living in dubai
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Shake, although this gets monotonous (and gypsy, as I am writing this at 3.15am I am not overly conserned wif tha spellin ok, howp ya wil fagiv ma) PPRUNE is here for aviation professionals, so as this is the Middle East forum for aviation professionals I feel more than qualified to post here. Quite often people post queries here, who are not in aviation at all, but want an insight into living in the Middle East, as this question was.
Nuffin, I think he is saying that we are getting wound up by them. I agree with you Nuffin, we are just trying to answer the initial query with our own first hand experience. We can't help it if our first hand experience is less bitter and twisted than others.
Nuffin, I think he is saying that we are getting wound up by them. I agree with you Nuffin, we are just trying to answer the initial query with our own first hand experience. We can't help it if our first hand experience is less bitter and twisted than others.
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I have been giving some thought to the arguments about safety in Dubai discussed on this thread. Certainly, in general terms, my family feels safer here than at home. However, I know of a family that has been the subject of a burglary and a bomb threat and of villas in my area that have been burgled. Of course many burglaries and rapes occur at home but generally they are reported by the media and the authorities. In Dubai we can only postulate on the number and types of crimes that are committed. Anything else is closer to guessing because the media cannot, or choose not to report all of the crimes that occur. Similarly, the police don’t publicize their statistics on all crimes because they are not held accountable to their government by voters.
Is it quirk of human nature that everyone who comes to the UAE suddenly becomes a law abiding citizen? No, it’s because the police have absolute power. A young bloke has been jailed recently because his pregnant wife died during the night of a brain hemorrhage. She’d had to go off her medication because she was pregnant and died as a result. The police locked him up for two months, while his young son and family mourned and then released him without his passport.
I am much happier letting my kids ride their bikes at home as I don’t trust many people on the roads and certainly anyone using Sheikh Zayed Rd regularly must feel that they endanger themselves and their families every time they do so.
The ‘sod off you whining git’ argument doesn’t hold that much water either. If I worked in western Sydney, for example, I might not like living there but if that’s where my job was then I’d have little choice but to stay. Then my options would be to try and find a new job that allowed me a choice of where I lived or to try and improve the circumstances of my current employment. I think people here are looking at both of those options though some will say ‘I love it and therefore they can screw around with my employment conditions because the lifestyle is worth so much to me’ and others will be of the opinion that ‘to stay I need to protect my interests’ and do this by expressing opinions and writing to the bosses. These theories have an endgame and at that point a life in Dubai is no longer viable, of course this point will be different for most people.
Is it quirk of human nature that everyone who comes to the UAE suddenly becomes a law abiding citizen? No, it’s because the police have absolute power. A young bloke has been jailed recently because his pregnant wife died during the night of a brain hemorrhage. She’d had to go off her medication because she was pregnant and died as a result. The police locked him up for two months, while his young son and family mourned and then released him without his passport.
I am much happier letting my kids ride their bikes at home as I don’t trust many people on the roads and certainly anyone using Sheikh Zayed Rd regularly must feel that they endanger themselves and their families every time they do so.
The ‘sod off you whining git’ argument doesn’t hold that much water either. If I worked in western Sydney, for example, I might not like living there but if that’s where my job was then I’d have little choice but to stay. Then my options would be to try and find a new job that allowed me a choice of where I lived or to try and improve the circumstances of my current employment. I think people here are looking at both of those options though some will say ‘I love it and therefore they can screw around with my employment conditions because the lifestyle is worth so much to me’ and others will be of the opinion that ‘to stay I need to protect my interests’ and do this by expressing opinions and writing to the bosses. These theories have an endgame and at that point a life in Dubai is no longer viable, of course this point will be different for most people.
Join Date: May 2002
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Well there you go Goody,
Not sure about pilots but there are clearly an awful lot of lawyers here - very negative, cynical and argumentative people, always ready to pick an argument, far too much to say for themselves, and sooo precious about their opinions..
... without contributing a single useful answer
Oh and far too ready to knock all those professions without which they simply wouldn't be here. I must remember to mention it next time I'm talking to EK, whom we help to do an awful lot of business.
DXB currently handles 900k tons cargo a year. By 2018 it will reach 5m tons! And EK is not the only airline here guys. New ones starting up all the time. Puts food on the table for a lot of people.
If it helps,
Only been here a short while but from what I've seen in the papers / seen for myself / been told:
Cars about half the price of UK but servicing can be pricey. Petrol cost next to nothing.
Housing costs going up all the time and no sign of peaking.
Yes, the traffic can be bad and the standard of driving here is dreadful - never seen so many accidents!
Lots of nightlife which is good if you're single
Lots of hookers on the streets, especially in certain parts of town. Not too nice but you just have to get used to it, so to speak.
Can't comment on schools, family life etc I'm afraid.
Hope that helps a bit
Edit: Best thing about Dubai this morning? - It's raining! Luvvveeelllyyy
CS
Not sure about pilots but there are clearly an awful lot of lawyers here - very negative, cynical and argumentative people, always ready to pick an argument, far too much to say for themselves, and sooo precious about their opinions..
... without contributing a single useful answer
Oh and far too ready to knock all those professions without which they simply wouldn't be here. I must remember to mention it next time I'm talking to EK, whom we help to do an awful lot of business.
DXB currently handles 900k tons cargo a year. By 2018 it will reach 5m tons! And EK is not the only airline here guys. New ones starting up all the time. Puts food on the table for a lot of people.
If it helps,
Only been here a short while but from what I've seen in the papers / seen for myself / been told:
Cars about half the price of UK but servicing can be pricey. Petrol cost next to nothing.
Housing costs going up all the time and no sign of peaking.
Yes, the traffic can be bad and the standard of driving here is dreadful - never seen so many accidents!
Lots of nightlife which is good if you're single
Lots of hookers on the streets, especially in certain parts of town. Not too nice but you just have to get used to it, so to speak.
Can't comment on schools, family life etc I'm afraid.
Hope that helps a bit
Edit: Best thing about Dubai this morning? - It's raining! Luvvveeelllyyy
CS
Last edited by cargosales; 21st Dec 2004 at 07:08.
Join Date: Jun 2004
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Ladies and Gentleman.....friends and others
Have to agree with most of you...if you cant stand the heat then get out of the kitchen.
Dubai isnt for everyone........ if I had the knowledge I have now about Dubai, I might not have been so keen to move all this way.
We as expats are very mindful and respectful of the local culture and customs
However ........I do get a little p%$$ed off with people in blacked out windows running me off the road....driving dangerously close to my car at high speed and over taking me at more than 140km/hr on the inside on Shiek Zayed road ...........only to then pull off at the next off ramp 1-2k's further on.
(mindless and not isolated I can assure you)
there is one set of laws for us and another set of rules for locals or those who are connected.
The police are trying to do thier job but are halted if during thier enquries they find the person involved is "üntoucheable"
Dont bury your head in the sand .......stay real.
Dubai is a fast growing city and with that you have by virtue of that growth an increase in all kinds of activity.
Dubai isnt perfect ..but it has a lot to offer .....if you live your life here just doing your own thing and having a great time you will leave with fantastic memories.....
if you have a negative attitude and start out that way....... your time here will surely be limited
Hey .....ernestkgann .........did your wife wright that for you or is your femanine side starting to show through
and cargosales.....you cant compare Dubai with the UK.......why do people do that. hello!!!! anyway sounds like you guys are going to be hit with expat tax soon by your own selfish Govt....but lets save that for another thread.....
why dont we call it ..."is still worth living in Dubai now beacause its just like being in the UK....WE PAY TAX TO THE UK GOVT AND IT RAINS just like home"
Have to agree with most of you...if you cant stand the heat then get out of the kitchen.
Dubai isnt for everyone........ if I had the knowledge I have now about Dubai, I might not have been so keen to move all this way.
We as expats are very mindful and respectful of the local culture and customs
However ........I do get a little p%$$ed off with people in blacked out windows running me off the road....driving dangerously close to my car at high speed and over taking me at more than 140km/hr on the inside on Shiek Zayed road ...........only to then pull off at the next off ramp 1-2k's further on.
(mindless and not isolated I can assure you)
there is one set of laws for us and another set of rules for locals or those who are connected.
The police are trying to do thier job but are halted if during thier enquries they find the person involved is "üntoucheable"
Dont bury your head in the sand .......stay real.
Dubai is a fast growing city and with that you have by virtue of that growth an increase in all kinds of activity.
Dubai isnt perfect ..but it has a lot to offer .....if you live your life here just doing your own thing and having a great time you will leave with fantastic memories.....
if you have a negative attitude and start out that way....... your time here will surely be limited
Hey .....ernestkgann .........did your wife wright that for you or is your femanine side starting to show through
and cargosales.....you cant compare Dubai with the UK.......why do people do that. hello!!!! anyway sounds like you guys are going to be hit with expat tax soon by your own selfish Govt....but lets save that for another thread.....
why dont we call it ..."is still worth living in Dubai now beacause its just like being in the UK....WE PAY TAX TO THE UK GOVT AND IT RAINS just like home"
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Living in Dubai
Just for the record, cargo sales only had a say, firstly to stick up for me as I was slagged off by everyone else writing on this topic for providing some information which I thought would be useful for the person who first posted this topic....but instead I was told that I must have been a man in a previous life etc etc so I deleted the post even though it was innocent.
Maybe people should remember what the original topic was about instead of taking the piss out of each other, a bit of sarcasm doesnt go astray but when you start getting nasty people wont bother anymore.....and yes I have been here for five years so I do know whats it about.....good and bad....you either love it or loathe it.....and if you loathe it then Im sure our wonderful Emirates airlines will take you whereever you desire! (and no I do not work for EK). Good luck goody if you decide on the move!!
Maybe people should remember what the original topic was about instead of taking the piss out of each other, a bit of sarcasm doesnt go astray but when you start getting nasty people wont bother anymore.....and yes I have been here for five years so I do know whats it about.....good and bad....you either love it or loathe it.....and if you loathe it then Im sure our wonderful Emirates airlines will take you whereever you desire! (and no I do not work for EK). Good luck goody if you decide on the move!!
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Shake:
If you bother to read my original post, I was objecting to the personal attack upon someone who was trying to help the original poster with answers to his question. (Surprise, surprise you have PMs disabled - would like to add something to this)
And I made it quite clear that I was interested in 'useful' replies!
What on earth has my marital status got to do with anything, other than it indicates I'm unlikely to have dependents here.
The number of posts refers to the total an individual has made, irrespective of where they live. So if we're being pedantic your average 0.28 posts a day compared to my 0.18 means you seem to have far more to say for yourself.
Now, shall we cease these silly personal attacks?
CS
If you bother to read my original post, I was objecting to the personal attack upon someone who was trying to help the original poster with answers to his question. (Surprise, surprise you have PMs disabled - would like to add something to this)
And I made it quite clear that I was interested in 'useful' replies!
What on earth has my marital status got to do with anything, other than it indicates I'm unlikely to have dependents here.
The number of posts refers to the total an individual has made, irrespective of where they live. So if we're being pedantic your average 0.28 posts a day compared to my 0.18 means you seem to have far more to say for yourself.
Now, shall we cease these silly personal attacks?
CS
Last edited by cargosales; 21st Dec 2004 at 13:29.
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thanks all
thanks all for the input, neg or pos ,
i need to know the truth.
by the way i`m married with a young wife and a boy who is two.
any inputs from people with kids and what to do here ..mainly for the family to spend time living here. salary below 15000dhs ...
any recommendations for lifestyle ?
mainly to keep my son n wife , say occupied .
thanks all again.
i need to know the truth.
by the way i`m married with a young wife and a boy who is two.
any inputs from people with kids and what to do here ..mainly for the family to spend time living here. salary below 15000dhs ...
any recommendations for lifestyle ?
mainly to keep my son n wife , say occupied .
thanks all again.
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Ok Goody, even though I don't fly for the one and only airline in the Middle East, since your salary is what we lowly ATC'ers get, I may be actually qualified to respond. Of course I am sure Sandigger feels I shouldn't even be here but anyway...
Do you get any allowances on top of that, eg. Education, Accommodation, travel, utilities???
If you want to start sending the boy to school in a couple of years you will need that paid for by the employer, as otherwise it will take a big chunk out of your 15,000 AED. Also accommodation will take a huge chunk out of 15,000 AED a month.
That said if you do get the above mentioned allowances, then yes you can live very well here, and save a lot for your future wherever you choose to spend it. The exchange rate right now is bad, and there are no guarantees it will get better, and that has to also be taken into account.
As far as lifestyle goes, if you have small/no accommodation allowance, and you can only afford a small flat, I would recommend getting a membership at a club where the wife and child can sit by the pool/ on the beach and enjoy the weather. Also most of the shopping centres have play centres for the little ones, so when the weather gets hot, thats the place to spend time to keep your son happy.
I know I will get shouted down by the knockers here, but as a few guys have said before, I am just trying to give some honest advice to someone asking for it. cheers.
Do you get any allowances on top of that, eg. Education, Accommodation, travel, utilities???
If you want to start sending the boy to school in a couple of years you will need that paid for by the employer, as otherwise it will take a big chunk out of your 15,000 AED. Also accommodation will take a huge chunk out of 15,000 AED a month.
That said if you do get the above mentioned allowances, then yes you can live very well here, and save a lot for your future wherever you choose to spend it. The exchange rate right now is bad, and there are no guarantees it will get better, and that has to also be taken into account.
As far as lifestyle goes, if you have small/no accommodation allowance, and you can only afford a small flat, I would recommend getting a membership at a club where the wife and child can sit by the pool/ on the beach and enjoy the weather. Also most of the shopping centres have play centres for the little ones, so when the weather gets hot, thats the place to spend time to keep your son happy.
I know I will get shouted down by the knockers here, but as a few guys have said before, I am just trying to give some honest advice to someone asking for it. cheers.
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Just to quantify AirNoServices advice
The school my kids go to costs around 26000 dirhams/year per child plus all the usual school stuff like uniforms, trips, activities etc. That is a primary school and not the most expensive, but not the cheapest either. Kids start school at 4 years old and the fees for a 4 year old are around 24000dhs i think. You can find plenty of cheap schools, but you aren't going to want to send your kids there.
The club membership for the family will cost anywhere up to 15000dhs, but mostly around 8-10,000
Accomodation varies wildly as does any where. The cheapest you are likely to get away with is around 35,000dhs. If you want bigger in a better location, you will be around the 70,000 if you want a villa in the traditional expat areas you will be well over 100,000.
On top of that, every holiday you take will be an overseas trip, which for 3 people adds up fairly quickly.
So, on 15,000 dirhams with a wife and kid and no allowances, you will live very poorly and save no money. With allowances you will live reasonable and save no money.
The school my kids go to costs around 26000 dirhams/year per child plus all the usual school stuff like uniforms, trips, activities etc. That is a primary school and not the most expensive, but not the cheapest either. Kids start school at 4 years old and the fees for a 4 year old are around 24000dhs i think. You can find plenty of cheap schools, but you aren't going to want to send your kids there.
The club membership for the family will cost anywhere up to 15000dhs, but mostly around 8-10,000
Accomodation varies wildly as does any where. The cheapest you are likely to get away with is around 35,000dhs. If you want bigger in a better location, you will be around the 70,000 if you want a villa in the traditional expat areas you will be well over 100,000.
On top of that, every holiday you take will be an overseas trip, which for 3 people adds up fairly quickly.
So, on 15,000 dirhams with a wife and kid and no allowances, you will live very poorly and save no money. With allowances you will live reasonable and save no money.
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thanks all
thanks mate.......
well i made a mistake , i didn`t mention some important stuff as mentioned by airnoservice australia.....
housing for myself is provided.
school is paid by my company.
utilities are paid by my company.
with that and earning 15000 aed is that enough to live moderately well and save money ? thanks all and merry christmas and a merry new year.
well i made a mistake , i didn`t mention some important stuff as mentioned by airnoservice australia.....
housing for myself is provided.
school is paid by my company.
utilities are paid by my company.
with that and earning 15000 aed is that enough to live moderately well and save money ? thanks all and merry christmas and a merry new year.
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Dubai has great restaurants, great shopping, and a great nightlife, and it all comes at a price, so if you want to live the high life 15,000AED won't go far.
BUT!! you are having education, utilities, and accommodation paid for, so that leaves transport (dirt cheap, both to buy and run a car), food (moderately expensive but I would say still cheaper that Europe by a long way), entertainment (could cost you anything, depending on your taste). You are basically in the same shoes financially as us lowly interloping ATC'ers and we manage to live well and save for our old age. I guess pilots live a fancier lifestyle than us luddites on terra firma, and as such need more than 15,000 AED a month.
BUT!! you are having education, utilities, and accommodation paid for, so that leaves transport (dirt cheap, both to buy and run a car), food (moderately expensive but I would say still cheaper that Europe by a long way), entertainment (could cost you anything, depending on your taste). You are basically in the same shoes financially as us lowly interloping ATC'ers and we manage to live well and save for our old age. I guess pilots live a fancier lifestyle than us luddites on terra firma, and as such need more than 15,000 AED a month.
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Here's my 2 cents,
That package is pretty well the EK F/O package. I agree with ANSA, except we have a small family, don't live high-on-the-hog and yet we have struggled to save money.
Goody, with the same family dynamics as you, after 2 years, we've just now been able to save a bit of money. However, we drew money from off-shore for the first year, so we're not even yet.
As ANSA says, it depends on your entertainment choices, but you've got to spend a bit to be happy here. No second car, but I do have a (cheap) golf membership. No Dom Perrignon, but we do go out for dinner twice a month. (Still trying to fine a nice restaurant that provides good value...)
Anyway, I think we're all saying pretty well the same thing. With that package you'll be able to live a nice lifestyle, but may or may not be able to save money. Probably not for the first year...
That package is pretty well the EK F/O package. I agree with ANSA, except we have a small family, don't live high-on-the-hog and yet we have struggled to save money.
Goody, with the same family dynamics as you, after 2 years, we've just now been able to save a bit of money. However, we drew money from off-shore for the first year, so we're not even yet.
As ANSA says, it depends on your entertainment choices, but you've got to spend a bit to be happy here. No second car, but I do have a (cheap) golf membership. No Dom Perrignon, but we do go out for dinner twice a month. (Still trying to fine a nice restaurant that provides good value...)
Anyway, I think we're all saying pretty well the same thing. With that package you'll be able to live a nice lifestyle, but may or may not be able to save money. Probably not for the first year...
