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Originally Posted by SOPS
(Post 10288462)
Yes Dr..I agree (sadly)..however I think Shorten will be PM for at least 2 terms because the Libs will be decimated. The people smugglers will be loading the boats as we speak..we might as go onto food stamps because Labor will tax us out of existence...however it will take the electorate at least 2 terms to work out what they voted for. May we live in interesting times....
I seem to recall the general vibe in this thread during the Rudd/Gillard/Rudd saga was that the Coalition would finally steady the ship and show the country what real stability and pragmatic governance would look like. Yet here we are, probably the only thing that has changed between Rudd 2.0 and today is the legalisation of same-sex marriage. What other policy decisions have had a positive effect on the country since Abbott's election in 2013? |
Wasn't it that chappie Jobson Growthe?
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Neither party has anything in their policies which is looking further than about 5 minutes. Dollar Bill is likely to be the worst PM we have ever had, but there is almost no alternative.
Prepare yourself for the worst time to be a White Hetero Christian. Legislation to make excuses and allowances for the people who aren't WHC will be back-breaking, and the screaming minorities will run parliament. |
Originally Posted by Ascend Charlie
(Post 10289072)
Prepare yourself for the worst time to be a White Hetero Christian.
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Malcolm coming in just before the 2016 election gave swinging voters in the middle some hope and saw them just scrape over the line to take the election which would have been a certain loss under Abbott. However LNP support declined after that when the average voter realised Abbott, Dutton and Co had Malcolm by the balls and were neutering him. The only two LNP potential leaders who could get that crucial moderate support are Bishop or Turnbull, not Abbott or Dutton or Morrison. |
Originally Posted by parabellum
(Post 10289081)
An interesting hypothesis Dr Dre, you seem to have avoided the fact that when Turnbull came to power the electorate were so over joyed that a swift double dissolution would have guaranteed him about a fourteen seat overall majority, instead of which, by the time Turnbull eventually did call an election the entire electorate had seen through him and realised he was just another marsh mallow, result, one seat advantage, no senate majority and total achievements that weren't already ALP policy anyway, zero...
Turnbulls behaviour in respect of the Wentworth seat was disgusting and for that alone he should be sacked from his party, whose politics he never did endorse anyway. Q. Which of the following do you think would make the best leader of the Liberal Party? Look at the Preferred PM numbers under the “vote Lib/Nat” column. Turnbull clearly in front amongst Liberal party voters. Another moderate, Bishop is in second. Where are the conservatives? Abbott takes third, Dutton in fourth and ScoMo takes 5th on a puny 2%. I think the numbers speak clearly that those who vote LNP want a moderate over a conservative to be leading their party. And why should Malcolm have bothered to help in Wentworth? The conservatives booted him out of the PM’s job because they thought he was too “leftist” and was a liability that would cost them the next election, and they were glad to see the back of him. But now they say losing Wentworth is his fault because they needed his popularity to win that seat. Well if I were Malcolm I would’ve sent them a message rhyming with “get clucked” to that plea. Luckily the 3 conservative amigos will be ending soon. Dutton will probably lose his seat at the next election, ScoMo wil lose his place at the lodge and sulk off to the backbench and the embarrassment of being an opposition backbencher will probably be too much for the mad monk and he’ll scurry off out of parliament.
Originally Posted by Ascend Charlie
(Post 10289072)
Prepare yourself for the worst time to be a White Hetero Christian. Legislation to make excuses and allowances for the people who aren't WHC will be back-breaking, and the screaming minorities will run parliament. |
Originally Posted by Ascend Charlie
(Post 10289072)
the screaming minorities will run parliament.
On second though, not very surprising at all, since they are pretty much the same crowd. [Hmm, any chance we can convince them to force the climate change issue to a plebiscite :E] |
Originally Posted by Ascend Charlie
(Post 10289072)
Prepare yourself for the worst time to be a White Hetero Christian. Legislation to make excuses and allowances for the people who aren't WHC will be back-breaking, and the screaming minorities will run parliament.
Careful, you’re starting to sound like a screaming minority.. |
Originally Posted by Hempy
(Post 10289759)
The worst time? How dramatic. What exactly do you think they’re going to do to you, put you in a detention centre?
Careful, you’re starting to sound like a screaming minority.. |
Originally Posted by SOPS
(Post 10287779)
Well what a complete cxxk up!!!!. Malcolm spat the dumb and resigned. He has now by his stupid, selfish. actions handed the PM position to Shorten. They should have left Abbott as PM. The put in a left wing PM, trying to run a right wing party...isolated the conservative base...and now we have a hung parliament, with Labor assured of a big win at the next election. What a mess!!! (IMHO)
Speaking of delusional, that's how I'd describe anyone who thinks Turnbull is "left wing". But regardless of what Turnbull did or didn't do, the main reason the Libs copped a flogging in Wentworth is that their salesman-in-chief is trying to sell a dodgy product that less and less people want to buy. When Morrison claims the the Libs aren't getting their message across, he's in denial. People have heard the message, they're just not interested. |
Speaking of delusional, that's how I'd describe anyone who thinks Turnbull is "left wing". Seeing as it appears that nowadays anyone espousing what would have been described back as late as the early 70's as having moderate views, is now described as being of the far right.........Well, I wonder what those people would make of Franco's Spain!:eek: |
Originally Posted by Pinky the pilot
(Post 10291066)
Seeing as it appears that nowadays anyone espousing what would have been described back as late as the early 70's as having moderate views, is now described as being of the far right.........Well, I wonder what those people would make of Franco's Spain!:eek:
My point being? Societies evolve. Definitions change. Thinking changes. I can tell you for a fact that teenagers in 2018 are far more left wing/socially minded/tolerant/impartial/broad thinking than they were in the 1970’s too. Crownstay01 is correct when be says that no one except hard core far righters would consider Turnbull a ‘Leftist’. You know, the same type who considered the Abbott Liberal Party ‘about right’. |
Originally Posted by Pinky the pilot
(Post 10291066)
Well, I certainly would not describe him as being from the right. But ok then, Crownstay01', Given that it is common knowledge that Turnbull approached Graham Richardson (and others I believe) and begged to be given a Labor spot, then of what part of the political spectrum would you place him?
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Originally Posted by Pinky the pilot
(Post 10291066)
..........what would have been described back as late as the early 70's as having moderate views, is now described as being of the far right.........
I give up. Leaders or followers of any faction inevitably consider themselves to be moderate and RIGHT, as in correct. I can assure you that a large proportion of the Oz population at the time (though not the majority, apparently) thought that Bob Menzies was further right, in his thinking, than Franco. |
Originally Posted by Pinky the pilot
(Post 10291066)
Seeing as it appears that nowadays anyone espousing what would have been described back as late as the early 70's as having moderate views, is now described as being of the far right....
Yes, if you held these positions today you would be considered a part of the 5-8% far right fringe nutters or Hanson devotees. And deservedly so. Just like that far right nutter Fraser Anning who tried to introduce a bill restricting non white immigration. What was “moderate” policy in the early 70’s is now considered the lunatic right fringe. |
And it’s a wonderful thing they are now considered “far right”. In the early 70’s “moderate” meant banning non whites from immigrating here and becoming citizens. It meant thinking gays were an abomination that deserved a good smack to the head if they dared expressed their true feelings. It meant thinking it was OK to force young people to join the military against their will and participate in a conflict they wished no part of. It was just a few years off Indigenous Australians not being considered full human beings. It meant the biggest Australian airlines still prohibited women from flying their planes. |
Originally Posted by parabellum
(Post 10291774)
and then you go on to suggest that people who support the above would be, " Hanson devotees." The only one of the above that Hanson might support would be 'immigrants becoming citizens' if they had nothing to offer Australia and their few words of English revolved around 'Centre Link'. Bad choices there dr dre!
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The far-right dilemma: How to flood the market with cheap labour without having to contend with the ones who discover that hard work is not the only option.
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I think he's just an opportunist - and that's being polite. QUOTE] I can assure you that a large proportion of the Oz population at the time (though not the majority, apparently) thought that Bob Menzies was further right, in his thinking, than Franco. [/QUOTE] Most intrigued with that comment WingNut60; Your rationale being.....? |
Originally Posted by Pinky the pilot
(Post 10292054)
I can only agree. Except that I would not be so polite M'self!
QUOTE] I can assure you that a large proportion of the Oz population at the time (though not the majority, apparently) thought that Bob Menzies was further right, in his thinking, than Franco. The background is that I was alive and remember it. If you think that Bob was held in high esteem by any faction other than his own group of sycophants then you've led a sheltered life. |
Be nice, Wingnut, the Chancellor of Melbourne Uni was King Ming himself, and it was he who shook my hand and gave me my degree back then. Seemed to be a nice bloke but firmly rooted in the 50s.
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An appropriate thread title.
Bob (Ming or Pig-Iron Bob to others) was the man who committed Oz to Vietnam on a dubious and never-substantiated request from the South Vietnamese government for assistance. You would think that such a request might have been made formally and to have been documented. No such records exist. 500 dead, 200 of them conscripts. Quite a guy. Were you wearing rose-coloured glasses with that mortarboard? |
A 'moderate' Liberal Party backbencher - Craig Laundy - was interviewed by The Guardian, the podcast of which is available here: https://www.theguardian.com/australi...s-live-podcast
I can recommend that those interested in politics take the time to listen. I do wonder if Laundy's more reactionary and conservative colleagues have the ability to heed the lessons? |
Originally Posted by Ken Borough
(Post 10292761)
A 'moderate' Liberal Party backbencher - Craig Laundy - was interviewed by The Guardian, the podcast of which is available here: https://www.theguardian.com/australi...s-live-podcast
I can recommend that those interested in politics take the time to listen. I do wonder if Laundy's more reactionary and conservative colleagues have the ability to heed the lessons? Like Laundy said moderates like him who try to reach across the aisle to make good policies are seen as “traitors” by the conservative Liberals. A decent swing against the LNP at the next election would see Laundy lose his seat, which would be a shame, as he sounds like a sensible future leader in the party. Better than some reactionaries who would be circling like vultures at that opportunity. |
Next Federal Election
With the current situation in Australia I am voting Independent or maybe Greens. There is a need to manage energy prices better and also to have medicinal cannabis legal for those that need it. FWIW |
Originally Posted by Eddie Dean
(Post 10292863)
With the current situation in Australia I am voting Independent or maybe Greens. There is a need to manage energy prices better and also to have medicinal cannabis legal for those that need it. FWIW https://reasonvic.org.au/policy/ They seem to have a bunch of good policies, and want drug law reform as well. |
Originally Posted by dr dre
(Post 10292886)
If they don’t take your fancy (and you’re in Victoria), check out this party: (disclaimer-I’m not a party member or live in Victoria) https://reasonvic.org.au/policy/ They seem to have a bunch of good policies, and want drug law reform as well. Interesting reading about the the latest legislation in Canada on cannabis laws. NZ is having a referendum soon on the same issue and appears will be passed. Or atleast voted in. It will be up to their parliament to make it law. |
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-11-...bings/10483788
Bourke Street attack in Melbourne CBD being treated as a terrorism incidentThe attacker shot dead by police was known to intelligence authorities before he crashed his car loaded with gas bottles in the Melbourne CBD and stabbed three people. |
Originally Posted by ORAC
(Post 10306225)
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-11-...bings/10483788
Bourke Street attack in Melbourne CBD being treated as a terrorism incidentThe attacker shot dead by police was known to intelligence authorities before he crashed his car loaded with gas bottles in the Melbourne CBD and stabbed three people. |
Reports are that one of those stabbed has since died.
Another [insert rude word here] extremist trying to impose their views on society - a relatively rare occurrence (8 attacks, 6 deaths in the last 4 years) which is probably a reflection on the good work being done behind the scenes by police and others. From the limited vision of online videos it appears the police made numerous attempts to disarm him using just their batons and bare hands(!) before he was shot. I know they are "only" doing their job, but their display of bravery in trying to capture him, instead of shooting 'on sight', impressed me. Given they made many attempts to capture him, I wonder if they considered, or even had available, tasers or mace or similar? Captured terrorist perpetrators are often useful sources of intelligence. |
Originally Posted by Hempy
(Post 10306293)
Imagine what things would have been like if he could have easily got his hands on a high powered semi-automatic rifle
Police showed a lot more patience than I would have. |
Reported just now...from Somalia. And yelling, you can guess, as he was stabbing people.
How come these people are always "known to the police" after they carry out an attack. If he was "known to police" and on a terror watch list, why was he not on the first aircraft out of Australia? |
Originally Posted by layman
(Post 10306325)
Given they made many attempts to capture him, I wonder if they considered, or even had available, tasers or mace or similar?
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Originally Posted by SOPS
(Post 10306353)
Reported just now...from Somalia. And yelling, you can guess, as he was stabbing people.
How come these people are always "known to the police" after they carry out an attack. If he was "known to police" and on a terror watch list, why was he not on the first aircraft out of Australia? |
Originally Posted by Hempy
(Post 10306293)
Imagine what things would have been like if he could have easily got his hands on a high powered semi-automatic rifle
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Originally Posted by layman
(Post 10306325)
Given they made many attempts to capture him, I wonder if they considered, or even had available, tasers or mace or similar? Captured terrorist perpetrators are often useful sources of intelligence.
I am proud of the job they did, attempting to subdue first without firearms, and then a single clean shot when things started to deteriorate. In the States I can imagine it could have easily ended up a spray-and-pray with civilians caught in the crossfire. |
" In the States I can imagine it could have easily ended up a spray-and-pray with civilians caught in the crossfire."
Really? Lindt Cafe siege refers. |
Originally Posted by currawong
(Post 10307085)
" In the States I can imagine it could have easily ended up a spray-and-pray with civilians caught in the crossfire."
Really? Lindt Cafe siege refers. It turns out the chap who fired the only bullet yesterday was only three months out of the academy. A job well done. |
Originally Posted by chuboy
(Post 10307122)
That was, rightfully, subject to quite some criticism indeed - especially since it was the special response team and not your run of the mill beat cops who ended up wounding the hostages.
It turns out the chap who fired the only bullet yesterday was only three months out of the academy. A job well done. |
One report mentioned that he was tasered before being shot.
If true, then the tasering had no visible effect. Perhaps because of clothing worn. |
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