EK Airbus DECs
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EK Airbus DECs
Austraillan friend of mine who is doing his upgrade before the stops come said that Emirates has hired 12 Airbus DECs. Can anyone confirm this? If this is so this is another outrageous item that our beloved company has thrust upon us. FOs are waiting over 4 years and 5 months while our Boeing counter parts are upgrading right at 3 years and now we have to put up with this nonsense. Why hire DECs at all? We do not need them and they are a big pain in the arse. Plus do the Airbus FOs have to wait any longer.
Anyone considering Ek just remember before you come that this is how the company treats its employees. Complete and total disregard of ethics and this is what you want to be a part of? Think hard.
Anyone considering Ek just remember before you come that this is how the company treats its employees. Complete and total disregard of ethics and this is what you want to be a part of? Think hard.
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the DEC concept came to fruition in the autumn of 2003... that's 4.5 years ago boys 'n girls... anybody hired around that time or after must have had prior knowledge of the whole thing before comin' here. Quit yer bleating...
The differential in upgrade time between the Boeing and the 'Bus fleets is a drag... but who could've seen the delays in the A380 program?
The differential in upgrade time between the Boeing and the 'Bus fleets is a drag... but who could've seen the delays in the A380 program?
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DECs...the way for EK's future! If EK sticks to upgrading cry babies, then all is lost.
Don't like it? Pack 'yer bags and leave.
Somehow, I don't think many First Officers will leave, as the grass on the other side of the fence now has a more distinctly brown color, than previously.
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No-one agrees with the DEC principle. However, if you have no job it's a no brainer. Would you not take a DEC job at EK because you might offend some FO's feelings of righteousness? No way. How many delayed FO's here can honestly say that when they leave EK one day they will not go as a DEC anywhere? Will you all insist on joining a new company as an FO because you might upset someone? Nyet!
6 years ago things were the other way round. Boeing guys waited while Airbus guys upgraded on time.
Big Picture? So what! You will all upgrade.
I still don't agree with DEC's and I do agree that many have been hard done by. I do appreciate the financial implications and everything else related to this issue.
Keep the blue side up fellas
J
6 years ago things were the other way round. Boeing guys waited while Airbus guys upgraded on time.
Big Picture? So what! You will all upgrade.
I still don't agree with DEC's and I do agree that many have been hard done by. I do appreciate the financial implications and everything else related to this issue.
Keep the blue side up fellas
J
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the DEC concept came to fruition in the autumn of 2003...
With the sudden glut of yo-know-whos from across the pond now available and clamouring for jobs, (even with 'them Ay-rabs'), I fear we're going to see a lot more of them, on all fleets. (Note that I said 'all', not 'both' - I include the big 'un, and sooner than many might believe.)
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Everyone is missing the big picture here. Well all of you SCs are defending Ek for hiring DECs the question is begging to be asked why hire Airbus DECs when FOs are waiting 4 yrs 5 mths to upgrade? It is not like they are not qualifed, just a victim of real ****e airline practices.
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Not defending the policy, but looking at "the big picture":
1 training cycle with FO + DEC produces 1 usable crew.
1 training cycle with FO + upgrader produces 1 usable crew, but needs 1 new training cycle for a new FO as replacement for the upgrader.
From the beancounter point of view it's a no brainer.
1 training cycle with FO + DEC produces 1 usable crew.
1 training cycle with FO + upgrader produces 1 usable crew, but needs 1 new training cycle for a new FO as replacement for the upgrader.
From the beancounter point of view it's a no brainer.
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LHR rain
Check the seniority list. Do you see DECs appearing? Ok, maybe 1 or 2 per month (out of 40-50 newhires or so). Problem solved.
There is a lot to say about this subject and it is a very sensitive one I know, but sofar I personally have the impression that EK is NOT stuffing their FOs.
Some guys just have been very very unlucky (mainly AB) but
oooh boy...you know how low the brainpower in some departments is over here...
They just get their numbers wrong now and then.....sad but true...
There is a lot to say about this subject and it is a very sensitive one I know, but sofar I personally have the impression that EK is NOT stuffing their FOs.
Some guys just have been very very unlucky (mainly AB) but
oooh boy...you know how low the brainpower in some departments is over here...
They just get their numbers wrong now and then.....sad but true...
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Jumbo 1
I still don't agree with DEC's and I do agree that many have been hard done by. I do appreciate the financial implications and everything else related to this issue.
As much as you do not agree, but that's logistics and a buisness world. You have just agreed the financial implications and everything else related issue BUT yet you don' agree.!!
Just see what' happenning innUSA, my dear friend! You want the airline to shut dowm and or salvage a JOB!
Happy landings!
I still don't agree with DEC's and I do agree that many have been hard done by. I do appreciate the financial implications and everything else related to this issue.
As much as you do not agree, but that's logistics and a buisness world. You have just agreed the financial implications and everything else related issue BUT yet you don' agree.!!
Just see what' happenning innUSA, my dear friend! You want the airline to shut dowm and or salvage a JOB!
Happy landings!
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Ok, I was wrong....
EK is hiring DECs on the Boeing again and this while Boeing FOs upgrade has been delayed by 4-6 months;
Not to mention the Bus guys who are waiting >4 years now.
Wankers
EK is hiring DECs on the Boeing again and this while Boeing FOs upgrade has been delayed by 4-6 months;
Not to mention the Bus guys who are waiting >4 years now.
Wankers
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5 star,
Without prejudice
I believe someone has already pointed out that the current DEC policy was active 4 years ago. So I assume you mean that people waiting 4 years joined 4 years ago. They should have considered this potential situation then as part of their evaluation.
Its a dead argument. People who had served their time and were then shafted by the introduction of this policy had a valid grievance. Joining in full knowledge of the policy is only the responsibility of the individual and their own risk assesment of the chances of getting shafted.
You made a decision to take a bunch of expat managemnet lackies at their word.
I didnt .With the same information as was available to you i decided to walk away from giving up a left seat for an f/o job 4 years ago at ek for exactly those reasons. I would have been shafted as it turned out. Many mates who joined since had no such problems and are all skippers at EK with joining dates as f/os post 05.
I had more experience at the time than my mates but joining 1 year earlier...it would have been my call and mine alone to join . Not their later good fortune or anything else causing me grief.
The morale of the story its a judgement call and life is sometimes a bitch.
I have since had a dec contract on the table and am big boeing and bus qualified again Ive walked away last year. Lets see. This time it might be the wrong decision particularly inlight of the credit crunch.
Your current bad luck is unfortunate but not a factor in managing my own career nor mine a factor for you.
If I get laid off and you get your command a year late , will I be on here blaming my decision on people like you for slagging off DEC as a reason for not joining. No I wont. I'll just get on with it.
If I were offered an escape from redundancy by ek as a dec would your predicament affect me....not a jot. You see we share a profession not a parent.
Thats how it is. Its not personnal.
Without prejudice
I believe someone has already pointed out that the current DEC policy was active 4 years ago. So I assume you mean that people waiting 4 years joined 4 years ago. They should have considered this potential situation then as part of their evaluation.
Its a dead argument. People who had served their time and were then shafted by the introduction of this policy had a valid grievance. Joining in full knowledge of the policy is only the responsibility of the individual and their own risk assesment of the chances of getting shafted.
You made a decision to take a bunch of expat managemnet lackies at their word.
I didnt .With the same information as was available to you i decided to walk away from giving up a left seat for an f/o job 4 years ago at ek for exactly those reasons. I would have been shafted as it turned out. Many mates who joined since had no such problems and are all skippers at EK with joining dates as f/os post 05.
I had more experience at the time than my mates but joining 1 year earlier...it would have been my call and mine alone to join . Not their later good fortune or anything else causing me grief.
The morale of the story its a judgement call and life is sometimes a bitch.
I have since had a dec contract on the table and am big boeing and bus qualified again Ive walked away last year. Lets see. This time it might be the wrong decision particularly inlight of the credit crunch.
Your current bad luck is unfortunate but not a factor in managing my own career nor mine a factor for you.
If I get laid off and you get your command a year late , will I be on here blaming my decision on people like you for slagging off DEC as a reason for not joining. No I wont. I'll just get on with it.
If I were offered an escape from redundancy by ek as a dec would your predicament affect me....not a jot. You see we share a profession not a parent.
Thats how it is. Its not personnal.
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Matrempit
You clearly dont understand my post. The point I am making is I do not agree with the DEC principle. I accept that it is business practice and I am sympathising with my fellow colleagues who have been financially detrimented by this policy and had their commands delayed by this policy- after our management expressly promised a few years ago that this would not happen. Often by pilots with NO widebody time and/or long haul experience.
So, my friend, aviation in the USA aside, I accept that this policy exists but I do not have to like it. I also clearly state that if anyone does not have a job it's a no brainer. I dislike a policy that has been applied in a flawed manner - nothing to do with jobs, company survival etc etc.
Try read my post again - carefully!
Then you will get my point. You need to understand our company politics before criticising.
Happy landings
J
You clearly dont understand my post. The point I am making is I do not agree with the DEC principle. I accept that it is business practice and I am sympathising with my fellow colleagues who have been financially detrimented by this policy and had their commands delayed by this policy- after our management expressly promised a few years ago that this would not happen. Often by pilots with NO widebody time and/or long haul experience.
So, my friend, aviation in the USA aside, I accept that this policy exists but I do not have to like it. I also clearly state that if anyone does not have a job it's a no brainer. I dislike a policy that has been applied in a flawed manner - nothing to do with jobs, company survival etc etc.
Try read my post again - carefully!
Then you will get my point. You need to understand our company politics before criticising.
Happy landings
J
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Once you've got your 3000 hours left seat you'll be looking for DEC jobs out of here just like every one of us. V Aus, Korean, Jetstar, Vietnam, Jet, etc etc etc.
Tell me I'm wrong...!
Tell me I'm wrong...!