Gay and proud(ish)
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Back2Skool,
I don't think you will encounter many problems -its your business and yours alone.
I don't shout from the rooftops that I am straight and enjoy boffing the ladies and I wouldn't expect a gay person to do the same about blokes.
Scroggs- and what is wrong with discussing modelling interests on the flight deck ? Have you confused modellers with train spotters ? I know alot of pilots who model trains,boats and planes - a harmless and constructive hobby.
It must be better than the constant cycle of flightdeck chatter that goes something like:
girls, beer,cars (yawn),rosters,pensions ...repeat until you die of boredom.
And if you cannot discuss the freemasons...surely that means alot of very quiet BA flightdecks ?or am I stereo typing ?
regards,
FTG
I don't think you will encounter many problems -its your business and yours alone.
I don't shout from the rooftops that I am straight and enjoy boffing the ladies and I wouldn't expect a gay person to do the same about blokes.
Scroggs- and what is wrong with discussing modelling interests on the flight deck ? Have you confused modellers with train spotters ? I know alot of pilots who model trains,boats and planes - a harmless and constructive hobby.
It must be better than the constant cycle of flightdeck chatter that goes something like:
girls, beer,cars (yawn),rosters,pensions ...repeat until you die of boredom.
And if you cannot discuss the freemasons...surely that means alot of very quiet BA flightdecks ?or am I stereo typing ?
regards,
FTG
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i understand the original question, but i am not sure how relivant it actually is.
i say this, because whether it is in the cockpit, an office, in the operating theatre, in a supermarket or where ever, it is just a personal choice as to where you decide to draw YOUR own line in morals and how we each decide to live our lives.
i am not going to say one way or the other, but someone who considers homosexuality to be immoral is, by definition of freedom of speech and thought, equally as correct as someone who considers it acceptable.
put it into context, if we allow people to publicly condone the death of innocent people on news interviews on tv, underground bombings and twin towers, then i guess one is allowed an opninon either way on homosexuality.
i say this, because whether it is in the cockpit, an office, in the operating theatre, in a supermarket or where ever, it is just a personal choice as to where you decide to draw YOUR own line in morals and how we each decide to live our lives.
i am not going to say one way or the other, but someone who considers homosexuality to be immoral is, by definition of freedom of speech and thought, equally as correct as someone who considers it acceptable.
put it into context, if we allow people to publicly condone the death of innocent people on news interviews on tv, underground bombings and twin towers, then i guess one is allowed an opninon either way on homosexuality.
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As a gay airline pilot I find that most of the people I work with respect me for my professionalism and consider my sexuality a private matter........ attitudes vary according to upbringing and society. In africa/ middleast its taboo and the western world more tolerant, but I find the pilots with Big egos have the most problem with a guy who is bold enough to be 'out' at work.
Innuendo is harmless, but what has got to be most important is the airline managements responsibilty and response to any clear case of discrimination towards a Gay/lesbian/muslim/black/ asian... etc pilot
Its a Great job and being in the cockpit is heavenly
Innuendo is harmless, but what has got to be most important is the airline managements responsibilty and response to any clear case of discrimination towards a Gay/lesbian/muslim/black/ asian... etc pilot
Its a Great job and being in the cockpit is heavenly
Last edited by Altostratus; 9th Aug 2005 at 14:59.
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Fade to Grey I know there are plenty of modellers within flight decks around the world (though perhaps most commonly in British carriers) - I'm one of them! However, railway modellers seem to be held in about the same level of esteem (esteam?
) as train (or aircraft) spotters... As for Masons and BA flightdecks, who knows what goes on in either institution? 
) as train (or aircraft) spotters... As for Masons and BA flightdecks, who knows what goes on in either institution?
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It's not too much a problem with F/Os - after all, monitoring an autopilot down to the flare is not so difficult, compared to other branches of aviation. But as soon as you start considering leadership and bringing a team together, quite often by virtue of example, it's another story. Everybody will agree that there is something inherently flawed in their mental picture, should it come from childhood, city life, lack of sport, or chemicals in the food - nobody cares in fact, but it is there.
Those people saying "but I'm a good professionnal " are usually in their very first years in the business - and remember, in some majors, it's close to ten years to become a Captain, so in that not-so challenging environment, it's quite tempting to get distracted with deviations.
Some years ago on a major TV Channel, a human being was interviewed (in full US Navy uniform!) while doing what they call his "coming out". He was presenting himself to the good american public as a fighter pilot. Looking more closely to the subject, it appeared that he was only a navigator on A6 - so the behaviour became more appropriate.
When you say the western world is more tolerant, try to be a little bit more accurate - I assume you speak only about the english-speaking part of it.
And eventually, you will be delighted to know that I'm a recognized modeller !
Those people saying "but I'm a good professionnal " are usually in their very first years in the business - and remember, in some majors, it's close to ten years to become a Captain, so in that not-so challenging environment, it's quite tempting to get distracted with deviations.
Some years ago on a major TV Channel, a human being was interviewed (in full US Navy uniform!) while doing what they call his "coming out". He was presenting himself to the good american public as a fighter pilot. Looking more closely to the subject, it appeared that he was only a navigator on A6 - so the behaviour became more appropriate.
When you say the western world is more tolerant, try to be a little bit more accurate - I assume you speak only about the english-speaking part of it.
And eventually, you will be delighted to know that I'm a recognized modeller !
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South Coast, you're obviously right in that every person is entitled to his or her opinion. However, when your opinion is based on arguments that are long-proven to be untrue, and you swing that opinion around and hurt other people (whether you intend to or not), it's a whole different ballgame.
If I were to be of the opinion that all people with brown eyes are dumb and should be stoned to death because they are inferior to people with blue eyes, then I can have that opinion, but it is not based on facts and would in fact hurt people's feelings.
Having flown with gay captains (being straight myself), I truly have not noticed the slightest lack of competence, in any area.
I also frequently fly with straight colleagues who spend the entire flight talking about their sexual conquerings and adventures. Promiscuity is certainly present in our world, especially if you have lots of layovers in outstations.
So the bla-di-bla generalizations should end here. Get with it:
- Gays are not inferior people
- Gays are not gay by choice or got the 'virus' from someone else
- You cannot get HIV by touch or even kissing
- Gays are not by definition more promiscuous than straight people. Heck, we straighties outnumber them by 9 to 1.
What disgusts me is any person who deems himself superior to ANY other person in this world.
If I were to be of the opinion that all people with brown eyes are dumb and should be stoned to death because they are inferior to people with blue eyes, then I can have that opinion, but it is not based on facts and would in fact hurt people's feelings.
Having flown with gay captains (being straight myself), I truly have not noticed the slightest lack of competence, in any area.
I also frequently fly with straight colleagues who spend the entire flight talking about their sexual conquerings and adventures. Promiscuity is certainly present in our world, especially if you have lots of layovers in outstations.
So the bla-di-bla generalizations should end here. Get with it:
- Gays are not inferior people
- Gays are not gay by choice or got the 'virus' from someone else
- You cannot get HIV by touch or even kissing
- Gays are not by definition more promiscuous than straight people. Heck, we straighties outnumber them by 9 to 1.
What disgusts me is any person who deems himself superior to ANY other person in this world.
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Iz, I think you have misunderstood South Coast's post. Nowhere did he suggest that homosexuals (or any other group) were inferior, nor did he imply or state that he felt himself to be superior. All he did was express the perfectly reasonable point that it is not compulsory for everyone to hold the same opinion on the morality of homosexuality. After all, many religious organisations regard homosexuality as immoral and incompatible with their principles. You are entitled to disagree with them, and express your disagreement. South Coast didn't even express his own opinion; merely suggesting that it is perfectly acceptable to hold a contrary point of view to most of those expressed here.
To use your allegory, while brown-eyed people may be perfectly capable, I don't have to like them, or have them in my private club. You can disagree with me, but you can't force me to change my opinion, even if the fact that I hold that opinion upsets you. Fortunately, political correctness has not infiltrated society far enough to dictate our opinions - yet. Long may it remain so.
Scroggs
To use your allegory, while brown-eyed people may be perfectly capable, I don't have to like them, or have them in my private club. You can disagree with me, but you can't force me to change my opinion, even if the fact that I hold that opinion upsets you. Fortunately, political correctness has not infiltrated society far enough to dictate our opinions - yet. Long may it remain so.
Scroggs
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thanks scroggs, but i will answer this one myself.
iz...
i have a good friend who is gay, and i have flown with him as my captain and also with him as my f/o...fine, no problems good fun and great crm.
we are friends, i dont agree with his choice in life, but i accept him for it and that is that.
i dont understand your statement.
quote:
However, when your opinion is based on arguments that are long-proven to be untrue, and you swing that opinion around and hurt other people (whether you intend to or not), it's a whole different ballgame.
what arguement, and what is untrue?
what opinion am i swinging round?
iz...
i have a good friend who is gay, and i have flown with him as my captain and also with him as my f/o...fine, no problems good fun and great crm.
we are friends, i dont agree with his choice in life, but i accept him for it and that is that.
i dont understand your statement.
quote:
However, when your opinion is based on arguments that are long-proven to be untrue, and you swing that opinion around and hurt other people (whether you intend to or not), it's a whole different ballgame.
what arguement, and what is untrue?
what opinion am i swinging round?
