post your queries out there(South Asian Forum) and see what they have to say.All the best.
masalama.
Thread Starter
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 9
Likes: 0
From: Sydney
One more question
Hey.. thanks all... All that advise was great. Things don't seem to look bright, but hey who knows you never know what can happen. Might just get lucky and if not I know engineering still waits for me.
Another question..
How helpful is it if I enroll myself into a some place where I get a frozen ATPL..? Will that help in anyway..??
Another question..
How helpful is it if I enroll myself into a some place where I get a frozen ATPL..? Will that help in anyway..??
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 84
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From: sandpit
frozen ATPL?
I am not familiar with the regulations in Australia, only know JAA and FAA and GCAA.
But a frozen ATPL is just that you completed the theoretical part for the ATPL, you still need the required hours for the ATPL (1.500 hrs for the FAA, 1.500 with 500 multicrew and a JAR/FAR 25 typerating on your licence for the JAA)
If you are talking about a JAA licence, I would say it is a waste of money, unless you want to fly in Europe, almost everywhere else in the world the FAA ticket is acceptable to be converted to the local CAA and JAA ticket is very expensive.
If you are focusing on the UAE market: you don't need a couple of thousand hours to find a job here, 500TT and 300 multi engine will be sufficent, as an australien CPL will be!
Good luck!
But a frozen ATPL is just that you completed the theoretical part for the ATPL, you still need the required hours for the ATPL (1.500 hrs for the FAA, 1.500 with 500 multicrew and a JAR/FAR 25 typerating on your licence for the JAA)
If you are talking about a JAA licence, I would say it is a waste of money, unless you want to fly in Europe, almost everywhere else in the world the FAA ticket is acceptable to be converted to the local CAA and JAA ticket is very expensive.
If you are focusing on the UAE market: you don't need a couple of thousand hours to find a job here, 500TT and 300 multi engine will be sufficent, as an australien CPL will be!
Good luck!
Thread Starter
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 9
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From: Sydney
I know that a frozen ATPL is just that the theory part is done.. But will it help in anyway, as in, will it help move up faster..
I remember once someone telling me that its a struggle to gather up the hours(which i agree), and one way of doing it is like working for small time tour companies (flying tours) or probably a farm where they use planes to water/spray pesticides on the crops.. you'll agree..??
But when you gather up hours, does it have to be on a multi-engined aircraft..??
I remember once someone telling me that its a struggle to gather up the hours(which i agree), and one way of doing it is like working for small time tour companies (flying tours) or probably a farm where they use planes to water/spray pesticides on the crops.. you'll agree..??
But when you gather up hours, does it have to be on a multi-engined aircraft..??
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 84
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From: sandpit
To my knowledge there are only 4 options to get into aviation in the UAE if you are not UAE national:
1. Do your instructor rating and find a job witch one of the flying schools to gain some hours. Horizon in Al Ain pay pretty good, there is as well Emirates Flight Training in Dubai. No Idea what they look for, if you need experience as instructor to get in there.
2. Falcon Express Cargo Airlines, Beech 1900 nightflying in the GCC. They have already 2 female pilots. Requirement is 500TT and 300 multi and a Beech 1900 type. The 1900 type you can get for 8.000 USD. It's easier to get in if you know someone there. They dont care if you have a frozen ATPL, but they dont like the JAA frozen only, because you can not unfreeze without having a JAR/FAR 25 aircraft type on your licence. For command upgrade you need ATPL. So with just having a FAA or Australien CPL you will be fine, you can get your ATPL once you reach the required hours.
3. Aerovista and Phoenix Aviation (AVE) seem to take on guys with just 250 hrsTT (at least I know one who was taken), they will give you a job if you pay for your rating on the 737-200, cost around 13.000 USD
4. AlRais Aircargo with the 727 offered me a job a few years back when I had not that many hours, again pay for your rating which was 23.000 USD (ridiculous)
If you want to build up hours just in the region (BAH based) Solenta might be an option, operating Beech 1900 for DHL.
But to my knowledge, none of them cares if you have a frozen ATPL. Having an ATPL will be a must, when you move on to companies who would not hire you anyway with low hours.
Cheers
1. Do your instructor rating and find a job witch one of the flying schools to gain some hours. Horizon in Al Ain pay pretty good, there is as well Emirates Flight Training in Dubai. No Idea what they look for, if you need experience as instructor to get in there.
2. Falcon Express Cargo Airlines, Beech 1900 nightflying in the GCC. They have already 2 female pilots. Requirement is 500TT and 300 multi and a Beech 1900 type. The 1900 type you can get for 8.000 USD. It's easier to get in if you know someone there. They dont care if you have a frozen ATPL, but they dont like the JAA frozen only, because you can not unfreeze without having a JAR/FAR 25 aircraft type on your licence. For command upgrade you need ATPL. So with just having a FAA or Australien CPL you will be fine, you can get your ATPL once you reach the required hours.
3. Aerovista and Phoenix Aviation (AVE) seem to take on guys with just 250 hrsTT (at least I know one who was taken), they will give you a job if you pay for your rating on the 737-200, cost around 13.000 USD
4. AlRais Aircargo with the 727 offered me a job a few years back when I had not that many hours, again pay for your rating which was 23.000 USD (ridiculous)
If you want to build up hours just in the region (BAH based) Solenta might be an option, operating Beech 1900 for DHL.
But to my knowledge, none of them cares if you have a frozen ATPL. Having an ATPL will be a must, when you move on to companies who would not hire you anyway with low hours.
Cheers
Last edited by sharksucker; 24th September 2008 at 12:48. Reason: fingertrouble..
