Latest Bjorn's 'gift' to his pilots : Pilot Airport Standby!
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Latest Bjorn's 'gift' to his pilots : Pilot Airport Standby!
Guys,
You thought we got this 200BD salary increase for nothing, look at what they want us now to do! **** I miss a good union (i know we are in the middle east) I will go on strike for less than that! 3 Airlines and many years in this business and I have never seen Pilot Airport Standby, even in the worst carriers !
In my AIMS inbox today:
1 Airport Standby
Wih the introduction of the new Network aircraft schedule, Pilots may be
assigned to airport Standby to ensure on time departures in case of last
minute changes. Crew will be paid the 1.5 BD during the time of Airport
Stnadbu assignment. The system will be reviewed after the initial month of
analysis.
regards
Flight Operations
But as far as I am concerned, I have seen nothing written about this in OM-A or any NTC / JNTC... I am sure it will come very soon!
And honestly, they think they will solve their OTP (=On Time Performance) problems with this ? Get a good maintenance who takes care of our aircrafts and get the ground staff to do their job and close the door at ETD-10 no matter what then you will see improvement in our OTPs !
Bjorn, did you renew that PPL of yours?
BD
You thought we got this 200BD salary increase for nothing, look at what they want us now to do! **** I miss a good union (i know we are in the middle east) I will go on strike for less than that! 3 Airlines and many years in this business and I have never seen Pilot Airport Standby, even in the worst carriers !
In my AIMS inbox today:
1 Airport Standby
Wih the introduction of the new Network aircraft schedule, Pilots may be
assigned to airport Standby to ensure on time departures in case of last
minute changes. Crew will be paid the 1.5 BD during the time of Airport
Stnadbu assignment. The system will be reviewed after the initial month of
analysis.
regards
Flight Operations
But as far as I am concerned, I have seen nothing written about this in OM-A or any NTC / JNTC... I am sure it will come very soon!
And honestly, they think they will solve their OTP (=On Time Performance) problems with this ? Get a good maintenance who takes care of our aircrafts and get the ground staff to do their job and close the door at ETD-10 no matter what then you will see improvement in our OTPs !
Bjorn, did you renew that PPL of yours?
BD
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I assume they are supplying a proper pilot lounge to the crew with adequate facilities away from passengers? Cause I know thta they would never be so unproffesional as to ask us to sit in Costa Coffee or the GF business lounge for 4-6 hours. Right??
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Not defending the ASTBY but to say
is nonsense. Most carriers have an airport standby,I can think of at least 3 off the top of my head including Air France. It's very very common among big carriers and most have a duty lasting up to 12 hours. The GF duty is only 4 hours. Furthermore if you look in OM-A you will find it is mentioned in detail and has been there for a long time, it was just never used. Now you know what the construction work outside ops was all about, thats your new lounge!!! ****ty duty but someone has to do it.
many years in this business and I have never seen Pilot Airport Standby, even in the worst carriers !
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Pilot standby on commuter type arilines for 1-2 r/t flights is one thing but pilot standby for longhaul flights is something else.
We are talking about the shorter flights are we? Then again around here anything goes!
We are talking about the shorter flights are we? Then again around here anything goes!
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Me thinks for everybody: short and long haul !
jack please give me the OM-A reference, I looked this morning in section 7 and then made a search over the whole book and I found nothing about airport standby... so where is it ?
Same on the JNTC/NTC side nothing there also, so if you had here also any references, send them to us please!
Thanks
BD
jack please give me the OM-A reference, I looked this morning in section 7 and then made a search over the whole book and I found nothing about airport standby... so where is it ?
Same on the JNTC/NTC side nothing there also, so if you had here also any references, send them to us please!
Thanks
BD
Last edited by boeingdriverx; 6th Jul 2007 at 09:46. Reason: jack
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Thirty years in this business, three airlines, and have never ever heard of airport standby for pilots. Have heard of immediate notification, but not at the airport. Have fun.........
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Standby should be undertaken at the crew member’s own place of residence, OR where
“suitable accommodation” is available. If these conditions are not fulfilled, then appropriate
limitations shall be applied to the duration of standby duty.
“suitable accommodation” is available. If these conditions are not fulfilled, then appropriate
limitations shall be applied to the duration of standby duty.
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The crew lounge is NOT suitable accomodation.
Suitable accom is;
- a furnished bedroom
- single occupancy
- minimum noise
- well ventilated
- ability to control light and temperature
A crew lounge meets none of these requirements, so the suitable accom thing is out the window. Dont accept anything less.
By implementing this it implies that crew are contributory to the pathetic OTP we have.
ps this is not common practice.
Suitable accom is;
- a furnished bedroom
- single occupancy
- minimum noise
- well ventilated
- ability to control light and temperature
A crew lounge meets none of these requirements, so the suitable accom thing is out the window. Dont accept anything less.
By implementing this it implies that crew are contributory to the pathetic OTP we have.
ps this is not common practice.
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Gotta disagree with you Jack...it is most certainly not common practice at most major international airlines. There may be the odd one that does it, but any that i've ever heard of had a proper crew lounge in the terminal, seperate from the passengers that included sofa's, TV's, cofee etc.
The new building across from ops is not a crew lounge, its a place to wait till the buses pick you up, and by no means "suitable accomodation" . I think i'll just hang out at home after checking in, takes me 10 min to get to work anyway.
The new building across from ops is not a crew lounge, its a place to wait till the buses pick you up, and by no means "suitable accomodation" . I think i'll just hang out at home after checking in, takes me 10 min to get to work anyway.
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Dixon, still the ****** you always were, misleading people again. Tbaylx, dont bother to check in as it will tell you there is no flight. Just sit at home if you live that close. No need to check in or out.
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Dixon is correct, the lounge is not suitable accom. That being said, the way I understand it, your FDT limit starts the second you check in.
7.8.1. Category of Standby Facilities
Standby should be undertaken at the crew member’s own place of residence, or where “suitable accommodation” is available. If these conditions are not fulfilled, then appropriate limitations shall be applied to the duration of standby duty.
7.8.3. Standby Duty Time limits
If suitable accommodation is not available, then the appropriate limitation of the flight duty period is applicable to the total of standby and duty period..
Airport standby sucks, I have a couple of ASBY's this month. Looking on the bright side, it might give me time to get caught up on some of that pesky paperwork that I have been putting off.
7.8.1. Category of Standby Facilities
Standby should be undertaken at the crew member’s own place of residence, or where “suitable accommodation” is available. If these conditions are not fulfilled, then appropriate limitations shall be applied to the duration of standby duty.
7.8.3. Standby Duty Time limits
If suitable accommodation is not available, then the appropriate limitation of the flight duty period is applicable to the total of standby and duty period..
Airport standby sucks, I have a couple of ASBY's this month. Looking on the bright side, it might give me time to get caught up on some of that pesky paperwork that I have been putting off.
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Well if I am so wrong and Dixon etc is so right then how many are prepared to refuse to do it.....thats right none. Even in these times of plenty the spinless out there prefer to spoof on here misleading people and acting big behind pseudo names. Believe me it IS legal and they can do it. It was the same with the 6 or 7 hours in the lounge in DXB. Everyone complained but nobody challenged it because it was within the law of continous duty. This is just the same, it looks bad but perfectly ok and despite what you say it is a common practice with major carriers. I have contacted 3 friends in Europe and they all do at least one every couple of months. Until someone comes up with a rational comment I have no more to say about it.
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How many rostered duties are you doing now? I used to go to work A330/A340 fleet, 6 or 7 times a month, in July I have 12 duties including two Astby!!
Did we get an increase in transport allowance? NO. The Bd1.5 for Astby does'nt cover the running costs to get to the airport and back.(48Kms round trip).
Take a look at the PEW tonight there is no Captain allocated to this block at 1700hrs local, is anyone on stby?or are they going to try out the Astby tonight?
Did we get an increase in transport allowance? NO. The Bd1.5 for Astby does'nt cover the running costs to get to the airport and back.(48Kms round trip).
Take a look at the PEW tonight there is no Captain allocated to this block at 1700hrs local, is anyone on stby?or are they going to try out the Astby tonight?
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I have to agree with most of you guys.
I am concerned about a few things.
First of all, I agree with Dixons Cider's definition (right out of OM-A) of what suitable accomidation is.
So since sitting around in a waiting area or lounge in GF headquarters or the airport is not suitable accomidation, "then the appropriate limitation of the flight duty period is applicable to the total of standby and duty period." It becomes a lot like the lounge rest schemes that we have been doing in Dubai and Abu Dhabi. Not a very pretty concept, since at least with the Dubai or Abu Dhabi thing, you had an idea of how long the waiting game was going to last-- or how many pairs of underwear you should pack!
If it is only a 4 hour period, well, I guess that is some relief. However, not much. At a previous airline, is was in our collective agreement that the Company cannot require crews to be on stand-by at the airport.
I sympathise with the problems our Company is going through these days regarding on-time performance and the need to get the thing running like a swiss clock. However, whenever called at short notice, I have always done my best to toss on my uniform, and toss a handful of fishfood into the aquarium before launching to the airport. I live 15 minutes driving time from the airport, and have sometimes been on the flight deck as little as 25 minutes from the time I've been called.
Is this ASBY really necessary, considering the ill feeling it causes?
I am concerned about a few things.
First of all, I agree with Dixons Cider's definition (right out of OM-A) of what suitable accomidation is.
So since sitting around in a waiting area or lounge in GF headquarters or the airport is not suitable accomidation, "then the appropriate limitation of the flight duty period is applicable to the total of standby and duty period." It becomes a lot like the lounge rest schemes that we have been doing in Dubai and Abu Dhabi. Not a very pretty concept, since at least with the Dubai or Abu Dhabi thing, you had an idea of how long the waiting game was going to last-- or how many pairs of underwear you should pack!
If it is only a 4 hour period, well, I guess that is some relief. However, not much. At a previous airline, is was in our collective agreement that the Company cannot require crews to be on stand-by at the airport.
I sympathise with the problems our Company is going through these days regarding on-time performance and the need to get the thing running like a swiss clock. However, whenever called at short notice, I have always done my best to toss on my uniform, and toss a handful of fishfood into the aquarium before launching to the airport. I live 15 minutes driving time from the airport, and have sometimes been on the flight deck as little as 25 minutes from the time I've been called.
Is this ASBY really necessary, considering the ill feeling it causes?
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"Suitable accomodation" applies only to facilities that are used to extend the duty period, ie: split duty...since airport stby does not allow them to extend your duty period, as neither does the lounge...then the "adequate" and "suitable" accomodation proviso in OMA does not apply when on airport stby, or lounge "rest".... you are in fact on duty and the clock is ticking...so when on airport stby, be sure to include that time spent against your duty time period limitation...and the limitation is based on the LOCAL TIME REPORTING FOR DUTY which is when you signed on for airport stby....enjoy it...not convinced it will solve anything, just burn 4hrs off your duty period that could have otherwise been rest....
