mikegolf

Hey bro I am thinking to apply this weeks i don't know how long it take to them to contact you. For now i am just trying to do small revision of ATPL i hope is going to well
what about you did you got any answer until now or not yet

Hogos, it’s just a job. You’ll realise when you’ve got stuff to pay for and the novelty wears off.

Hogos

Yes, I was fully sponsored in 1982, I wouldn't be doing it otherwise

Those schemes are long gone.

The sad reality is this, paid for Type Ratings are on their way out.

The pay to fly game has been around for the last 15 to 20 years I remember a old colleague of mine being part of a UK 737 and 757 operator who had a spin off training dept, cadets paid for Type Ratings and hours on type, I even trained a few of them. Some of the students got job offers at the end others did not. It is not just Ryanair doing this. Eagle jet is still at it, I know Stefan used to send the 737 cadets to Morocco, not sure where they go now.

There is of course a way to stop it, simply stop playing for it, but of course someone will do and because of this Ryanair and others will continue to hoover up those that are willing to pay, moaning about it, well it is not going to help or do anything, it has all been said before.

I don't really understand why you all are crying, one RYR Captain friend of mine whom I had a short friendly call today told me the for the last 3 months they are flying exactly like pre-covid. He is based in BUD. He flew 75 block hrs in July. So if we won't go back to 0 during winter, which we probably won't do again, then I think that the Type-rating course is not that big of a gamble anymore! + WIZZ Just announced that they start hiring pilots again. :) But lots of crybabys are here, and you can't do anything about to shup them up.

Hi! Let’s assume you are right! My only question is what do you suggest if someone just finished flight training and already spent so much money to become an airline pilot. You say it’s not the perfect opportunity now. But what to do now then? Go to work in a warehouse tomorrow? And wait for better times and start the training then paying the same money or more for it? And totally forget everything about planes?

FlyHigh737

Amen to that.

I can confirm we are all pretty busy. I'm UK based, 60 hrs in July with two blocks annual leave. 80 hrs rostered for August.

The flying is not the problem, the passenger load is. Flights to the east are full, like pre covid, while holiday destinations in South Europe sucks and some routes you lucky to get 40 pax
Should get better from this week and autumn will be busy, the base I'm in is getting three more aircraft for the winter. It's looking good.

Because people started paying for them!

It just goes to show how little the haters on here know about what is going on in the company. They are operating on average 2200 flights per day with an average 80% load factor, yet they still think the flight decks are purely filled with cadets and trainers, whilst everyone else is sat at home twiddling their thumbs.

Contact Approach
Here's a bombshell for you, Ryanair was not the first to do it. BMI started way earlier.

Who cares who started what? The fact remains that people still paid. Ive never once paid for a TR and wouldnt even now. The dream was to be employed, paid well and looked after by my employer, regardless if that was a flying job or not. To get yourself into a mountain of debt for a job which offers insufficient means/security to pay it back is just plain stupid.

At this point we don't have the luxury to deny or choose a a pilot job. So long as you fly and get paid enough to live decently is a fortune if one can achieve it. Self funded type rating or even worse p2f is a trend that started long before covid and unfortunately is not going to stop any time soon. It's a fact that we can't avoid. I don't think that any airline in the near future will pay to train its cadets.
But what Ryanair is doing is another thing. Apart from the fact that they charge the applicant with an exorbitant amount of money for the type rating they do not guarantee a job thereafter.

Contact Approach

Assuming you've got much more experience than me, what did you do when this issue first started taking place? And what have the other pilots back then done to try and stop the issue from worsening?
Absolutely nothing because it did not affect them. Don't blame new pilots, blame the old guard that did not give a :mad: about it.

Waiting on the sideline won't bring unicorns either.

Contact Approach

Great example of "boomer thinking": we entered an amazing job market costing us nothing, then completely :mad: it up and we're now blaming the ones trying to get in paying their own TR.

What are you on about?
There’s zero boomerism here and in what way did anyone who got their training paid for :mad: it up?!. Only those who have paid for a TR or p2f are to blame

When they started to screw up low hours you did nothing because you were experienced. Now they're coming to you and you're blaming low hours paying for TR when they have litereally no alternative.

Do you think I did enjoy a 25k bill to join the "orange family"? Well, spoiled alert: I did not.
If people are willing to pay such sums to enter the industry you should ask yourself what their plans B/C/D are. And before you start the old saying "get a degree and", I've already got my engineering degree, and given the available "opportunities" I can assure you paying 25k (same story with 50k or more) still made A LOT of sense financially speaking.
And before the "military route" comes in, last time I could have applied (age limit) there were 24 (twentyfour) flying positions for the entire country, with a mandatory service period of 18 (eighteen) years (initial training excluded). No thanks.

Now let me ask you one thing: who was the first to pay (bond included), low hours entering the market or experienced switching company (OCC course, new TR, etc)?

I got an offer with a :mad: company with bad pay and conditions ....and guess what I declined my first job back in 2016 . I finished my training in 2013 got a proper job in 2017 ...no regrets !

I got an offer right after training for one of the best (if not the best) company of the entire EU, asking me 25k to join. No regrets, both professionaly and financially!

4 years with a "normal" job would had cost me a lot more than 6k/year. Even more considering the 4 years of lost service/experience/hours.

Theholdingpoint

Yes man, this is the correct way of thinking. Do you mind if I ask which company it was? :)