Increased flying in EU for US pilots
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Tell us a little bit more about it...
Don't blame us for your lacks.
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Just FYI US has a lot of European pilots and nobody give them ****. I believe there are many US pilots in Europe also. People have a duty to find a place where they feel good or where they can get a job. I don't see americans complaining about european pilots flying here but I see a lot of european whining about US pilots overthere. Those american bastards are annoying anybody now. But what am I talking about americans and europeans getting on each other nerves? How friendly is a french or an italian or a british with a worker from Poland, Bulgaria etc? Should I believe there are only kisses and hugs between you guys ? Not if I open any european newspaper?
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I've been to Romania last week actually, and during last few years I visited all EastEuropean states. Some of the places have their problems, but I've seen much worse places in South Dakota, Nevada and Alaska, so what?
Are you talking about Europeans holding FAA license and green card (or dual national) flying in the States? That's all right. I don't mind at all Americans coming here, getting JAR lincese, working permit and doing their job. However what is the subject of this topic is American pilots, flying N-registered airplanes, with FAA licenses, paying both personal and corporate taxes in the States, doing an air service in EU.
Just FYI US has a lot of European pilots
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However what is the subject of this topic is American pilots, flying N-registered airplanes, with FAA licenses, paying both personal and corporate taxes in the States, doing an air service in EU.
There are no N registered airplanes flying point to point in France or point to point in the UK. They are possibly revenue flying between different countries of the EU which is legal according to the treaties signed during the Chicago accords and Bermuda I and II. Your nations (at the time}were signatories on those treaties.
And I am sure that those N registered airplanes and their companies are charged an overflight fee and landing fee, not by the EU, but by the individual country that they fly over or land in. True?
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I don't want this to become a pissing contest which is which. Every side of the ponds has its goods and bads. The reason I got involved in this thread is because lately I see a lot of anti-americanism. Just because we have some economical issues right now, it doesn't mean everyone can take a dump in our background. Talking about economy I just want to advise all economies are connected. If here goes wrong everyone else will follow sooner or later. If a country will not get affected is because that country has no economy.
From aviation jobs point of view US market is over saturated with pilots. Many companies went belly up and that has created many jobless pilots. I believe( I am not sure) we have over 350000 ATP holders. If you guys in Europe or any other place around the world have a pilot shortage, what's wrong with US pilots working on those places? When we had a shortage in any field, we opened our doors to anybody. Even now, thousands of computer geeks from India are coming, and nobody is yelling bloody murder.
We have our heavy cargo taken over by germans. BAX is kind of the only one controlling that business. DHL was a major player in cargo. Lufthansa aircrafts(and not only) can be seen on all majors US airports. Every american company has a large number of employees with foreign accents. Our TV shows are run by britts. In Miami english is a foreign language. Everyone who steps in this country automatically is considered american and has the same rights like any local. No voting though. If you get kicked out of your country and you ask us for help we will welcome you and if you have any merit we will make you american. Regarding your question about N registered aircraft I told you to ask the european owners. They must have some good reasons to keep the planes N registered. Clear skies brother. Don't worry we are in this sh&*t together.
From aviation jobs point of view US market is over saturated with pilots. Many companies went belly up and that has created many jobless pilots. I believe( I am not sure) we have over 350000 ATP holders. If you guys in Europe or any other place around the world have a pilot shortage, what's wrong with US pilots working on those places? When we had a shortage in any field, we opened our doors to anybody. Even now, thousands of computer geeks from India are coming, and nobody is yelling bloody murder.
We have our heavy cargo taken over by germans. BAX is kind of the only one controlling that business. DHL was a major player in cargo. Lufthansa aircrafts(and not only) can be seen on all majors US airports. Every american company has a large number of employees with foreign accents. Our TV shows are run by britts. In Miami english is a foreign language. Everyone who steps in this country automatically is considered american and has the same rights like any local. No voting though. If you get kicked out of your country and you ask us for help we will welcome you and if you have any merit we will make you american. Regarding your question about N registered aircraft I told you to ask the european owners. They must have some good reasons to keep the planes N registered. Clear skies brother. Don't worry we are in this sh&*t together.
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I could not care less if US pilots come to Europe and fly as long as they have the appropriate work permits for Schengen area countries, UK or other EU states that they operate in. Should they be based in the Schengen area they are also required to obtain a residency permit, be liable for taxes and other wonderful things.
I could not care less what the Americans do as long as they don't take a SINGLE job away from a pilot from any of the EU countries or the European Economical Area, unless they meet the right to work and abode requirements and in that case the whole discussion is meaningless.
Unions and companies alike in Europe need to take strong action against the loss of jobs and work in Europe before it becomes too late. Take the issue up with your MP in UK or your representative in your home country as well as those sitting in Brussels and Starsbourg in EU parliament. I certainly have written to all, my parliament representative the EU parliament members from my country and our ALPA equivalent including the copy of this thread. Complain to your immigration, border guards about foreign crews operating without proper documents and rights (Express One learned the meaning of "Right to work" the hard way) in and out of EU.
It is totally useless to argue the point here, wont do any good. If one wants to save the jobs it's time for some hard line action.
I could not care less what the Americans do as long as they don't take a SINGLE job away from a pilot from any of the EU countries or the European Economical Area, unless they meet the right to work and abode requirements and in that case the whole discussion is meaningless.
Unions and companies alike in Europe need to take strong action against the loss of jobs and work in Europe before it becomes too late. Take the issue up with your MP in UK or your representative in your home country as well as those sitting in Brussels and Starsbourg in EU parliament. I certainly have written to all, my parliament representative the EU parliament members from my country and our ALPA equivalent including the copy of this thread. Complain to your immigration, border guards about foreign crews operating without proper documents and rights (Express One learned the meaning of "Right to work" the hard way) in and out of EU.
It is totally useless to argue the point here, wont do any good. If one wants to save the jobs it's time for some hard line action.
Last edited by Atlanta-Driver; 19th Dec 2008 at 20:53.
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I have to agree with Atlanta Driver. The only function of this thread is to illustrate the various views out there without necessarily identifying the source of those views.
If we feel strongly about these issues we must raise our concerns with those agencies who can actually do something about them. It will take about as long as writing a post for this thread.
IMHO any agreement between the EU and US aircrew licencing regions must be 100% reciprocal. That also goes for Australian and New Zealand licence holders. I won’t even get into the argument of why this should be so, it’s obviously the only fair solution. In case it is of any interest, I speak as someone who holds both US and UK passports and FAA and JAA ATPLs.
Links:
To find and write to your MP and MEP: Click here
Directorate-General Energy and Transport (EU) contact page: Click here
If we do nothing we deserve what we get.
Kirk out.....
If we feel strongly about these issues we must raise our concerns with those agencies who can actually do something about them. It will take about as long as writing a post for this thread.
IMHO any agreement between the EU and US aircrew licencing regions must be 100% reciprocal. That also goes for Australian and New Zealand licence holders. I won’t even get into the argument of why this should be so, it’s obviously the only fair solution. In case it is of any interest, I speak as someone who holds both US and UK passports and FAA and JAA ATPLs.
Links:
To find and write to your MP and MEP: Click here
Directorate-General Energy and Transport (EU) contact page: Click here
If we do nothing we deserve what we get.
Kirk out.....
