working (jobs) in America?
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working (jobs) in America?
Hi there,
I'm am (as of last week in fact) the proud owner of a FULL UK ATPL. I am currently working for a UK cargo airline flying a relativly old (but really nice) aircraft. I am looking to spead my wings and, like 99% of people on this site, would like to fly something big, fast and shiney, espaecially if its got BOEING or AIRBUS written on the side.
What I want to know is would any US carriers consider employing a British ATPL holder and if so, is it possible to be based in the UK? To give you an idea, I'm thinking along the lines of Continental B757 based at BHX.
I realise that this is a 'perfect world' scenario but one can only hope.
Happy flying...
I'm am (as of last week in fact) the proud owner of a FULL UK ATPL. I am currently working for a UK cargo airline flying a relativly old (but really nice) aircraft. I am looking to spead my wings and, like 99% of people on this site, would like to fly something big, fast and shiney, espaecially if its got BOEING or AIRBUS written on the side.
What I want to know is would any US carriers consider employing a British ATPL holder and if so, is it possible to be based in the UK? To give you an idea, I'm thinking along the lines of Continental B757 based at BHX.
I realise that this is a 'perfect world' scenario but one can only hope.
Happy flying...
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working in the US of A ??
hi folks,
Anybody had any experience of working in the US after flight training ie: instructing, corporate, bush flying anything really. If so how did you get on with the legalities of the situation.
i'm to going out to Florida very soon on an M-1 visa ( apparently with the hours I've got I can't get the J-1 ), I've been told by some schools that you can't work ( or get paid to be precise ) on an M-1 visa, yet others say you can. Now I'm no lawyer so checking the US immigration web site has done little except increase my ever expanding bald patch.!! Any pointers folks ??
thanks
Anybody had any experience of working in the US after flight training ie: instructing, corporate, bush flying anything really. If so how did you get on with the legalities of the situation.
i'm to going out to Florida very soon on an M-1 visa ( apparently with the hours I've got I can't get the J-1 ), I've been told by some schools that you can't work ( or get paid to be precise ) on an M-1 visa, yet others say you can. Now I'm no lawyer so checking the US immigration web site has done little except increase my ever expanding bald patch.!! Any pointers folks ??
thanks
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captmav,
No, The Greaser is right. You cannot work on an M-1 visa, however many US flight schools have found sort of a 'loop-hole' around this. They can not pay you to work, but they can give you what they call a 'housing-allowance' which cannot exceed 1000-1100 US dollars a month I believe. This is tax-free by the way. I know it's not very much at all, but at least it will pay for most of your living-expenses. Some schools will not even give you this 'housing-allowance' so my advice to you is to check with several different schools before commiting to one. Hope this helps!
No, The Greaser is right. You cannot work on an M-1 visa, however many US flight schools have found sort of a 'loop-hole' around this. They can not pay you to work, but they can give you what they call a 'housing-allowance' which cannot exceed 1000-1100 US dollars a month I believe. This is tax-free by the way. I know it's not very much at all, but at least it will pay for most of your living-expenses. Some schools will not even give you this 'housing-allowance' so my advice to you is to check with several different schools before commiting to one. Hope this helps!
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Illegal employment
NO!
I suggest that you look at the US Embassy web site.
As long as you are taking a job away from a US citizen (ie FI) then this is classed as working whether for renumeration or not. Even if you did not get the "housing allowance" it is still illegal.
Those schools that are offering employment are doing so illegally - you bet that if they get caught they will say that they, the school, were not aware and you, the pilot, will be the one to lose. You will be escorted out of the US and barred from coming back for quite some time.
In this day and age I cannot believe that people are willing to push the law on this subject.
To work in the US, whether for pay or not, you need one of the following:
J1
H1B
L1
Green Card
If you do not have the above then you are illegal.
Facts.
I suggest that you look at the US Embassy web site.
As long as you are taking a job away from a US citizen (ie FI) then this is classed as working whether for renumeration or not. Even if you did not get the "housing allowance" it is still illegal.
Those schools that are offering employment are doing so illegally - you bet that if they get caught they will say that they, the school, were not aware and you, the pilot, will be the one to lose. You will be escorted out of the US and barred from coming back for quite some time.
In this day and age I cannot believe that people are willing to push the law on this subject.
To work in the US, whether for pay or not, you need one of the following:
J1
H1B
L1
Green Card
If you do not have the above then you are illegal.
Facts.
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Facts Not Fiction Pls,
I'm sorry to burst your bubble, but you are wrong.... All the school need to do is enroll this instructor in an 141 ATP-program and say that he is gaining experience towards his ATP certificate. As long as the instructor does not have the ATP requirements this is 100% legal. Of course the school need to have an approved ATP program in order to do this. However, it may be hard to make this work, since you legally can only have 1 'unit' of experience for every 4 'units' of school. So, if you went to school 12 months, you can work/gain experience for 3 months.
I'm sorry to burst your bubble, but you are wrong.... All the school need to do is enroll this instructor in an 141 ATP-program and say that he is gaining experience towards his ATP certificate. As long as the instructor does not have the ATP requirements this is 100% legal. Of course the school need to have an approved ATP program in order to do this. However, it may be hard to make this work, since you legally can only have 1 'unit' of experience for every 4 'units' of school. So, if you went to school 12 months, you can work/gain experience for 3 months.
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Regional Guy
No bubble to burst as long as we get to the facts.
Been there, seen it, got the T-shirt.
What you suggest is work - you are working as a flight Instructor and therefore replacing a US citizen. It doesn't matter if you get paid or not, it is still illegal.
You are correct that you can work under a M1 Visa for 1 month for every 4 that you train. However, in the US where you can get your FI from scratch in 6 months doesn't give you much room.
In addition, you can bet the school is charging for the Instructor even though they are not paying the Instructor.
The whole purpose of the M1 is to flight train. The J1 gives you the right to Instruct. If you don't believe me then here's the link:
http://www.usembassy.org.uk/cons_web...iv/student.htm
<<Work: Holders of M-1 visas may only engage in employment if it is a required part of their practical training and the employment has been approved in advance by the office of the Immigration and Naturalization Service. >>
Flight Instruction is not a prerequisite of an ATP course.
In addition, I can confirm that the Immigration department will not approve you as there are way too many Instructors out of work in the US due to Sept. 11.
Here's to doing it right!
Facts
Been there, seen it, got the T-shirt.
What you suggest is work - you are working as a flight Instructor and therefore replacing a US citizen. It doesn't matter if you get paid or not, it is still illegal.
You are correct that you can work under a M1 Visa for 1 month for every 4 that you train. However, in the US where you can get your FI from scratch in 6 months doesn't give you much room.
In addition, you can bet the school is charging for the Instructor even though they are not paying the Instructor.
The whole purpose of the M1 is to flight train. The J1 gives you the right to Instruct. If you don't believe me then here's the link:
http://www.usembassy.org.uk/cons_web...iv/student.htm
<<Work: Holders of M-1 visas may only engage in employment if it is a required part of their practical training and the employment has been approved in advance by the office of the Immigration and Naturalization Service. >>
Flight Instruction is not a prerequisite of an ATP course.
In addition, I can confirm that the Immigration department will not approve you as there are way too many Instructors out of work in the US due to Sept. 11.
Here's to doing it right!
Facts
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Facts Not Fiction Pls,
First let me say I'm sorry if I was rude... Trust me, I've been through that whole thing with INS and visas also and I didn't like it too much. It did force me to learn some of the immigration rules regarding flight-training though. I agree with you that the "4:1" rule will not get you very far in most cases over in the States. BUT, if you come over to the US on an M-1 without any prior flight-training, and it takes you a year or more to finish all your ratings, then at least you can instruct for a few months after you fill out the proper paperwork. But on the other hand, if you had no prior flight-training you could get a J-1 instead, which is a much better alternative these days.
And yes, of course the school will charge the student for the instructor, even if they don't pay him. How many flight-schools provide free flight-instruction???
I think that a lot of schools that 'enroll' instructors in an ATP program and let them teach are under the understanding that in order for a student to get his ATP he needs to build time, and that flight instruction is a valid way of reaching that goal.
I am very glad I'm done with the whole visa thing, a green-card makes it a whole lot easier to work and live in the States.
First let me say I'm sorry if I was rude...
Trust me, I've been through that whole thing with INS and visas also and I didn't like it too much. It did force me to learn some of the immigration rules regarding flight-training though. I agree with you that the "4:1" rule will not get you very far in most cases over in the States. BUT, if you come over to the US on an M-1 without any prior flight-training, and it takes you a year or more to finish all your ratings, then at least you can instruct for a few months after you fill out the proper paperwork. But on the other hand, if you had no prior flight-training you could get a J-1 instead, which is a much better alternative these days.And yes, of course the school will charge the student for the instructor, even if they don't pay him. How many flight-schools provide free flight-instruction???
I think that a lot of schools that 'enroll' instructors in an ATP program and let them teach are under the understanding that in order for a student to get his ATP he needs to build time, and that flight instruction is a valid way of reaching that goal.
I am very glad I'm done with the whole visa thing, a green-card makes it a whole lot easier to work and live in the States.
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oof, well thanks for that so far guys..!!
So how do you legally work, i've been told that work visa's, green cards etc are almost impossible to get. It would be nice to hear from some of the flight schools that monitor this forum and have them explain their do's and don'ts, so if you're reading this folks lets have your input.....!
So how do you legally work, i've been told that work visa's, green cards etc are almost impossible to get. It would be nice to hear from some of the flight schools that monitor this forum and have them explain their do's and don'ts, so if you're reading this folks lets have your input.....!
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Captmav
You say with the hours you have you are unable to apply for a J1. How many might that be??? As long as you do not hold a Commercial licence then you are allowed to apply for a J1 visa. May I suggest that you try more than one J1 school.....
A M1 visa for work purposes isn't worth the paper it is written on. Every school that you talk to that isn't registered for J1 will tell you how great a M1 is. Thats because they aren't registered for the J1 visa. The application process for the J1 visa is very difficult. I worked at a school for 2 years that told students it will happen SOON......
If you were born in England, Scotland or Wales and want a Green Card try marriage to a US citizen it's about that open.
You say with the hours you have you are unable to apply for a J1. How many might that be??? As long as you do not hold a Commercial licence then you are allowed to apply for a J1 visa. May I suggest that you try more than one J1 school.....
A M1 visa for work purposes isn't worth the paper it is written on. Every school that you talk to that isn't registered for J1 will tell you how great a M1 is. Thats because they aren't registered for the J1 visa. The application process for the J1 visa is very difficult. I worked at a school for 2 years that told students it will happen SOON......
If you were born in England, Scotland or Wales and want a Green Card try marriage to a US citizen it's about that open.
Last edited by Rotorbike; 18th May 2002 at 13:29.
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rotorbike,
I only have about 170 TT, CAA PPL but the school has told me if you have more thatn 60 hrs TT then you are not eligable ( or however you spell it !! ) so if somebody can enlighten me...!!
thanks,
I only have about 170 TT, CAA PPL but the school has told me if you have more thatn 60 hrs TT then you are not eligable ( or however you spell it !! ) so if somebody can enlighten me...!!
thanks,
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Hi !
You can still get a J1-visa with flight experience. You'll just enroll as an "advanced student". That's what I did... I had some 86 hours total time and a JAA PPL when I started my training under a J1-visa. Never regretted a day of my 2 years in the States, it was a lot of fun!
polar bear
You can still get a J1-visa with flight experience. You'll just enroll as an "advanced student". That's what I did... I had some 86 hours total time and a JAA PPL when I started my training under a J1-visa. Never regretted a day of my 2 years in the States, it was a lot of fun!
polar bear
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Captmav
I believe you should try another school. You should be able to find a US school to accept you on a J1 program as long as you don't have a FAA Commercial licence.
Just may not be as able to choose your location
I believe you should try another school. You should be able to find a US school to accept you on a J1 program as long as you don't have a FAA Commercial licence.
Just may not be as able to choose your location
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Try contacting North American Institute of Aviation (NAIA) in South Carolina.Believe their website is www.naiasc.com
Hapy hunting!
Hapy hunting!
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captmav,
Getting a work-visa or green-card in the States, specially these days, are VERY hard. Unless you marry an american you are pretty much out of luck...
Oh, and englishal: If you have a green-card you can pretty much get the same jobs that any american can get. There are a few exceptions, but it's mostly no problem. The only problem now is that since after 9/11 the US government passed a bill requiring non-US citizens to go through a 45-day background check before starting type-training on a large aircraft (unless you already have PIC, SIC of FE qualifications on large aircraft). However, as we speak, there is no government agency to conduct this background check. Until they get that sorted out, you cannot receive training. The US government is in the proccess of putting up a web-site that will take care of this background check a lot faster than the 45-day period. Last time I talked to them, they said it would probably take about 2-3 days.
Getting a work-visa or green-card in the States, specially these days, are VERY hard. Unless you marry an american you are pretty much out of luck...
Oh, and englishal: If you have a green-card you can pretty much get the same jobs that any american can get. There are a few exceptions, but it's mostly no problem. The only problem now is that since after 9/11 the US government passed a bill requiring non-US citizens to go through a 45-day background check before starting type-training on a large aircraft (unless you already have PIC, SIC of FE qualifications on large aircraft). However, as we speak, there is no government agency to conduct this background check. Until they get that sorted out, you cannot receive training. The US government is in the proccess of putting up a web-site that will take care of this background check a lot faster than the 45-day period. Last time I talked to them, they said it would probably take about 2-3 days.
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Freak On A Leash
Guess you have not seen what happened to NAIA with week!
Their facility burnt down - check out their web site.
As for J1:
The J1 the cut off point is PPL and 50 hours post PPL.
Also the generalization re schools with and without the J1 is a bit off - unless you can tell me you have spoken to all the the school out there ie you are calling all M1 approved schools liars!!!! Not a good place to start a topic or inquiry!
If you are Irish, you are open to the Green Card lottery, however the British are barred from it as we took up out allotted numbers about 10 years ago.
Check out the US Embassy website as for anyone interested it has all the options available.
Good luck!
Their facility burnt down - check out their web site.
As for J1:
The J1 the cut off point is PPL and 50 hours post PPL.
Also the generalization re schools with and without the J1 is a bit off - unless you can tell me you have spoken to all the the school out there ie you are calling all M1 approved schools liars!!!! Not a good place to start a topic or inquiry!
If you are Irish, you are open to the Green Card lottery, however the British are barred from it as we took up out allotted numbers about 10 years ago.
Check out the US Embassy website as for anyone interested it has all the options available.
Good luck!
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Green Card Insufficient
I am fortunate enough to hold a green card, but it is not proving to be very useful at the moment.
See the US Military Contracts thread in the Freight Dogs forum
See the US Military Contracts thread in the Freight Dogs forum
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Working in the U.S.A
Soon I will have the right to live and work in the U.S.A. My question is do you require an FAA license in the U.S.A to fly G registered aircraft, if so what is the cost and how long would it take realistically to acquire an FAA license.
Regards
R
Regards
R