DGR, AFP are reporting lithium batteries as part of the cargo. It is reported in the thread above.

DGR , respectfully , when something in your safe , earth based office could go BOOM and kill you and your desk and chair I am sure you would want that item removed too. We don`t care how it`s packed , just get it off the damn aircraft.

Correct, so retrofitting the main deck with active fire extinguishing equipment will most probably not solve the problem for a runaway battery fire while at the same time the current fire suppression equipment works satisfactory for all other fires.

IF (!) an uncontrollable battery fire indeed was the cause of this accident, then IMHO perhaps the handling, storage, packaging and transporting of electronic devices with Lithium batteries should be reviewed, not the fire fighting/suppression equipment.

The Ap is reporting that the captian yelled fire. Is that enough evidence of a fire?

Official: Pilot on crashed South Korean cargo plane reported fire in final moments

By Associated Press, Published: July*27 | Updated: Thursday, July*28, 3:33*AM

SEOUL, South Korea — A pilot aboard an Asiana Airlines cargo plane that crashed Thursday in waters off a southern South Korean resort island reported a fire just before losing contact with air traffic workers, an official said.

The pilot yelled “Cargo fire!” and “Emergency!” about 10 minutes before the plane disappeared from radar screens, according to an air traffic official who declined to be named because the investigation was ongoing.


Official: Pilot on crashed South Korean cargo plane reported fire in final moments - The Washington Post

ditch
 

Sad news.

If it turns out to be a replay of the UPS6 crash, it means we have not learned from it - a lost opportunity.

A thought; if you have a true cargofire (not a false warning, but with real noticeable smoke), the airplane is a write off from that very moment. Even if you land it within minutes, it will almost certainly burn out.

So there's no need to save the plane, just it's occupants.

If there's not an airport in the immediate vicinity, put it on any flat piece of land or ditch it.

17 minutes is the average survivable time with a cargo or cabin fire. Anything over that and you're on borrowed time.

"Put it on a flat piece of land or ditch it."
 

Have to agree with Mariner. Ditch it as quickly as possible. In fact, since the Hudson river splash, ditching (both time available and minimum time available) has been included in our cyclical sim program.

Maggot

Well, ditching could be an option, but don't forget that land on a river during daylight with nice weather is one thing, ditching a B747 into Pacific on the dark and with smoke in the cockpit is completely different, little chance of surviving...

You have 15-17 minutes
 

After having read the available albeit limited information so far,

the following relies on memory so those of you with charts may have more accurate distances.

1. They were in contact with Shanghai Control when the fire was detected.

2. This means they were past FIR Boundary waypoint LAMEN. LAMEN is 150 nm from ZSPD ( Shanghai - Pudong )

3. Even if they were exactly at LAMEN they were 210 nm ( via airways) to RKPC (Jeju)

4. Therefore it seems they did not divert to the nearest airport - no idea of WX/ NOTAMS at the relevant airports.

5. They reported control problems at 7600' i.e. Less than 5 mins to landing in an emergency. I haven't flown the B744 in years but I remember some control cables run along the roof of the cargo compartment.

6. I acknowledge that emergency diversions into mainland China are not an attractive proposition and that Jeju was an online and probably maintenance base for OZ but IF(!) the above assumptions are true then once again all these cargo fire incidents say that you must have the airplane on the ground or water in 15-17 mins..

7. Not trying to to be a Monday morning quarter back and second guess the Captain as I wasn't there. Condolences to the families

Sully was very very lucky, I reckon the odds of surviving ditching at night on open water are pretty slim actually.. I say ban Lithium now and wait for the investigation.

Had a chat with a few colleagues. Ditching an aircraft in the middle of the Atlantic or the Pacific is almost a death sentence. If you even survive the ditching, you will now face the prospect of drowning or freezing or starving in the middle of the huge ocean.

We threw around some ideas and one of the ideas was to stay up high, depressurize the aircraft (if main deck fire, as per the checklist), and PRAY that the fire will go out from lack of oxygen. Like I said, in the middle of the ocean, you must be very lucky to have an airfield within 17 minutes. Even then, Asiana lost contact within 11 minutes.

Starving???

I tend to agree if you're dealing with an uncontrollable (battery related?) fire, but how do you know whether you're dealing with a 'normal' fire or an uncontrollable battery fire when a fire warning sounds?

Investigating the cause of the fire (uncontrollable battery fire or not), decision making, finding suitable terrain/water and subsequent ditching from a normal 744 cruising level within 17 minutes would be totally unrealistic IMHO.

Well yeah, I am gonna grab that bottle of mineral water before jumping off! :ok:

I wonder if the presence of a suitably trained loadmaster would make any difference to a main deck lithium fire - if he got to it quick enough.

Thoughts?

If it was lithium batteries then they must go the same way as chemical oxygen generators.

Put your old laptop- or mobile battery on a BBQ and see what happens. It's a hellfire - better than magnesium.

Check this FAA-Demo please:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcd34tt8YPU:eek:

I'm guessing they were 7600' on decent during their emergency diversion to Jeju. Perhaps if they had kept going to Shanghai they would have already been on the ground if the assumptions in my previous post were correct.

Sounds like the UPS. As you descend into thicker air the fire turns violent.

overmars....
 

There were no "death sentences" for any of the USAir A320 occupants who had ditched in the Hudson river. Some people didn't even get their feet wet.

The B747s that I'm flying are equipped with life rafts. With today's GPS position accuracy, rescue services would find your ELT equipped, bobbing life raft before you'd "starve to death."

During an over ocean uncontrolled fire I will not pray; I will make a controlled ditching after 15min emergency descent while I can still read some instruments ...BEFORE being completely smoked out and subject to an uncontrolled crash. :ooh: