Evergreen Sues Boeing
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Boeing considered opening a second assembly line for the jet in California, Kansas, North Carolina and Texas. South Carolina officials offered Boeing $450 million in tax incentives in exchange for the promise of creating up to 3,800 jobs.
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Sounds to me like boeing does not care about the lawsuit, evergreen will probably never get what they are sueing for and boeing gets to offset any losses with evergreen by profiting with atlas (well, the money they save giving the contract to atlas will eventually pay their debt to them for the breach of contract they are in by not delivering on the 748 on time).
Immagine the money Atlas may be saving if they are struggeling to keep their workforce busy (given this as a possible scenario). It becomes an incestual relationship.
Never liked evergreen anyways, surprized the scumbags are still in business.
Immagine the money Atlas may be saving if they are struggeling to keep their workforce busy (given this as a possible scenario). It becomes an incestual relationship.
Never liked evergreen anyways, surprized the scumbags are still in business.
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You deserve to be taken out behind the woodshed
muduckace
Sounds to me like boeing does not care about the lawsuit, evergreen will probably never get what they are sueing for and boeing gets to offset any losses with evergreen by profiting with atlas (well, the money they save giving the contract to atlas will eventually pay their debt to them for the breach of contract they are in by not delivering on the 748 on time).
Immagine the money Atlas may be saving if they are struggeling to keep their workforce busy (given this as a possible scenario). It becomes an incestual relationship.
Never liked evergreen anyways, surprized the scumbags are still in business.
Sounds to me like boeing does not care about the lawsuit, evergreen will probably never get what they are sueing for and boeing gets to offset any losses with evergreen by profiting with atlas (well, the money they save giving the contract to atlas will eventually pay their debt to them for the breach of contract they are in by not delivering on the 748 on time).
Immagine the money Atlas may be saving if they are struggeling to keep their workforce busy (given this as a possible scenario). It becomes an incestual relationship.
Never liked evergreen anyways, surprized the scumbags are still in business.
As far as Atlas "Struggling" to keep our pilots working, not only did we just recall all furloughed pilots, but we have just started hiring for 3 classes on the 400. You need to learn to #1 spell or use the spell check at least, (you are worse than sidman) #2 think I'll pass this on to Bubba and see if we can arrange a meeting of the two of you at the 5 towns.
What an absolute dick head you are to lambaste a group of fly boy's like that.
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Well atleast he is worse than me 
Let me know if you can get Bubba to meet with him I would love to be there for that.
There are plenty of good (non scumbag) people that work for Evergreen..
Thanks Fr8dog!!
Let me know if you can get Bubba to meet with him I would love to be there for that. There are plenty of good (non scumbag) people that work for Evergreen..
Thanks Fr8dog!!
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FR8DOG
First of all, I called Evergreen a ****ty company, no reflection upon those who fix and fly the planes. Secondly your weak attempt at dominating a thread by side slaming it on spelling (i will not spell check for your pleasure child) is weak.
Thirdly, I stated a possible scenario as to why an in incestuous relationship between boeing and atlas is in the works. Speculate or give facts supporting or opposing my speculation.
Clean your act up a bit, your obvious angry drivle is tiresom and should not be tolerated.
I can't spell and you have a hard time comprehending, my problem can be fixed with a computer, yours may have no fix.
Thirdly, I stated a possible scenario as to why an in incestuous relationship between boeing and atlas is in the works. Speculate or give facts supporting or opposing my speculation.
Clean your act up a bit, your obvious angry drivle is tiresom and should not be tolerated.
I can't spell and you have a hard time comprehending, my problem can be fixed with a computer, yours may have no fix.
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Aerospace News
Details from Boeing Dreamlifter lawsuit
Details from Boeing Dreamlifter lawsuit
Boeing Dreamlifter. (Boeing)
Following up on Thursday's short report that Oregon's Evergreen International Airlines had sued Boeing over the cancellation of its contract to operate the Dreamlifter, here are some details from the complaint.
"Boeing committed bad faith and breached its contractual promises to conduct its business fairly, impartially and in an ethical and proper manner," Evergreen alleged in the complaint, filed Thursday in U.S. District Court in Seattle. "Boeing's bad faith and breach of contract have caused lost profits to Evergreen in excess of $175 million."
Boeing declined to comment Friday.
Boeing granted Evergreen the contract for the Dreamlifter, which transports parts for the 787 Dreamliner, in 2005. The initial five-year contract was set to automatically renew for another five years (with two more five-year options after that) except in certain specific circumstances.
The lawsuit said: "Evergreen received notification that Boeing was 'investigating other options' in 'light of current business realities.'"
In fact, Boeing started secretly negotiating with Atlas Air Inc., to transfer the contract to Atlas as compensation for delays in the 747-8 Freighters Atlas has on order, Evergreen said in the complaint. "Boeing dropped Ever
green in favor of Atlas to avert the multimillion dollar disaster that was looming over the 747-8 program."
Atlas has 12 747-8 Freighter on order, with options for another 14, Evergreen noted in the lawsuit. "A Boeing employee informed an Evergreen employee that Boeing's liability for penalties to Atlas approached $1 billion. By at least October 2009, Atlas had made a claim with Boeing for refunds resulting from Boeing's failure to meet delivery guarantees to Atlas."
While either party could cancel the contract, "the right was subject to both and express and implied covenant of good faith and fair dealing," Evergreen said in the complaint. "Accordingly, based on the express language of the contract, Evergreen reasonably expected that, absent bad faith conduct on Boeing's part or cause for default by Evergreen, the (Dreamlifter) contract would last 20 years based upon 'automatic,' five-year, renewals of the (Dreamlifter) contract."
Evergreen said Boeing also:
Breached contractual duties by misleading it into providing confidential and proprietary internal reports that Boeing passed on to Atlas;
Has demanded that Evergreen help transfer the program to Atlas, despite admitting that Evergreen's contract has no such obligation;
Has demanded that Evergreen provide Boeing and Atlas with "an enormous volume of highly confidential, proprietary, and trade secret information, a demand to which no reasonable company would capitulate."
Two years of delays in Boeing's 787 program also hurt Evergreen, which was paid based on actual flight hours but incurred "considerable expense" for Dreamlifter readiness, according to the complaint.
In fact, the switch to Atlas raises risks to the 787 program, Evergreen said in the lawsuit. "Evergreen is the only company in the world with any experience operating, maintaining, and performing the ground handling for the Dreamlifter airplane. Having already experience years for delay, by switching to Atlas, Boeing is jeopardizing the 787 program."
Boeing never comments publicly to such litigation, spokesman Dean Tougas said Friday. "We'll review the litigation and we'll respond through the appropriate legal channel."
Asked specifically about the idea that Boeing switched the contract as a payoff for 747-8 Freighter delays, he said: "We're not going to comment on our contractual dealings with our suppliers."
Posted by Aubrey Cohen at April 2, 2010 11:36 a.m.
· Return to Details from Boeing Dreamlifter lawsuit
Details from Boeing Dreamlifter lawsuit
Details from Boeing Dreamlifter lawsuit
Boeing Dreamlifter. (Boeing)
Following up on Thursday's short report that Oregon's Evergreen International Airlines had sued Boeing over the cancellation of its contract to operate the Dreamlifter, here are some details from the complaint.
"Boeing committed bad faith and breached its contractual promises to conduct its business fairly, impartially and in an ethical and proper manner," Evergreen alleged in the complaint, filed Thursday in U.S. District Court in Seattle. "Boeing's bad faith and breach of contract have caused lost profits to Evergreen in excess of $175 million."
Boeing declined to comment Friday.
Boeing granted Evergreen the contract for the Dreamlifter, which transports parts for the 787 Dreamliner, in 2005. The initial five-year contract was set to automatically renew for another five years (with two more five-year options after that) except in certain specific circumstances.
The lawsuit said: "Evergreen received notification that Boeing was 'investigating other options' in 'light of current business realities.'"
In fact, Boeing started secretly negotiating with Atlas Air Inc., to transfer the contract to Atlas as compensation for delays in the 747-8 Freighters Atlas has on order, Evergreen said in the complaint. "Boeing dropped Ever
green in favor of Atlas to avert the multimillion dollar disaster that was looming over the 747-8 program."
Atlas has 12 747-8 Freighter on order, with options for another 14, Evergreen noted in the lawsuit. "A Boeing employee informed an Evergreen employee that Boeing's liability for penalties to Atlas approached $1 billion. By at least October 2009, Atlas had made a claim with Boeing for refunds resulting from Boeing's failure to meet delivery guarantees to Atlas."
While either party could cancel the contract, "the right was subject to both and express and implied covenant of good faith and fair dealing," Evergreen said in the complaint. "Accordingly, based on the express language of the contract, Evergreen reasonably expected that, absent bad faith conduct on Boeing's part or cause for default by Evergreen, the (Dreamlifter) contract would last 20 years based upon 'automatic,' five-year, renewals of the (Dreamlifter) contract."
Evergreen said Boeing also:
Breached contractual duties by misleading it into providing confidential and proprietary internal reports that Boeing passed on to Atlas;
Has demanded that Evergreen help transfer the program to Atlas, despite admitting that Evergreen's contract has no such obligation;
Has demanded that Evergreen provide Boeing and Atlas with "an enormous volume of highly confidential, proprietary, and trade secret information, a demand to which no reasonable company would capitulate."
Two years of delays in Boeing's 787 program also hurt Evergreen, which was paid based on actual flight hours but incurred "considerable expense" for Dreamlifter readiness, according to the complaint.
In fact, the switch to Atlas raises risks to the 787 program, Evergreen said in the lawsuit. "Evergreen is the only company in the world with any experience operating, maintaining, and performing the ground handling for the Dreamlifter airplane. Having already experience years for delay, by switching to Atlas, Boeing is jeopardizing the 787 program."
Boeing never comments publicly to such litigation, spokesman Dean Tougas said Friday. "We'll review the litigation and we'll respond through the appropriate legal channel."
Asked specifically about the idea that Boeing switched the contract as a payoff for 747-8 Freighter delays, he said: "We're not going to comment on our contractual dealings with our suppliers."
Posted by Aubrey Cohen at April 2, 2010 11:36 a.m.
· Return to Details from Boeing Dreamlifter lawsuit
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If EIA were able to re-bid and lost than that would be OK..They were not given a chance to re-bid the contract and the contract was given to Atlas.
The contract was for 20 years with reviews every 5 years. Boeing told EIA that everything was OK so don't worry. Then they said no chance for re-bid have a nice day. We all bid on the contract 5 years ago and EIA won. If Boeing wanted to have a re-bid they should have opened it up to everyone who bid on it the first time.
I have alot of good friend at Atlas and I know you guys will do a good job with the contract. But if Atlas had the contract and 5 years down the road Boeing took it away. I think Atlas would want something for the effort.
If we bid and lost then sued, we would be BAD LOOSERS. EIA may or maynot get anything but you or I don't know that.
Atlas guys I wish you the best of luck with the LCF..I know you guys will do a good job as you always do. I hope everyone had a happy Easter.
The contract was for 20 years with reviews every 5 years. Boeing told EIA that everything was OK so don't worry. Then they said no chance for re-bid have a nice day. We all bid on the contract 5 years ago and EIA won. If Boeing wanted to have a re-bid they should have opened it up to everyone who bid on it the first time.
I have alot of good friend at Atlas and I know you guys will do a good job with the contract. But if Atlas had the contract and 5 years down the road Boeing took it away. I think Atlas would want something for the effort.
If we bid and lost then sued, we would be BAD LOOSERS. EIA may or maynot get anything but you or I don't know that.
Atlas guys I wish you the best of luck with the LCF..I know you guys will do a good job as you always do. I hope everyone had a happy Easter.
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Boeing is just like any other ACMI (or in this case CMI) customer, Here today, and we'll see about tomorrow. If Boeing pulls the plug in 5 years you won't hear so much as a whimper as has been the case countless times with other customers. These contracts come and go, it's the nature of the business.
Now, suing a customer because they did not renew with you, not exactly a good tactic if you want to rebid it somewhere in the future. And, no sour grapes required (or in this case lawsuit), just move on to the next gig.
Now if Evergreen wants to place an order for 26 (12 firm, 14 options) for 747-8F's I'm sure that might help them in 5 years minus a lawsuit.
Now, suing a customer because they did not renew with you, not exactly a good tactic if you want to rebid it somewhere in the future. And, no sour grapes required (or in this case lawsuit), just move on to the next gig.
Now if Evergreen wants to place an order for 26 (12 firm, 14 options) for 747-8F's I'm sure that might help them in 5 years minus a lawsuit.
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Comprehension
muduckace
“ Sounds to me like boeing does not care about the lawsuit, evergreen will probably never get what they are sueing for and boeing gets to offset any losses with evergreen by profiting with atlas (well, the money they save giving the contract to atlas will eventually pay their debt to them for the breach of contract they are in by not delivering on the 748 on time)”.
Immagine the money Atlas may be saving if they are struggeling to keep their workforce busy (given this as a possible scenario). It becomes an incestual relationship.
“First of all, I called Evergreen a ****ty company, no reflection upon those who fix and fly the planes”.
“Never liked evergreen anyways, surprized the scumbags are still in business”
I don’t see where you just accused the Company here.
Secondly your weak attempt at dominating a thread by side slaming it on spelling (i will not spell check for your pleasure child) is weak.
Let’s see here, seuing, Immagine, struggeling, incestual, surprized, drivle, tiresom. If your age of 35 is correct on your header, I was flying freight in a beat up D-18 5 years before you were born. So a child defiantly I am not. I do however take pride in my work and what I write on a public forum.
Thirdly, I stated a possible scenario as to why an in incestuous relationship between boeing and atlas is in the works. Speculate or give facts supporting or opposing my speculation.
This one I will give you, it is speculation.
Clean your act up a bit, your obvious angry drivle is tiresom and should not be tolerated.
Tolerated by whom?
I can't spell and you have a hard time comprehending, my problem can be fixed with a computer, yours may have no fix.
I do not believe that I am the one with the comprehension problem here, I have read what you posted, and see what you have written. You may have intended to express other opinions here but this is what you have written.
At least Sidman has a sense of humor!
FR8
“ Sounds to me like boeing does not care about the lawsuit, evergreen will probably never get what they are sueing for and boeing gets to offset any losses with evergreen by profiting with atlas (well, the money they save giving the contract to atlas will eventually pay their debt to them for the breach of contract they are in by not delivering on the 748 on time)”.
Immagine the money Atlas may be saving if they are struggeling to keep their workforce busy (given this as a possible scenario). It becomes an incestual relationship.
“First of all, I called Evergreen a ****ty company, no reflection upon those who fix and fly the planes”.
“Never liked evergreen anyways, surprized the scumbags are still in business”
I don’t see where you just accused the Company here.
Secondly your weak attempt at dominating a thread by side slaming it on spelling (i will not spell check for your pleasure child) is weak.
Let’s see here, seuing, Immagine, struggeling, incestual, surprized, drivle, tiresom. If your age of 35 is correct on your header, I was flying freight in a beat up D-18 5 years before you were born. So a child defiantly I am not. I do however take pride in my work and what I write on a public forum.
Thirdly, I stated a possible scenario as to why an in incestuous relationship between boeing and atlas is in the works. Speculate or give facts supporting or opposing my speculation.
This one I will give you, it is speculation.
Clean your act up a bit, your obvious angry drivle is tiresom and should not be tolerated.
Tolerated by whom?
I can't spell and you have a hard time comprehending, my problem can be fixed with a computer, yours may have no fix.
I do not believe that I am the one with the comprehension problem here, I have read what you posted, and see what you have written. You may have intended to express other opinions here but this is what you have written.
At least Sidman has a sense of humor!
FR8
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The average line pilot isn't the problem and as line pilots we really can't tell our management teams what to do. Both the pilot groups at Evergeen and Atlas are a great bunch of people. Both can and have proven that they can fly airplanes.
The way I see it; is that each pilot group wants to fly the airplanes and will defend their own pilot group.
Lets have a beer at the bar together and remember that we fly airplanes and really have no control of who has the contract or even why things happen.
Cheers!
The way I see it; is that each pilot group wants to fly the airplanes and will defend their own pilot group.
Lets have a beer at the bar together and remember that we fly airplanes and really have no control of who has the contract or even why things happen.
Cheers!
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Is this a joke?
Tediek
As Evergreen also performs maintenance on the LCF's who takes that part over?
As Evergreen also performs maintenance on the LCF's who takes that part over?
You are kidding here right? If Atlas is going to operate the aircraft, and Atlas already maintains 21 400's who do you think might do the maintenance on the LCF's ?
FR8
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Sounds like sour grapes to me!
3pointlanding
Two bottom feeders going at it. Gotta love it! Great people, ****ty companies.
Two bottom feeders going at it. Gotta love it! Great people, ****ty companies.
That would be Atlas Air, the third largest cargo carrier in the world? Unless you work for FedEx or UPS I am thinking sour grapes here. Atlas is hiring and UPS furloughing.
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That would be Atlas Air, the third largest cargo carrier in the world? Unless you work for FedEx or UPS I am thinking sour grapes here. Atlas is hiring and UPS furloughing.
Cheers