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Rejection for me. Some of you will think I'm crazy, but there you go.
Anybody been successful care to share their background a bit. Thought I was suitably 'qualified' but obviously not. Good luck. |
Did they tell you why? At least...
Sorry for you. |
ChaddersCheese, if your cv arrived on my desk with this scheme listed it would go straight in the bin!
It's an appalling scheme, it undermines the pilot profession as an actual career and the poor terms and conditions are a direct threat to flight safety because when money is that tight calling in sick is not an option. It's a hard job both physically and mentally at the best of times and fatigue is no joke. Combine with this financial stress and you could start to compromise your own personal health. Nothing is worth compromising your own health for. I'm out! |
ChaddersCheese
Do your parents know about your designs on their mortgage?! In my case, the conversation was a little more complicated than "Can I borrow £xx,xxx?" So you like Poland? Have you lived there? Are you certain you'll end up based there? How do you feel about living in Serbia, Romania, Hungary, Slovakia, Ukraine, Czech Republic, Latvia, Macedonia, Bulgaria, Lithuania..? I appreciate the romantic view you have of 'the big struggle' to get into the airlines, but there are other tried and tested ways of struggling to find your way in. And they don't saddle you with such an obligation to a life in an unfamiliar country. This for a start, when it reopens. Besides anything else, you've got the best part of 50 years' working ahead of you so what's the hurry to get in a jet?! Imagine finding yourself stranded in Eastern Europe, unhappy in your job, earning little more than you would be stacking shelves at home, but unable even to quit and return to the UK lest your parents lose their home. My advice, for what it's worth - if you're that determined to get yourself into a jet at the earliest opportunity - finish your degree, get a normal job and save, save, save. Do your PPL on the side. Apply for the BA FPP, easyJet MPL, Virgin MPL etc. at every opportunity! That way, when you get in, you'll not only have a bit of money to temper the huge debt you're about to take on, but when you find your way into a jet it'll be that much sweeter. Crucially, you won't have sold yourself any shorter than the rest of us who have joined the industry in the past x years. |
While I do not condone questionable employment practices, the MPL scheme is, and has been demonstrated to be a more effective course at preparing students for a specific role. All these early posts about flying around in a single/multi piston aircraft are rubbish.
The facts are that the MPL course is no shorter, and is in fact more expensive for both the student and the operator. The main benefit is that students arrive to the airline with a higher skillset that a traditional ATPL student as they have had so much more exposure to multipilot operations. No point training a race drive in a Ford Fiesta, then give them the minimu possible training in the F1 car before throwing them on the race track. |
No point training a race drive in a Ford Fiesta, then give them the minimu possible training in the F1 car before throwing them on the race track How do they manage in the US without that fabulous MPL concept? PZ :rolleyes: |
You tell me
You tell me PZ they have plenty of good flight schools but restrictive entry criteria which is now strangling their regional airlines. Few Americans see the point in 4 years of college $40000+ costs then add on the cost of getting your licences and building your hours $150000 roughly just to start at $24000 a year!!!!!! Ha I know what I would prefer. I'm sick of the narrow minded people on here:ugh: if you don't like the MPL fine but don't criticise it out right, it has its positives and its negatives put your arguments across and let people make up their own mind.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=89ia5jf7IrY |
The wizz air program is an integrated atpl, not an mpl
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plenty of good flight schools but restrictive entry criteria which is now strangling their regional airlines. Few Americans see the point in 4 years of college $40000+ costs then add on the cost of getting your licences and building your hours $150000 roughly just to start at $24000 a year!!!!!! I'm sick of the narrow minded people on here if you don't like the MPL fine but don't criticise it out right, it has its positives and its negatives put your arguments across and let people make up their own mind. PZ:cool: |
Papa Zulu,
Where is the flaw? The MPL scheme actually trains pilots to a higher skillset and to deal with the unforeseen as well as the expected. They spend more time (pretty much double) on the specific type, dealing with more failures and difficult scenarios than the ATPL route ever does. Show me how time flying around in an SEP with no problems is better than many hours, on type, dealing with carefully constructed exercises designed to train to competency. I'm sorry but anybody that slates MPL has no idea about it. It's more expensive because base training is 12 landings. Lead in time is so much longer and it requires continuous monitoring by the company. |
Nick..re MPL..Balls Old Chap!
I assume that the 14 refers to your age...or hours... SEP time at the very least focuses the mind on the fact that 1 donkey means any engine probs needs to be addressed in short order only after selecting a suitable landing area..the aviate navigate communicate and decision making workload is high particularly when you are responsible for teaching PFLs and thus preparing SEP pilots for such an event. Of course, so is flying a single pilot NDB based SID on a piston twin with a failing or simulated failing engine in a good old UK winter low... |
Wrong on all accounts.
I do not work for CTC, I am a 737 TRI and SEP CRI with a reasonable amount of hours. I have spent the last few years researching training techniques and different courses to see where the future lies. I am tired of arguing on this forum about the pros and cons of the MPL scheme but rest assured in the fact that at least their training techniques will be used in the future. |
Nick14
So how are self-sponsored people to access the MPL? A well known UK airline informed me today that they will not allow self-sponsored candidates access the MPL course: you must be sponsored. In the end THAT is my moan: exclusivity. It appears that both ways work (worked). It is an issue that I am going to take up with my MP & MEP IF it is true that self-sponsoring is being prevented. |
One of the biggest requirements of the MPL scheme is that the student is carefully assessed and selected and is training towards a specific type and to company SOPs. A self sponsored MPL would not work well as it is difficult to train a student for a generic type, ATPL would be far better in that case.Plus the cost would be greater So it wouldn't make sense.
Don't get me wrong, MPL was never designed to be the replacement for the ATPL route as it doesn't cater for other disciplines like the single pilot world. It was purely designed to provide job specific training to airline pilots. |
No I am not.
I am merely stating that an individual cannot go to an ATO and buy an MPL, but they can a CPL. I am very well aware of the qualifications that you get following CPL/IR or as it is stated in regulation ATPL integrated course. You are also wrong in relation to jobs. You can get a job straight out of school with a CPL as many people do. |
Syntax Error, a polite message for you. Whilst you have contributed significantly to this thread with much useful information, possibly consider only making positive contributions about this course from now on. Yes it may not be right for you, but that doesn't stop it being the right thing for absolutely everyone. Im sure it's rather tedious for others having to sift through your anti-Wizz MPL rhetoric, when perhaps candidates are reading this thread for useful information so they can make an informed choice.
Maybe the old phrase, "if you don't have anything nice to say don't say anything at all," will come in handy... |
Pretty hard to make positive contributions to a thread about a course like the wizzair MPL when you see all the in's and out's, and know people who work for them.
Syntax Error obviously has a lot of knowledge and experience with wizzair and I am much more interested in reading his posts than any others. |
Just to avoid confusion, the CTC programme with Wizzair is an integrated ATPL course, not MPL! Maybe the mods could get the thread title changed if such wizardry is possible? Other than that, I concur with the majority of posts above, IMO anyone applying needs their head examining....
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Not on.
Syntax,
You've got some valid points, but once you start dragging desperate refugees and whole swathes of continents into it, you've lost the argument. In my view, you end up looking small minded, xenophobic and racist. You end up sounding far worse than the supposed "narrow minded" countries that you describe as being full of "bigots". Whatever bug is up your ar5e, I'd suggest you remove ASAP. You're sounding deranged. |
you crossed the line, off topic...I'd take that back if i were you
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Dude, get a life.
They are not even able to keep their own young people staying in their countries, because it's pretty depressing place to be for to long time, much due to their heritage of the old Soviet! The biggest increases in emigration from the UK were mostly to eastern Europe, including countries which have since joined the European Union. Eastern Europe is not for everybody, the same as you have people, who don't want to live in Africa, people who don't want to live in Middle East, people who don't want to live in - believe it or not - UK, people who don't want to live in the USA, ... Just go where you want to go and leave people who think otherwise live their own lifes. One final question to finish this debate, since it's obviously pretty pointless to continue - and since positive advertisement is often much better than the negative: who is your current employer, what are the requirements, conditions and where/how can we apply? |
Changing subject a little (although I must just add to the debate above that as a teenager I toured Eastern Europe with a black friend of mine and the racism he encountered in many places was absolutely and unbelievably appalling) I received an interesting email from CTC / Wizzair a few days ago.
It was sent to people who'd showed interest in the cadet scheme, which I had. Ultimately I decided not to apply as - much as becoming a pilot is an ambition so burning that I can't really put it in words - I regard taking a £110,000 loan in exchange for a maximum FO salary of 25,000 euros as nothing short of selling myself into slavery. Oh and don't forget the best part of two years studying without a salary thrown in for good measure. Anyway, this email offered the first 50 responders to a short survey a Wizz branded 'aspiring aviators' pack. So I answered the survey - which was three questions, essentially asking your contact details and number of hours, and that was it. Is this a sign that they didn't find enough people for the places on offer? Mathmatically, I simply can't fathom how anyone who didn't have £100,000 lying around could ever afford to undertake the scheme - and people with money lying around tend to be very careful with it... |
I saw that too
I also received that email and wondered the same thing. I have been cautious so far and not replied to it in case they actually try contacting me. := Does anyone have an insight about the initial course? They could just be looking for more bodies to subsidise for growth and pilots heading for the exit door.:suspect:
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I think most of us get the point that this is not a great scheme, but does this discussion have to keep dragging on?
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What makes me laugh is that John Smith thinks that he's the only person in this whole world that has a choice! A lot of us Pilots are very intelligent people with degrees and previous careers to fall back on. If the terms and conditions are not suitable in the future then we will simply do something else for a living and fly for fun on the weekends!
Anyone who is considering this scheme needs to visit a therapist. The terms and conditions on offer are insane at best. |
Back to the subject...: Integrated Wizz Training
Guys, that would be interesting to know how went the selections, i am curious to hear more from the Wizz wannabes... Txs!
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1) Why should Wizz (or any airline) not exploit a workforce that shows no interest in fighting back?
Thats a rational statement. All Wizz air bases are in former Soviet Union countries and their associated satellite countries. The employee - employer relationship is very different in these countries to Western Europe. As mentioned in a previous post an attempt was made to start a union in Budapest and all involved were dismissed. The rights that employees have to be represented and form a union falls far short of western standards in most of cases. Dismissing an employee is also far easier and in many cases you won't have a leg to stand on in this part of the world. The reason that Wizz Air should treat the workforce well is because this is how you expand a business. If you treat the employees well, they will treat the customers well and keep them coming back. They will keep the AOG time low and save fuel etc. In the end having employees which care and respect a company saves far more money than having a bunch of angry, annoyed and overworked individuals who will increase your costs in all sorts of hidden ways. That extra 5 minutes on the APU, that extra bit of breaking action and those fake sickies that people throw all add up! 2) Why should Wizz (or any airline) not offer exploitative terms and conditions to new joiners when there is a never ending queue of people willing to join them? Because the better terms and conditions generally attract the better people with more experience who are cheaper to train and generally stay longer. This is a far better business principle than constantly having to recruit and train new employees. This also allows for you to develop excellence within your organisation. If people are retained for many years they can often go on to do great things for a company. Just take a look at BA, many former Cadet entry pilots are now TRE/TRI's within the company. I doubt that any wizz cadets will be sticking around for long enough for this to happen as the terms offered are so poor that they will jump at the first opportunity. I've had a number of employers in my lifetime and I've come to realise that bad employers will always be bad and good ones will always be good! My advice is stick to the good ones for as long as you can and avoid working for bad companies such as Wizz. John Smith, good luck with the career change, now please get off this forum and leave it to rest of us to dish out the advice! We are only trying to help guide people in the right direction in the end! |
To answer my question, do you think NO job is better than a job at Wizz Air? |
Once again most people who are looking down on this scheme are people who have employment as a commercial airline pilot. I have to say that I agree with Syntax, if you've got the ridiculous sum of money they insist on charging down the back of your sofa and you won't miss it then go for it. It could actually be a good opportunity to use them to get on to the ladder and move on as you say (if you're lucky!) and if you can't you have only lost pocket change. If however, you would have to take out an enormous loan or remortgage your folks home then you really need a mental health check up! Bearing in mind your wages would only just cover the loan repayments how do you expect to have any sort of life? You say you could move on after 3 years...what if you can't for whatever reason? You don't make the cut for other airlines or there is another recession for example? Maybe you consider these things unlikely but you can never truly know for sure. You would be stuck at Wizz, possibly living in the arse end of nowhere, no life, a mortgage sized loan, no money for yourself and possibly the threat of losing your parents home as you can't keep up with the repayments. And don't forget you need to add the training time on to the top of that 3 years so could be at least 5 years of that sh*t! Don't get me wrong, I want to be a pilot as much as anyone on here but this scheme just isn't a viable option. To answer your question I would actually rather be looking for a job for 3 years than to even consider this scheme. At least you could have some form of a life working another job while you job hunt. Just take the advice you've been given from the guys that are flying as they are in a much better position to give advice and you really should use this to your advantage. After all there hasn't been one Wizz pilot on here defending the company and offering counter arguments to all the negatives that have been posted about it. |
747pro
You are indeed in a very lucky position then! I guess you will be applying for the EZY MPL as well? Perhaps the Wizz MPL could work out for you as an alternative, however it still doesn't take away from the fact that the more people that accept these lousy T&Cs the more it will spread throughout the industry. That being said, I'm sure there will be an influx of people that apply to this scheme and nothing will change that so why shouldn't you use it to your advantage? Just don't complain on here in 3 years time how bad it is :} Couldn't agree with you more regarding the modular route...hence that's the reason why I'm doing it that way :ok: |
Wizz Air at it again
It looks like Wizz Air are at it again they have just opened up two new training programmes with CTC as I suspected a few weeks ago this time they're aimed at PPL holders for more details see the CTC website. The really strange thing is during a Facebook Q&A it was revealed that they haven't even chosen candidates for their original integrated ATPL scheme which should have been done in September. CTC claimed they were waiting to hear back from Wizz Air but felt happy to go ahead with these new programmes $$$$$$$ :ugh:
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CTC WIZZ
The programmes seems to be a disaster, a lot a turning now into modular training and applying later on. Even the EZY MPL has some issues to get people onboard.... Training schools are fighting to get people in, events, roadshows, .... and wiz for sure is the last chosen programme
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Hi,
Wizz air gonna recruit ! I read it on article. I'm looking 4 a TRA320-does anyone know an ATO ? I've seen one new not far from me in AIx en Provence de vinci aero (A320 type rating VINCI Aero). Can you advise me ? Thnks |
Wizz will be forever need to be recruiting, as that's how they have structured their company, Wizz is a training company, unless you are a local from one of the countries Wizz are based in. Has anyone applied as NTR-experienced with this lot? Not really after opinions on T&Cs but rather trying to understand how their recruitment ticks... PZ :confused: |
I know many people that got in the last six months, all of them with experience but not typed.
From the business jet guy with 1000 or 2000 hours total to the guy with 4000 hours instruction/aerial work but no turboprop or jet time. They are running recruitment on a weekly basis in Budapest, from what I understand. |
From the business jet guy with 1000 or 2000 hours total to the guy with 4000 hours instruction/aerial work but no turboprop or jet time. What happened to the open-days? Haven't seen a venue advertised for ages... PZ :cool: |
Open days would certainly help to get an assessment, but the last one was held in february I believe.
Apparently it doesn't hurt to have someone inside the company vouching for you, from what I have been told. |
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