Just looking for some advice-from Canada
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Canada
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Just looking for some advice-from Canada
Hello all,
Rather new to this board, but I'm just looking for some advice from you folks. I will apologize in advance for the seemingly "silly" questions, as I live in Canada (as the title says) and I have relatively little knowledge of the European aviation system in general.
Currently I hold my CPL/MIFR and have a good job flying Metroliners as an FO in Canada. I have just over 400 hours (low time) and have age on my side. The dream for me has been to move accross the Atlantic to fly in Europe as a career, and recently I found out I am able to claim German citizenship, so naturally, I jumped at the chance.
I'm wondering how to get in to major companies in the EU, Lufthansa, Aer Lingus, Air France, BA, etc. Being a Canadian, I don't know much about the EU aviation system-I do know I need to do the JAA conversions on my licenses, but what is the ATPL requirements over there? In Canada it's 1500 hours Total, along with several provisions, and 21 years of age. Do you need ATPLs to get on at most companies, even as an FO? What is a typical hour requirement at the companies listed above?
I don't have a degree (do you need one to get on at most major companies over there? I know you don't here in Canada, but in the US for most majors you do), and I don't speak any language other than English, but have always wanted to learn another one, preferrably German.
Just wondering if anyone out there can pass down some information, advice, comments, to myself, it would really be much appreciated!
Thanks!
CC
Rather new to this board, but I'm just looking for some advice from you folks. I will apologize in advance for the seemingly "silly" questions, as I live in Canada (as the title says) and I have relatively little knowledge of the European aviation system in general.
Currently I hold my CPL/MIFR and have a good job flying Metroliners as an FO in Canada. I have just over 400 hours (low time) and have age on my side. The dream for me has been to move accross the Atlantic to fly in Europe as a career, and recently I found out I am able to claim German citizenship, so naturally, I jumped at the chance.
I'm wondering how to get in to major companies in the EU, Lufthansa, Aer Lingus, Air France, BA, etc. Being a Canadian, I don't know much about the EU aviation system-I do know I need to do the JAA conversions on my licenses, but what is the ATPL requirements over there? In Canada it's 1500 hours Total, along with several provisions, and 21 years of age. Do you need ATPLs to get on at most companies, even as an FO? What is a typical hour requirement at the companies listed above?
I don't have a degree (do you need one to get on at most major companies over there? I know you don't here in Canada, but in the US for most majors you do), and I don't speak any language other than English, but have always wanted to learn another one, preferrably German.
Just wondering if anyone out there can pass down some information, advice, comments, to myself, it would really be much appreciated!
Thanks!
CC
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: UK
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Hi Crazy_Canuck and welcome to Prune!
Re: Canada to EASA conversion. I did this and got my UK JAA (now EASA) licence in spring 2008. I had been in a similar position to you, working for an Air Taxi operation (YVR) and doing ok in general.
When I jumped (back to Europe) the market was still ok and relatively buoyant (2007 ish) Airlines were hiring, and taking on guys with sub 1000hrs TT and no type rating or experience on type. Some regional commuter airlines were absorbing newly minted CPL'ers at quite a rapid rate.
The conversion for someone in your (our) case (less than 1500hrs TT and a portion of that on heavy metal) is pretty intensive. 14 written ATPL exams, around 800 hrs of theory study (which can be done via distance learning but requires two sessions "in house" to solidify the stuff learnt at home) and then a CPL flight test and an IR flight test. All this takes some time - in my case around 12 months.
Unfortunately at the time I qualified (so spring 2008) the music rapidly began to stop with regard to hiring in the traditional way. Europe hit recession and a ton of experienced TP and jet drivers were laid off. I was lucky enough to get in to a regional TP operator hold pool, although I am still there now and have spent nearly 3 years doing bits of flying here and there and keeping current ratings - which cost of course.
Bottom line - the industry now in Europe bears no resemblance to that of Canada. What used to be a decent industry now requires you to more or less purchase your own jet type rating to get anywhere. In fact, a majority of airlines expect you to have a valid TR with recent time on type - gone are the days of getting hired and bonded for the TR or even the TR being funded by the airline.
Expect to pay min £10-15K to convert. There's very little smaller aircraft / air taxi / cargo in Europe on stuff like Metro's or PA31's etc. So you would probably have to look at a TR as well, in the region of UK£25-30K. This would be assuming you were offered a job on a jet - under any circumstance don't do what some do and cough up the money with no job offer at all.
My best advice to you - stay in Canada for now. Europe has become a place where airlines know guys are out there just desperate to fly and will pay up front for it. Sorry to sound negative but get experience on TP's or jets in Canada. Then when you have a TR with time on type, convert at that point, get the TR put on your EASA licence and come and see what you can get here.
Best of luck!
Re: Canada to EASA conversion. I did this and got my UK JAA (now EASA) licence in spring 2008. I had been in a similar position to you, working for an Air Taxi operation (YVR) and doing ok in general.
When I jumped (back to Europe) the market was still ok and relatively buoyant (2007 ish) Airlines were hiring, and taking on guys with sub 1000hrs TT and no type rating or experience on type. Some regional commuter airlines were absorbing newly minted CPL'ers at quite a rapid rate.
The conversion for someone in your (our) case (less than 1500hrs TT and a portion of that on heavy metal) is pretty intensive. 14 written ATPL exams, around 800 hrs of theory study (which can be done via distance learning but requires two sessions "in house" to solidify the stuff learnt at home) and then a CPL flight test and an IR flight test. All this takes some time - in my case around 12 months.
Unfortunately at the time I qualified (so spring 2008) the music rapidly began to stop with regard to hiring in the traditional way. Europe hit recession and a ton of experienced TP and jet drivers were laid off. I was lucky enough to get in to a regional TP operator hold pool, although I am still there now and have spent nearly 3 years doing bits of flying here and there and keeping current ratings - which cost of course.
Bottom line - the industry now in Europe bears no resemblance to that of Canada. What used to be a decent industry now requires you to more or less purchase your own jet type rating to get anywhere. In fact, a majority of airlines expect you to have a valid TR with recent time on type - gone are the days of getting hired and bonded for the TR or even the TR being funded by the airline.
Expect to pay min £10-15K to convert. There's very little smaller aircraft / air taxi / cargo in Europe on stuff like Metro's or PA31's etc. So you would probably have to look at a TR as well, in the region of UK£25-30K. This would be assuming you were offered a job on a jet - under any circumstance don't do what some do and cough up the money with no job offer at all.
My best advice to you - stay in Canada for now. Europe has become a place where airlines know guys are out there just desperate to fly and will pay up front for it. Sorry to sound negative but get experience on TP's or jets in Canada. Then when you have a TR with time on type, convert at that point, get the TR put on your EASA licence and come and see what you can get here.
Best of luck!
