Is it worth the £11,000 risk at 40?
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Buckingham
Age: 58
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Is it worth the £11,000 risk at 40?
I am nearly 40. CPL with 400 hours SE. Stopped instructing PPL a year ago.
Cannot decide whether to take my IR and then try for an airline career.
My heart tells me to have a ago, my head says;
Too old
Low hours
Type rating/MCC @ £20,000 to follow
Divorce to follow
On the one hand I hear " never give up" on the other "what a waste of money"
Any advice very welcome
Cannot decide whether to take my IR and then try for an airline career.
My heart tells me to have a ago, my head says;
Too old
Low hours
Type rating/MCC @ £20,000 to follow
Divorce to follow
On the one hand I hear " never give up" on the other "what a waste of money"
Any advice very welcome
Join Date: Dec 2004
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What to do?
good luck!
noone can make this call for you, but we have all been there. a good way is to cruise the recruitment webssites and get aan idea about cut off ages.
The operation I work for would probably not look at you, this is a problem you are going to keep facing I'm afraid.A suggestion my be to save your money that the IR would cost you, invest in property. stay at your present job, you wwill probably earn more doing that anyway..
Maybe left the run a bit late to fly commercially, don't let the heart rule common sense..stay as a PPL and enjoy the hobby..
noone can make this call for you, but we have all been there. a good way is to cruise the recruitment webssites and get aan idea about cut off ages.
The operation I work for would probably not look at you, this is a problem you are going to keep facing I'm afraid.A suggestion my be to save your money that the IR would cost you, invest in property. stay at your present job, you wwill probably earn more doing that anyway..
Maybe left the run a bit late to fly commercially, don't let the heart rule common sense..stay as a PPL and enjoy the hobby..
Join Date: Oct 2005
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Just to give you the other sid eof the coin, I am currently working with a turbo-prop operator in Ireland. I know recently we have hired a few FO's recently of a similar age. I think the company have no problem hiring older guys as they are deemed less likely to jump ship at the first sniff of a jet job. From my experience so far it is the older guys that will stay with the company longer as most younger guys are using it as a rung on the career ladder.
That said your age is narrowing down the options quite a bit. If it is in your head and you think that in later life you might regret not doing it then do it. Provided that is, that it wont impact too drastically on yours and your families lives.
I think with dedication, hard work and a good deal of luck there would be a job, but i would not put myself in a situation where I had to get a job flying for survival.
Just my two-pence worth, best of luck whatever you decide
Regards
R.I
That said your age is narrowing down the options quite a bit. If it is in your head and you think that in later life you might regret not doing it then do it. Provided that is, that it wont impact too drastically on yours and your families lives.
I think with dedication, hard work and a good deal of luck there would be a job, but i would not put myself in a situation where I had to get a job flying for survival.
Just my two-pence worth, best of luck whatever you decide
Regards
R.I
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I used to work once with a guy who had a gambling problem. Every lunch time he would slink off down the bookies. Nice bloke, and his modus operandi was to never bet more than he was prepared to lose.
So, in your case ask yourself the same question. If you can then there is no reason why you shouldn't persue a dream. As said before TP operators have no problem employing people of advancing years, just don't set your sights on being a 747 skipper.
In the end only you can answer this question, but if you trawl through search engine with "Am I too Old" you will find many people are in the same situation as you and the advice given is well balanced and sound.
Good Luck anyhoo.
So, in your case ask yourself the same question. If you can then there is no reason why you shouldn't persue a dream. As said before TP operators have no problem employing people of advancing years, just don't set your sights on being a 747 skipper.
In the end only you can answer this question, but if you trawl through search engine with "Am I too Old" you will find many people are in the same situation as you and the advice given is well balanced and sound.
Good Luck anyhoo.
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Join Date: Jan 2006
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Thank you all for your thoughts. Would turbo prop opperators require a type rating do you think? Also is it more than likely that relocation would be necessary (from Buckingham nr Oxford)?
Join Date: Oct 2005
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They will require a type rating but some will do it in house i.e Aer Arann. They will charge you a nice sum for the privilege.
With regards to having to move I would say almost definitely unless you are extremely lucky to find an operator close to where you are. I dont know your exact location and therefore am not sure if there are any operators nearby.
Regards
R.I
With regards to having to move I would say almost definitely unless you are extremely lucky to find an operator close to where you are. I dont know your exact location and therefore am not sure if there are any operators nearby.
Regards
R.I
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Sorry if this sounds harsh but any airline that would consider you for employment will require you to live within one hour of your operating base. With your experience and the state of the market there will be no flexibility with this, so you'll either have to move or live in B&B for most of the time (not conducive to family life). Don't even think about paying for a type rating~any company will need to give you training and an LPC/OPC anyway.
That said, it's possible that TP operators might be interested in you for reasons already given~you're unlikely to upsticks and move around due to family commitments, however most companies tend to say 'experience commesurate with age'. I think the best advice was to invest in property and fly as a hobby, but that is a decision only you can make. The only thing I would say is have a back-up plan in case after spending a lot of money no employment is forthcoming.
That said, it's possible that TP operators might be interested in you for reasons already given~you're unlikely to upsticks and move around due to family commitments, however most companies tend to say 'experience commesurate with age'. I think the best advice was to invest in property and fly as a hobby, but that is a decision only you can make. The only thing I would say is have a back-up plan in case after spending a lot of money no employment is forthcoming.
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JK
I bought myself an ATR rating last year for my 40th birthday, so far I have not succeeded in getting my self a job with any of the UK operators or the ones based in Ireland. As time rolls on more people join the ATR pool and I guess the ones fresh out of training are more attractive to a potential employers. Despite having a 1000 hours and a type-rating I still dont seem to meet the hard criteria to get a job. When possible I have always suggested my willingness to re-locate as required, however this doesn't seem to make any difference hence I presume my age is working against me.
Having said all that, I do know of people older than us who have secured jobs in recent times, so like the lottery you have to be in it to win it.
If you have any questions on my views then feel free to PM me.
cheers
MJR
I bought myself an ATR rating last year for my 40th birthday, so far I have not succeeded in getting my self a job with any of the UK operators or the ones based in Ireland. As time rolls on more people join the ATR pool and I guess the ones fresh out of training are more attractive to a potential employers. Despite having a 1000 hours and a type-rating I still dont seem to meet the hard criteria to get a job. When possible I have always suggested my willingness to re-locate as required, however this doesn't seem to make any difference hence I presume my age is working against me.
Having said all that, I do know of people older than us who have secured jobs in recent times, so like the lottery you have to be in it to win it.
If you have any questions on my views then feel free to PM me.
cheers
MJR
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I have a friend who has just finished line training on a turbo prop at age 56 after many years as a ppl instructor. I guess it comes down to being in the right place at the right time & probably who You know rather than what You know. Good luck
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As mentioned previously you will have to be willing to move where the jobs are on offer. From personal expereince I know of a number of people with varying experience low hours to over 1000 who have recently got turbo prop jobs but only after paying for a type rating. Unfortunately not everyone will be this lucky and it is a big descision as well as a large investment to make. Their success has partly been due to a number of factors such as
1. Networking, by speaking to the airlines concerned and not just
sending a cv off.
2. their willingness to move to wherever the job has become vacent
3. The fact that they were in the right place at the right time
4. A detemination to continue despite the knock backs they received while training and job hunting.
All the best in what ever you eventually decide
Chocks
1. Networking, by speaking to the airlines concerned and not just
sending a cv off.
2. their willingness to move to wherever the job has become vacent
3. The fact that they were in the right place at the right time
4. A detemination to continue despite the knock backs they received while training and job hunting.
All the best in what ever you eventually decide
Chocks
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Thanks - think I know the answer
Thanks to everyone for there messages, which have been interesting and useful. I am starting to think that I should not take the risk because my children are at an age (14 & 11) where it would be unfair to ask them to re-locate.
With many or most people willing to re-locate this may tip the scales towards giving up. Having said that, where I live is within 1 hour from Stanstead, Luton, Heathrow, Coventry and Birmingham.
In 5 years I could re-locate, although I would be 44.
Cheers
With many or most people willing to re-locate this may tip the scales towards giving up. Having said that, where I live is within 1 hour from Stanstead, Luton, Heathrow, Coventry and Birmingham.
In 5 years I could re-locate, although I would be 44.
Cheers
Join Date: Mar 1999
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Jamek, one last point. Several times (and several companies) I have lived right at the limit of the allowable commute. Almost inevitably, unless I had an 'O crack God Almighty' report time, I had to allow at least an hour and a half to two hours in order to report on time. You'd get away with it a couple of times (being late) but you wouldn't enamour yourself to the rest of the crew (particularly as you'd be the 'new' FO). Points to consider are the actual fuel cost of commuting and the wear and tear on yourself/family relationships.
Good luck.
Good luck.
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Hi Jamek
"I am starting to think I shouldn't take the risk..." There is a saying that if you think you'll fail - you're right!
Aviation is a very demanding environment both professionally and personally.
I was told at the age of 36 by an experienced BA training captain " you will probably get a job flying turboprops, but you can kiss the shiny jets goodbye - you're too old"
Last Sunday I was at Geneva airport doing the walkround of a brand new (shiny) B737NG and thought to myself how wrong that man was.
I was 40 when I got my first commercial job and now fly B737 Classics and NGs (late 40s).
It's cost me a lot of cash (never paid for a type-rating, just had some 'lucky breaks' and some good friends who put in an appropriate word for me at the right time - I'll be eternally grateful).
The downside - I'm getting divorced this year after 18 years of marriage because my wife said it was either her or the flying!
It's tough at times - but in the end the choice is yours?
Is it worth it? Yes it was for me, but maybe not for everyone.
The very best of luck in what ever you decide.
SITW
"I am starting to think I shouldn't take the risk..." There is a saying that if you think you'll fail - you're right!
Aviation is a very demanding environment both professionally and personally.
I was told at the age of 36 by an experienced BA training captain " you will probably get a job flying turboprops, but you can kiss the shiny jets goodbye - you're too old"
Last Sunday I was at Geneva airport doing the walkround of a brand new (shiny) B737NG and thought to myself how wrong that man was.
I was 40 when I got my first commercial job and now fly B737 Classics and NGs (late 40s).
It's cost me a lot of cash (never paid for a type-rating, just had some 'lucky breaks' and some good friends who put in an appropriate word for me at the right time - I'll be eternally grateful).
The downside - I'm getting divorced this year after 18 years of marriage because my wife said it was either her or the flying!
It's tough at times - but in the end the choice is yours?
Is it worth it? Yes it was for me, but maybe not for everyone.
The very best of luck in what ever you decide.
SITW
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J
Go for it, I got my first job last year age 40. I am flying jets and did not have to pay for my TR. A good friend of mine with only 350 hrs and no TR has just started with his airline last month. We both had to re-locate.
If you don't do it you will only be looking up thinking what if....
Good luck mate.
Go for it, I got my first job last year age 40. I am flying jets and did not have to pay for my TR. A good friend of mine with only 350 hrs and no TR has just started with his airline last month. We both had to re-locate.
If you don't do it you will only be looking up thinking what if....
Good luck mate.
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Dude, at the age of forty a. you probably don't much like being called dude , b. unless you just killed your wife and buried her in the back yard and need something to occupy your mind so you don't talk about it the pub of an evening I suggest that the last thing you want is the hassle and major change in your life that comes with commercial flying. If you do decide to go for it you might be very happy flying Twin Otters or something similarly small that you can "specialize" with to keep you in one place with a good lifestyle e.g. New Zealand, Caribbean. If you choose the long haul BS that's what it will probably be: unless you're very, very lucky or well connected and get a job quickly you'll slide (un)gracefully into poverty and bedsit land until you lose your medical at 60/65 without a pot to piss in. I don't want to put you off but you did ask for real opinions. What I'm saying is that it can just as easily go that way as the other (see previous replies, all of which are valid outcomes and entirely possible.) Many people are not prepared for the flip side of the coin.
Remember, there are no guarantees with any of it.
Add 3 weeks & 30% to everything, it very rarely happens in minimum time and cost.
, b. unless you just killed your wife and buried her in the back yard and need something to occupy your mind so you don't talk about it the pub of an evening I suggest that the last thing you want is the hassle and major change in your life that comes with commercial flying. If you do decide to go for it you might be very happy flying Twin Otters or something similarly small that you can "specialize" with to keep you in one place with a good lifestyle e.g. New Zealand, Caribbean. If you choose the long haul BS that's what it will probably be: unless you're very, very lucky or well connected and get a job quickly you'll slide (un)gracefully into poverty and bedsit land until you lose your medical at 60/65 without a pot to piss in. I don't want to put you off but you did ask for real opinions. What I'm saying is that it can just as easily go that way as the other (see previous replies, all of which are valid outcomes and entirely possible.) Many people are not prepared for the flip side of the coin.Remember, there are no guarantees with any of it.
Add 3 weeks & 30% to everything, it very rarely happens in minimum time and cost.
