EK Housing Mess..
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 390
Likes: 0
From: Scotland
Ok guys, as a total newbie on EK but with an interest to end up flying for them one quick question that came to mind.
Can't you find a place for yourself to stay in or do you have to go down the offered accomodation path as (I believe?) it's part of your contract???
Thanks,
An EK newbie...
Can't you find a place for yourself to stay in or do you have to go down the offered accomodation path as (I believe?) it's part of your contract???
Thanks,
An EK newbie...
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,034
Likes: 2
From: UAE
DutchBird, if you do a search you will find it has been done to death- yes you can move out of company accommodation and go your own way but the allowance they give you will just about cover the rent on a two bedroom flat- but not the bills that go with it. It won't cover a mortgage (interest rates are fairly high here) unless you have a 30 or 40% (ie 500,000Dhs) deposit and are prepared to invest that in Dubai.
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 165
Likes: 0
From: UK
BigGeordie you are a bit out of touch. Dhs 500000 will probably be about 40% of a reasonably located 1 bed flat in Dubai. Try 2 Million to get 40% of a villa down - Thats 7 years of an FO salary assuming he spends it on nothing else - Oh I forgot - he'll be spending his whole salary on the mortgage. 
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,034
Likes: 2
From: UAE
I should have made it clear, I was talking about apartments. The figures in the two posts above are more accurate for villas. If you move out of company accommodation you will realistically only be looking at a one or two bedroom apartment.
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 320
Likes: 0
From: i don't know
And just where would my kids live, Big Geordie? - Pathetic.
EK moves closer to a bachelors airline, like the miserable workers in the labor camps. With all the frustration and personal problems that ensue.
1. Leaving your loved ones back home for 6 to 12 months (exactly what they are suggesting now with their c*#k up in the housing dep) is not only detrimental to your morale, it is simply unaffordable!! How can you pay the appartement/house back home with the miserable pay as a starting FO, considering that a great part of it is supposed to be free housing??
2. All those who chose to leave company accomodation are left in the dump. The allowance is lightyears behind the market and will never be adjusted even close to what EK themselves have to fork out for their rented villas. They might think "their problem", but it was done mainly due to family issues (school proximity vs. daily traffic terror or the missus who confronted you with leaving this acco or yourself) and not due to snobbish reasons. So lots of these folks are now confronted with the choice of a negative financial worksheet or having to leave the pit. Again this concernes mainly families, leaving behind only bachelors who can afford to stay.
3. Some have found the solution in commuting. Get into a cheap outfit here and have the family in a decent house back home. The missus' frustration with the pit, the schooling cost and traffic woes are almost sorted out then and being able to get home for a decent amount of days a month suited a lot of us. AAR and the long range clown have just ruined that aswell. Nobody was fooled by the clowns comment, we all know it is jealousy of the ingnorant and incompetent who lead to this. And for the third time they hit those with family.
A bachelors airline will bring in huge instabilty. They will see. Allthough we know that they abolished the SEY layovers only for monetary reasons, their argument that too many of us got drunk down there and that the hotels complained and that's why they were forced to do this does not only expose their ridiculous state of mind, but might indeed point to a future problem: The one they will get with frustrated bachelors.
EK moves closer to a bachelors airline, like the miserable workers in the labor camps. With all the frustration and personal problems that ensue.
1. Leaving your loved ones back home for 6 to 12 months (exactly what they are suggesting now with their c*#k up in the housing dep) is not only detrimental to your morale, it is simply unaffordable!! How can you pay the appartement/house back home with the miserable pay as a starting FO, considering that a great part of it is supposed to be free housing??
2. All those who chose to leave company accomodation are left in the dump. The allowance is lightyears behind the market and will never be adjusted even close to what EK themselves have to fork out for their rented villas. They might think "their problem", but it was done mainly due to family issues (school proximity vs. daily traffic terror or the missus who confronted you with leaving this acco or yourself) and not due to snobbish reasons. So lots of these folks are now confronted with the choice of a negative financial worksheet or having to leave the pit. Again this concernes mainly families, leaving behind only bachelors who can afford to stay.
3. Some have found the solution in commuting. Get into a cheap outfit here and have the family in a decent house back home. The missus' frustration with the pit, the schooling cost and traffic woes are almost sorted out then and being able to get home for a decent amount of days a month suited a lot of us. AAR and the long range clown have just ruined that aswell. Nobody was fooled by the clowns comment, we all know it is jealousy of the ingnorant and incompetent who lead to this. And for the third time they hit those with family.
A bachelors airline will bring in huge instabilty. They will see. Allthough we know that they abolished the SEY layovers only for monetary reasons, their argument that too many of us got drunk down there and that the hotels complained and that's why they were forced to do this does not only expose their ridiculous state of mind, but might indeed point to a future problem: The one they will get with frustrated bachelors.
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,034
Likes: 2
From: UAE
The company rarely consider the long term implications of anything they do, and I'm sure some genius with a calculator has worked out how much they would save if they didn't have those pesky wives and children to look after. Medical, school fees, villas, it really stacks up if you have say 100 pilots who are single rather than having a wife and 2.4 children.
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 429
Likes: 0
From: >FL310
Villa shortage? No way. After the announcement of our paltry profit share and pay raise, there will a number of villas come available. If I have it right, there will be any number available around September 1. That's three months after the resignations hit on June 1. Time enough to divest of furniture, cars, etc. So new joiners, there will be plenty of villas and decent used cars available to you around September 1.
Ten percent plus, inflation, rostering patterns of limited time off, standby duty on a designated day off, ULH flying with minimal down route rest, inadequate rest facilities on aircraft. Lousy salary compared with the rest of the premier carriers in the world. US carriers (failing as they are) .paying close to 70,000dhs/mo., Korean paying 48,000dhs/mo with world wide basings, all for 777 capts, Ek paying 30-40dhs and required resisdence in Dubai. EK bosses had better get their heads out of the sand or they will find not only guys and gals leaving, but will find they will have a hard time recruiting enough experience to fill their pretty jets. It is a sad state of affairs when recruiters have to apologize for anything during road shows and interviews (ref. housing) They have an opportunity coming up, will they rise to the occasion or continue their path of mediocrity? As my old football coach used to say, "you can't make chicken salad out of chicken !!!!!."
Ten percent plus, inflation, rostering patterns of limited time off, standby duty on a designated day off, ULH flying with minimal down route rest, inadequate rest facilities on aircraft. Lousy salary compared with the rest of the premier carriers in the world. US carriers (failing as they are) .paying close to 70,000dhs/mo., Korean paying 48,000dhs/mo with world wide basings, all for 777 capts, Ek paying 30-40dhs and required resisdence in Dubai. EK bosses had better get their heads out of the sand or they will find not only guys and gals leaving, but will find they will have a hard time recruiting enough experience to fill their pretty jets. It is a sad state of affairs when recruiters have to apologize for anything during road shows and interviews (ref. housing) They have an opportunity coming up, will they rise to the occasion or continue their path of mediocrity? As my old football coach used to say, "you can't make chicken salad out of chicken !!!!!."
Last edited by TangoUniform; 17th April 2008 at 12:43.
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 563
Likes: 0
From: Earth
Don't ya just love it.... why look after the staff when you can just f**k them off?
One day when there is a smoking mess in the side of the hill the Hibibis at the top of this s**t pile will realise that maybe they should have paid a little more attention to looking after the company personnel instead of looking after their wallets
One day when there is a smoking mess in the side of the hill the Hibibis at the top of this s**t pile will realise that maybe they should have paid a little more attention to looking after the company personnel instead of looking after their wallets
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 320
Likes: 0
From: i don't know
Hot off Rumour Network:
New joiners are being offered an "Enhansed Accommodation Allowance" of approx Dhs 160K and approx an extra Dhs 170 for the first year if they opt out of company accomodation.
New joiners are being offered an "Enhansed Accommodation Allowance" of approx Dhs 160K and approx an extra Dhs 170 for the first year if they opt out of company accomodation.
This needs a verification follow up. Allthough I can't believe it, we need to confirm or put off this rumour.....
If true there will be some angry questions, if not a lawsuit. Even in this s$%t place there is a fat chance that they'll run into problems.
One thing is for sure: If it is true and no one cares, then I'm out of here tomorrow!
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 144
Likes: 0
From: The Heavens
Spoke to a new guy at the CBC yesterday, living in Deira amongst the hookers etc, been told to wait 6 months for better accom. Was offered the living out allowance plus a one off 100k to help get set up....
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 138
Likes: 0
From: lgw
Whats wrong with living with hookers. My wife was one.
Might come after all.Maybe I wont have to.
It seems todays new joiner is tomorrows pprune whinger...Nothing wrong with that but I think the next move will be basing for new joiners but not existing people for sure.Too much upheavel.
How about this as a possible scenario. Devils advocate and all that.
Not enough people willing to move over to the gulf and not enough houses for those that are.
Lets say there is a downturn in the UK or say BA strike and lots of guys leave. What would be the best option? Not enough crew or a pool of experienced crew who would be more than happy to fly the kit you park at heathrow or elsewhere in the uk whilst still living at home.No one can claim they arent as qualified or shouldnt be decs, accomodation doesnt need to be found and you lot will do as your told according to your rather flimsy contract (probable management view , not mine) Times are a changing Emirates isnt what it was...Basically a great expat gig. Poaching ready to go pilots is the way forward. Pay them gross and let them figure the tax out. Lots already have that bit figured out and dont live where they work. Switching to EK is nothing but a change of sop.
I think its on the cards. The gulf is now a dump, somewhere to go if you have to.Or wanta big command relatively quickly. The people will dry up
Nobody belived John the Baptist either.
Might come after all.Maybe I wont have to.It seems todays new joiner is tomorrows pprune whinger...Nothing wrong with that but I think the next move will be basing for new joiners but not existing people for sure.Too much upheavel.
How about this as a possible scenario. Devils advocate and all that.
Not enough people willing to move over to the gulf and not enough houses for those that are.
Lets say there is a downturn in the UK or say BA strike and lots of guys leave. What would be the best option? Not enough crew or a pool of experienced crew who would be more than happy to fly the kit you park at heathrow or elsewhere in the uk whilst still living at home.No one can claim they arent as qualified or shouldnt be decs, accomodation doesnt need to be found and you lot will do as your told according to your rather flimsy contract (probable management view , not mine) Times are a changing Emirates isnt what it was...Basically a great expat gig. Poaching ready to go pilots is the way forward. Pay them gross and let them figure the tax out. Lots already have that bit figured out and dont live where they work. Switching to EK is nothing but a change of sop.
I think its on the cards. The gulf is now a dump, somewhere to go if you have to.Or wanta big command relatively quickly. The people will dry up
Nobody belived John the Baptist either.
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 2
Likes: 0
From: dubai
Look it is obvious from the posts of the guys who who are currently going through the interview process that EK actually does mention that accommodation is a serious problem.And if you actually live in DXB you know that it is not their fault. It is virtually impossible to find good accommodation at a reasonable price for any employee so gripe about something else that really is their fault and within their control.
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 66
Likes: 0
From: United Kingdom
gaz90 what is a reasonable price? I would say the market price is the baseline.
Therefore you need to pay people enough to get into accomodation at whatever the market price is.
Simply put - it is entirely within their control. Housing allowances should have increased to reflect rental increases just the same as salaries should increase to reflect inflationary pressures.
It is entirely within the company's control. And they are making billions. I too could make billions if I could pay way under market prices for everything.
Give me property, shares, gold or labour at well below market price and we'll get rich together.
Why defend those who are exploiting you?
Therefore you need to pay people enough to get into accomodation at whatever the market price is.
Simply put - it is entirely within their control. Housing allowances should have increased to reflect rental increases just the same as salaries should increase to reflect inflationary pressures.
It is entirely within the company's control. And they are making billions. I too could make billions if I could pay way under market prices for everything.
Give me property, shares, gold or labour at well below market price and we'll get rich together.
Why defend those who are exploiting you?
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 455
Likes: 0
From: Bit nosey aren't you
An interesting development. EK FO allowance around about 125k add 100k and you might be able to get a 3 bedroom house in a nice area. After 1 year though you have just 125k.....eeeek.
Allowances are interesting things. Many companies pay well over 300k, even ATC pay their guys 185k plus utilities. So it would be a massive risk to take that deal and I suspect it has been offered without much expectation of uptake to be seen to doing something. I for the life of me can't work out why they don't up the allowance to say 300k and disband the accomodation department. Then they don't have any of these hassles, surely that would save some cash in the long run
Allowances are interesting things. Many companies pay well over 300k, even ATC pay their guys 185k plus utilities. So it would be a massive risk to take that deal and I suspect it has been offered without much expectation of uptake to be seen to doing something. I for the life of me can't work out why they don't up the allowance to say 300k and disband the accomodation department. Then they don't have any of these hassles, surely that would save some cash in the long run